PC Alpha 18 Dev Diary!!

[khzmusik]

What would interest me here is whether there are limitations here so that a brown weapon might be better at damage than a yellow one but never better than an orange one, for example.

I'm more interested to know if the stats balance out.

An example: you have two stats, damage and accuracy, and a total stats range of 1 to X. For brown items, X is 100, for yellow items, X is 150. But in both cases, if one goes up, the other goes down.

So, you could have a brown weapon with damage of 75, but then accuracy would be 25. You could have a yellow weapon where damage is 70, making it "worse" than the brown weapon, but its accuracy would then be 80. So, given all stats, it would still be a much better weapon.

That would keep the relative balance between different weapon grades IMHO. It might be too nit-picky or hard to understand though. It might also be too much bother to code if the stats have different ranges.

 

[NukemDed]

So far but it feels backwards to me or displays the wrong color.

lol!

wait for it, wait for it....

 

[Guppycur]

So... A little disappointed... Got off the plane in Hawaii with my 7days shirt and wasn't immediately flocked by fans of the game.

Marketing opportunity here.

(See y'all in 10 days)

 

[The Gronk]

I think so. Probably more range and damage to compensate.

You might want to do a little research on that.

Longbows and crossbows have many differences but when it comes to range and power they're pretty evenly matched.

The longbow should be harder to aim without putting points in the archery skill and drain more stamina when drawn. This is balanced by the crossbows terrible rate of fire.

 

[Kalex]

So far but it feels backwards to me or displays the wrong color.

Because it is ass-backwards compared to every other game out there and confuses the hell out of players who are used to green = better and red = worse.

 

[x.Sharky.x]

Hey madmole - why would the messiah perk govern the quality of shotguns I craft? Wouldn't that just be a perk for using the weapon instead? You see, I play with a friend and we split out perks to compliment each other - I'm mainly the resource gatherer & crafter. He does other perks like medicine, gardening and science etc.

If we both now have to get into crafting and then perk up in our desired weapons, it's going to be tediously annoying - non? He goes main 7.62 type guns while I stick to shotty and pistol. Again, complementing resource usage.

I might be missing something but this concerned me and find would kinda twist the game in a different direction (one we wouldn't like). We also play with group of friends at time and we all sorta share our perks - dedicating into different areas to split tasks, it's fun.

Cheers

 

[Trankitas]

So far but it feels backwards to me or displays the wrong color.

Yes! It's a little bit confusing to use, but i don't know how it could be better, so I shut up about it.

 

[khzmusik]

Hey madmole - why would the messiah perk govern the quality of shotguns I craft? Wouldn't that just be a perk for using the weapon instead? You see, I play with a friend and we split out perks to compliment each other - I'm mainly the resource gatherer & crafter. He does other perks like medicine, gardening and science etc.
If we both now have to get into crafting and then perk up in our desired weapons, it's going to be tediously annoying - non? He goes main 7.62 type guns while I stick to shotty and pistol. Again, complementing resource usage.

I might be missing something but this concerned me and find would kinda twist the game in a different direction (one we wouldn't like). We also play with group of friends at time and we all sorta share our perks - dedicating into different areas to split tasks, it's fun.

Cheers

I'm not sure I fully understand the complaint, but I think you might be misinterpreting what MM said.

The shotgun messiah perk would not only govern crafting quality. You'd still have other bonuses like reload speed and accuracy, and those wouldn't be shared among the squad (just like how it is now).

In your situation, you'd perk into shotgun messiah and your friend would perk into rifles, and if they want a higher quality shotgun, you'd just make one for them. Pretty much the same as if one person perked into crafting and the other didn't. It's just that crafting quality would no longer be governed by one single perk.

 

[madmole]

So... A little disappointed... Got off the plane in Hawaii with my 7days shirt and wasn't immediately flocked by fans of the game.
Marketing opportunity here.

(See y'all in 10 days)

Enjoy. Being in the middle of the ocean they were probably isolated from the zombie outbreak.

 

[madmole]

You might want to do a little research on that.
Longbows and crossbows have many differences but when it comes to range and power they're pretty evenly matched.

The longbow should be harder to aim without putting points in the archery skill and drain more stamina when drawn. This is balanced by the crossbows terrible rate of fire.

I didn't put much thought into it, but what you suggest would work, but people might have a cow if drawing the bow took stamina, but I like the idea of it. Skyrim's does.

 

[Demonoid74]

Go shooting a 60lb draw recurve bow all day and see how your arms and shoulders feel!

I definitely would like it to drain stamina

 

[madmole]

Hey madmole - why would the messiah perk govern the quality of shotguns I craft? Wouldn't that just be a perk for using the weapon instead? You see, I play with a friend and we split out perks to compliment each other - I'm mainly the resource gatherer & crafter. He does other perks like medicine, gardening and science etc.
If we both now have to get into crafting and then perk up in our desired weapons, it's going to be tediously annoying - non? He goes main 7.62 type guns while I stick to shotty and pistol. Again, complementing resource usage.

I might be missing something but this concerned me and find would kinda twist the game in a different direction (one we wouldn't like). We also play with group of friends at time and we all sorta share our perks - dedicating into different areas to split tasks, it's fun.

Cheers

Why would someone unskilled with shotguns craft the better shotguns? You are the one repairing it, using it, taking it apart to clean it, etc. This allows specialization to happen and one INT guy can't be the best crafter. You don't get into crafting any more. You get into what you do. So if your a shotgun guy who uses heavy armor, you buy the shotgun perks and heavy armor perks and each rank lets you craft a better quality. You are not wasting points on some crafting skill this way and it is a no brainer to buy the perks that improve what you like to use.

In this situation you will craft your shotgun and he will craft his rifle. This build allows better specialization than any other build of the game I can't see how you wouldn't like it, everyone who uses a weapon will perk into that weapon and be able to craft a good one. Can you be the guy who crafts for everyone? Not really. But at a low level you can craft a hell of a double barrel and some really good light or heavy armor.

 

[Weazelsun]

So... A little disappointed... Got off the plane in Hawaii with my 7days shirt and wasn't immediately flocked by fans of the game.
Marketing opportunity here.

(See y'all in 10 days)

Welcome to Hawaii, hope the homeless don't ruin your trip.

 

[Weazelsun]

Enjoy. Being in the middle of the ocean they were probably isolated from the zombie outbreak.

To be honest, madmole if a real zombie apocalypse happened here, I'd be more envious of you guys on the mainland. At least you'd be able to drive/fly/ take the railroad to other states with better defense. Oh, I mean sure we do have hunters here, but in terms of a gunshops we don't have much. Hospitals? Ha! Grocery stores? Starving to death within a few weeks.

I guess the one major postitive is that we have Pearl Harbor and the other outlying islands to head to. But, the problem is that all comes down to the fact that if there was a zombie apocalypse, we rely on importing so much that regardless of the severity of such a threat. Hawaii is ♥♥♥♥'d either way. Best realistic plan is there was only ONE zombie problem, would be for the navy to cordone Hawaii and blast any ship that comes out of the area.

Ok, but now on-topic. In regards to my last post. Building is an essential part of the game, and I just worry that if a person does decide to specialize, they might be gimped in terms of building a base or gathering resources. Right? For again an example, the junk turret. I've seen some discussions as to what it should fire, and one of the ammo that has been considered is scrap iron. Obviously, yes, there are numerous ways of obtaining it (scrap iron), but the best efficient way to gather it is via investing in mining perks. Which is mining and then scrapping the raw iron.

Though, by reading the other posts. My worry is somewhat relieved. As long as a player can somehow obtain the resources necessary for either crafting bullets as a sniper build or wood to make wood frames/ spikes. Then I'll be happy.

 

[AtomicUs5000]

I didn't put much thought into it, but what you suggest would work, but people might have a cow if drawing the bow took stamina, but I like the idea of it. Skyrim's does.

OK, but if you do it all day, every day, you get stronger too. But that would be considered LBD because it's in the positive direction, right?

 

[Crater Creator]

Very few would craft a crappy one IMO, they would grind a little more and get the good one, go buy something at a trader or use one of the backup guns they have. The scaling isn't too crazy. 5 parts more per rank. Weapon crafting isn't a thing anymore IMO, loot offers the random ranges and is the best of the best. Crafting is for when you can't find what you want.

There may be alternative pathways, but it's that sense of losing something that will feel regressive - in this case, the ability to craft something from x parts. In fact, one can argue that if anything a master crafter should be able to make a weapon or armor using fewer parts, not more.

Alternatively, all players could craft at all quality levels, but for a player with no skills a high quality item costs so much in materials it's prohibitively expensive. The downside with that approach is you'd either need a zillion duplicate recipes, or a significant interface change to choose a quality before you hit the craft button.

 

[Melthe]

Everything about A18 sounds amazing. I am hoping that you will have a way of either selling or scrapping extra dyes. Right now I have almost a full storage crate of left over dyes in my base in A17.4.

 

[Aldranon]

You will never eradicate Min/Maxing though, despite the best intend of having all different options available. What is currently stopping someone from getting the bonus from all the sources. <sniped>.

Min/Maxing is just like running through the Louvre! (and you should do it at least once!)

There are sub games in running the Louvre (and min/maxing) as well.

Some never do it.

Some frown on it.

Some only do it.

If someone has fun (and doesn't hurt others), why stop them?

 

[bobross]

Go shooting a 60lb draw recurve bow all day and see how your arms and shoulders feel!
I definitely would like it to drain stamina

Did I miss the introduction of additional bows? Because I guarantee that if you're shooting a compound bow - which nobody with an option would skip in a Zombie Apolcalypse - stam drain at full draw makes no sense. That's a major part of the entire reason for compounds, so you can hold them at draw longer. I could maybe see some stam drop on basic bows, but I get rid of those as fast as I can for a good reason, and from a gameplay perspective teaching one mechanic at Tier 1 and 2 that doesn't apply at Tier 3 is likely to be confusing, even if it is accurate.

Ranges are a whole 'nother critter as well. Traditional medieval crossbows had an effective range of maybe 50 yards and a good crossbowman could get off 2 shots a minute, MAYBE 3. A longbowman - especially English longbowmen - could hit a target at upwards of 400 yards and actually injure them if they were unarmored, and could fire as many as 6 arrows a minute.

Compound bow? 500 yards, half the length, half the draw weight, easier to hold. Compound crossbow? Much the same, just slower and easier to aim. Note, those are "ranges you can hit at", not "ranges you can kill something at". If you want to do real damage, just like with longbow, you want the range more like 25-50 yards.

Popular myth is that the crossbow was hideously dangerous, but the reality is it was so because it took very little time to train crossbowmen, whereas the English had laws about how much time per day their longbowmen must practice for. Yeah, it's powerful, but so's a compound bow. You can probably get more pull weight with the compound using mechanical assists, which would mean more damage in game terms, but seriously, they're not all that different.

 

[SrslyGTFO]

I didn't put much thought into it, but what you suggest would work, but people might have a cow if drawing the bow took stamina, but I like the idea of it. Skyrim's does.

Holding a bow drawn does drain stamina in A17. So does looking down the sights of a gun, for some reason. Or, are you referring to the act of drawing the bow, not holding it drawn?