What happened to 4k maps?
- Thread starter MiTHMoN
- Start date
I've definitely had bad sessions on Valheim, and I look back on it and it wasn't enjoyable doing corpse runs. Luckily for me it's a lot easier to stay alive in 7DTD than it is in Valheim.
My point is, there's a quest distance that is far enough as to be unfun. And I think 800m is that upper distance for tier 1, 2, 3 quests. By the time you're doing tier 4's and 5's, you've probably got a motorcycle or 4x4, so it's a little more a fuel logistics thing.
That isn't specific to Navezgane or any map, just a general gameplay insight.
Well, it's not really about balancing quest rewards. I handed in a quest and the best item Rekt offered was a single magazine.
The fact is, there are only five progression methods. Six if you include player knowledge/skill.
1) Your character gains XP and levels up. That gives you skill points, more stats (health/stamina), and higher loot stage.
2) Loot, items. Finding the toilet knife/pistol, getting those mechanical parts for the wrench, etc.
3) Perk books. Some challenges are impossible (?) without eating perk books. Plus they give you solid gameplay boosts.
4) Crafting magazines. You could play the game without crafting or eating a magazine, but if you like crafting you *need* to loot magazines.
5) Quest points. The only way to increase quest points is to complete quests.
If you completely ignore questing, and later decide that you want to do a tier-6 quest, you can't unless you work through the quests. It's a reliable progression method. There's never a quest that you complete that's like "oh, even though you completed it, you don't get quest points this time". Meanwhile with looting, there are many times you loot and don't get anything you needed to progress.
If quests gave zero reward (except quest points), I would still complete them, because you can't take on tier-6 POIs without doing so. It's literally the only way to tackle the "end-game" content this game has.
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I will add though, I really do appreciate the bicycle reward after 10 quest points. The game is a lot better for giving free bicycles away.
Another thing I'll add, related to map size. I'm not sure exactly how 7DTD does it technically, but I assume it's similar to other voxel games.
The host of the peer-to-peer playthrough we're doing on Navezgane currently is experiencing huge lag (fps) spikes as we uncover more of the map. I have to assume it's because we're loading in more chunks of the map. And we haven't uncovered all of the map yet.
Like I said, 4x4=16, 6x6=36, so a 4k map is potentially 44% as big as a 6k map. If uncovering more of the map increases host computer load, then naturally area size being small is very important.
Same thing happened in Minecraft when I played years ago, going too far out and exploring too much strains the server.
Yeah, sure, a dedicated server would help, but the point is that smaller maps will seemingly cause smaller resource strains.
I originally came into this thread with a fondness for the pregen4k map, but I could be persuaded towards a denser 3k map being added as a pregen to the vanilla game.
The host of the peer-to-peer playthrough we're doing on Navezgane currently is experiencing huge lag (fps) spikes as we uncover more of the map. I have to assume it's because we're loading in more chunks of the map. And we haven't uncovered all of the map yet.
Like I said, 4x4=16, 6x6=36, so a 4k map is potentially 44% as big as a 6k map. If uncovering more of the map increases host computer load, then naturally area size being small is very important.
Same thing happened in Minecraft when I played years ago, going too far out and exploring too much strains the server.
Yeah, sure, a dedicated server would help, but the point is that smaller maps will seemingly cause smaller resource strains.
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I originally came into this thread with a fondness for the pregen4k map, but I could be persuaded towards a denser 3k map being added as a pregen to the vanilla game.
Krunch
Refugee
This is the short and sweet answer. There are feasible configurations for RWG that will return playable maps, but even with 3rd party map generators from A17 right up till today with Teragon, you are limited by trader and biome requirements being met vs a completely flat map in order to get Traders that work with the quest chain as well as the POIs you want. Teragon and a little practice is your best bet for 4k maps.
I would really like to see TFP modify the Trader quest system to just require all 5 traders be present in each map regardless of biomes. These requirements are frustrating as a map maker because I can make really incredible maps in both 2 and 4k, but the biome restrictions usually force me to have to nerf both the quest line and the digging quests entirely. Really nice performance and quick load times, just no quest system, which is a shame, as it excludes console players with the use of mods. While I know 'its moddable' is still always an option, this has been problematic for me for at least the last versions.
Javabean867
Survivor
oof corpse runs are the bane to my existence. I only have so much time to play a game, and things like that are antithetical to fun for me.
Leveling up should feel powerful(looking at you Ark). The grind should not be in how you get resources home(looking at you valhiem) Difficulty spikes should not be a thing(again valhiem) the best equipment you attain in 1 biome should be powerful enough in the next biome that you don't get 1 shot by a mosquito(VALHIEM!!!) anyways i feel that rant is off topic.
As you said below, you get a bicycle as a reward for completing tier1 quests. Making the radius for acceptable quest distance for tier2 quests larger. And if you reserve a perk point for the "vehicle" perk or save up money you can have a minibike in time for tier3 quests, with a minibike 800m is an acceptable distance. AND you can always decide to just not do a quest or do lower-tier quests for a day.
No, he offered a magazine and a few hundred dukes and a heap of XP and a reputation point (what you call Quest points below).
Even if the item reward is a dud you get showered with rewards, about as much for handing in the quest as you get out of the POI clearing in loot and XP.
And even if all item rewards offered are duds, you get offered 3 choices, you can always take the most valuable and directly sell it for the money.
Correct. But nobody talked about completely ignoring quests, just not doing quests that seem too far away. Simply loot some pois and wait for the next day quests. Or do lower tier quests for the day. Or relocate and create subbases elsewhere to eventually have lots of quest choices avaliable all over the map from various traders, some always near me (that is what I always do in all my single player games).
And a nitpick: You can do quests without getting quest points if you do more quests per day than your quest limit.
You are making my point here. At least for you the quest rewards obviously are too much as a single Quest point would be enough as an incentive to do them. This isn't true for all players, so there needs to be some more. And the reward is also meant as a balance for co-op multiplayer so they feel the need to co-op in quests and everyone gets a reward even if always late at looting the containers. I am not against the quest rewards in general, I just think their balance is still way off.
InfiniteWarrior
Hunter
OP's point. It used to have 4K pregens.
The ones I've rolled (from A21 onward) all have had some kind of weirdness going on. One I just tested had that raised corner of the POI sticking out into the road problem I thought had been fixed, for example. Maybe it's just too small to get acceptable results? That is a pretty small space to fit biomes, cities, towns, rivers, lakes and all. I personally haven't seen those kinds of weird happenings on sizes above 4096 with the exception of the odd rise between different kinds of roads and so forth.
I know.
I would assume that raised corners are not game-breaking, a missing trader is. One previous poster said he could generate all 4 traders if he made the right settings. And making the right settings to get a functional map, even if it takes a few tries, should be on par with a pregen map.