PC Vehicles on Horde night

You are being EXTREMELY generous to the underground play style.
Digging the hole = 3 minutes of dig time

Making sure it doesn't collapse = It wont since new SI was introduced to prevent that, plus going far enough down they won't get to you.

Enough food and water = 2 meat and 2 water, good to go.

What perks are needed to dig straight down?
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Bro that hole I dug and 2 meat I collected was alot of work, I should be rewarded with a completely safe horde night. Lulz

 
Work should be rewarded.
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Yes, actual active work in fending off horde or preparing enough traps to do it for you or having means to keep yourself on the move to avoid direct combat.

You know, actually playing the game through intended hazard time, not avoiding it completely without any kind of risk or work.

Pretending to be a hibernating hamster on bedrock is no work at all.

Building a regular base with regular supply also doesn't count here, because again, its just a regular base with regular supplies for regular days.

And soon, it'll be regularly ruined by diggers, unless you actually put a real effort in the blood moon night.

Sorry, not sorry, but zero effort "survival" bases won't be an option soon.

 
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I mostly worry about the scary aspect of the 7th night. It doesn’t become scary if you can avoid it easily. I’m mostly think about Subnatica when they changed the Cyclopes from being invincible to breaking down easily. It made the game more thrilling and scary.

At least you are not safe just by hiding on a roof anymore.

 
Sure you have all kinds of reasons and methods for avoiding the horde nights.. But most people id think... at least people who have endgame gear... would want to.

Building a viable defense...and then harvesting the loot from the rarer "horde night only" zombies is a good enough reason for most....

Also.. devs could maybe do an option where zombies...well.. target your "base".. instead of only "you"...Forcing you to defend?

 
And if you dislike certain things, you can still mod it.
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You negated the rest of your post with this. The game currently contains things that many people enjoy. If you don't like those things, learn to mod.

 
I just don't get why people give a crap how or what other people do.
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I couldn't agree more Guppy - it's why I've never understood the angst of some over underground bases. If someone wants to go full molerat, how does that affect anyone else? Likewise and perhaps more on point for A17, if someone wants to play flyboy through an entire horde night, that's their choice too.

I'm not sure TFP's efforts to make underground bases less secure (for example) is even a good goal to have, let alone an achievable one.

 
What's the difference between these tactics and simply logging out at 21:59?
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Not a half bad point that - there will always be a way to avoid the horde.
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Is it? One could also avoid the horde by playing on creative and going for a cup of coffee, taking a stroll in the park instead of playing and many other ways. TFP could hire some muscle to deal with people doing that, or tbh they can't, so at least I believe that they have to make sure that players have a motive to interact with the game's content when they are actually playing. A simple, painless way to avoid horde nights kind of takes away the motive to interact with horde nights, build defenses and much of the content in the game in general.

I just don't get why people give a crap how or what other people do.
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There's nothing that can't be explained, especially when it comes to how people react. If you can't explain it, perhaps it just isn't there.

 
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Is it? One could also avoid the horde by playing on creative and going for a cup of coffee, taking a stroll in the park instead of playing and many other ways. TFP could hire some muscle to deal with people doing that, or tbh they can't, so at least I believe that they have to make sure that players have a motive to interact with the game's content when they are actually playing. A simple, painless way to avoid horde nights kind of takes away the motive to interact with horde nights, build defenses and much of the content in the game in general.


There's nothing that can't be explained, especially when it comes to how people react. If you can't explain it, perhaps it just isn't there.
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There has to be a certain level of playing to your own preferences, and to the game supporting multiple playing preferences. Some people are going to want a big above ground base and will look forward to defending it intensely from the weekly horde. Others will want an underground base that largely disables that mechanics, still others will want something in between.

If the game supports multiple playstyles its likely to be more successful with more people than if it just supports one style only. Of course, there can be only so many play styles supported, but if it's more than 1, then it's up to the player to choose not to indulge in a mechanic that doesn't match their play style.

ie/ if flying the copter around during horde night defeats even the new Horde AI, then people who don't like that, shouldn't do it (as opposed to the Pimps making the copter magically not work during horde nights). I imagine those players who want safe underground bases would make a very similar argument.

 
There has to be a certain level of playing to your own preferences, and to the game supporting multiple playing preferences. Some people are going to want a big above ground base and will look forward to defending it intensely from the weekly horde. Others will want an underground base that largely disables that mechanics, still others will want something in between.
If the game supports multiple playstyles its likely to be more successful with more people than if it just supports one style only. Of course, there can be only so many play styles supported, but if it's more than 1, then it's up to the player to choose not to indulge in a mechanic that doesn't match their play style.

ie/ if flying the copter around during horde night defeats even the new Horde AI, then people who don't like that, shouldn't do it (as opposed to the Pimps making the copter magically not work during horde nights). I imagine those players who want safe underground bases would make a very similar argument.
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Ok, let's assume that playstyle freedom includes the freedom to cancel out parts of gameplay (which is basically an oxymoron, but I'll humor that notion).

There's a difference between playstyle freedom and voluntary gameplay. If you make horde nights voluntary for example, you would actually be hurting playstyle freedom, because it will take away any motive people would have to engage in them. To have real playstyle freedom, choices and each choice's pros and cons have to be in equilibrium. If you want the player to have a real choice for a horde night alternative option, it has to be weighted equally with the former option, else it's not really a choice.

Games are essentially sets of structured rules and these rules create motives for actually playing and make games what they fundamentally are. For example, it would be no different to say that "we might as well remove hunger, because players who would like to choose the survival playstyle can just eat food at intermittent periods of time - and those who don't, don't have to". You are not accomodating two different playstyles with this - you are just eliminating one, because you make the former playstyle meaningless. In another example you could also accomodate people who like safe scavenging/exploring when they feel like *all in the same game instance*, so, "might as well make enemies stand still/only come out when you signal to them, so that the player challenges them when he feels like" accommodating both playstyles again. Not how it works.

Long story short, if choice paths pros and cons aren't correctly weighted, you will just have the opposite of playstyle freedom.

 
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"trolling rant"
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Nicely done, sir.

People aren't computers. There are more than two ways.

As somebody said earlier, if you don't like how it is you can mod it. The onus shouldn't be on the Dev team to coddle you.

 
Ok, let's assume that playstyle freedom includes the freedom to cancel out parts of gameplay (which is basically an oxymoron, but I'll humor that notion).
There's a difference between playstyle freedom and voluntary gameplay. If you make horde nights voluntary for example, you would actually be hurting playstyle freedom, because it will take away any motive people would have to engage in them. To have real playstyle freedom, choices and each choice's pros and cons have to be in equilibrium. If you want the player to have a real choice for a horde night alternative option, it has to be weighted equally with the former option, else it's not really a choice.

Games are essentially sets of structured rules and these rules create motives for actually playing and make games what they fundamentally are. For example, it would be no different to say that "we might as well remove hunger, because players who would like to choose the survival playstyle can just eat food at intermittent periods of time - and those who don't, don't have to". You are not accomodating two different playstyles with this - you are just eliminating one, because you make the former playstyle meaningless. In another example you could also accomodate people who like safe scavenging/exploring when they feel like *all in the same game instance*, so, "might as well make enemies stand still/only come out when you signal to them, so that the player challenges them when he feels like" accommodating both playstyles again. Not how it works.

Long story short, if choice paths pros and cons aren't correctly weighted, you will just have the opposite of playstyle freedom.
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No, it's precisely NOT like saying let's remove hunger, its saying lets give players the CHOICE to remove it, if they so WISH.

That's the beauty of this game (particularly post A10), it can be easily edited to match what an individual player wants, and the only point I'd make to TFP is that the introduction of digging zombies in A17, should come with a relatively easy way to disable that digging so that players who don't want it, don't have to have it.

 
Thanks “restinpiece“ for trying to explain games to them... but I've been trying that as well... they think because they found a way to enjoy a basically broken game (zombie survival where you can easily avoid zombies) that means fixing the game is the same as limiting freedom.

I mean that one guy told me, that I should mod out the games mistakes because HE likes them xD

I need to write a book:

“Games and their incentive“ for dummies

:D

 
But why do you care how others play. It doesn't affect you one iota.

"Oh noes, those guys on a server I'm not on in a save I'm not playing aren't playing right! Change the game pimps, force mechanics on them!"

...why.

Let me be frank. I don't play underground, especially on horde nights, and I doubt I will gyro on them, but I see no reason to be bothered by players who do, and adding digging zombies or anti aircraft vultures doesn't change my game a damn bit, so what exactly is the value add?

Will people who have never built underground bunkers suddenly start doing so?

No. They will not.

 
I would imagine a single vulture strike on the gyrocopters rotors would bring the craft down, leaving it needing repairs.

Anyone who thinks they can monitor dark night-time skies for a vulture that's approaching from any direction (in 3 dimensions) is dreaming, so fly the gyro on horde nights at your own risk.

:cocksure:

 
But why do you care how others play. It doesn't affect you one iota.
"Oh noes, those guys on a server I'm not on in a save I'm not playing aren't playing right! Change the game pimps, force mechanics on them!"

...why.

Let me be frank. I don't play underground, especially on horde nights, and I doubt I will gyro on them, but I see no reason to be bothered by players who do, and adding digging zombies or anti aircraft vultures doesn't change my game a damn bit, so what exactly is the value add?

Will people who have never built underground bunkers suddenly start doing so?

No. They will not.
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Its not about you. If you dont want to play the game as it is intended, be my guest.

But i do.

And I simply dont enjoy a challenge, if i know i can cheese it at any given point.

I myself am a trader. And I argue AGAINST my own playstyle because it is broken.

I have nearly full armor, a rifle and electric fences around my house on day 7!

It needs to be balanced.

Am I trying to ruin my fun?

No. I just want a more realistic challenge that isnt completly broken.

Think of Skyrim.

Would you argue that bethesda shouldnt have fixed infinie potion stacking?

You would ruin the fun for everyone who enjoyed having 9999 armor and 9999damage on lvl 10.

And other people could simply “not use it“.

It takes the fun out of trying the best solution.

Why should i try different basedesigns, when running away has no downsides?

I dont care if you mod your game to be as easy as taking alolipop from a baby.

I want a challenge suitable to the name of “Zombie Survival“.

 
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