PC The big crying thread for 17.2 Economy

No we're not Bethesda... yet. Coding in followers in a fully destroyable world is a nightmare, and would subtract from the total entities alive in the world and the people (in general) want more zombies and more players not crappy NPCs that get stuck on stuff. I'd love to have followers but until we get believable bandits its not on the table at all.
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No we're not Bethesda... yet. Coding in followers in a fully destroyable world is a nightmare, and would subtract from the total entities alive in the world and the people (in general) want more zombies and more players not crappy NPCs that get stuck on stuff. I'd love to have followers but until we get believable bandits its not on the table at all.
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Sorry... Followers in a fully destroyable world, yet... digging zombies. hm.

And... Some things about the game don't have to be 100% realistic. They can be... game. I mean, you could do NPC's like loads of other games where their setup as stations or as sentry building structures or simply a plate where the NPC should exist. Then make them like a trader or like a turret. There's loads of things like that which could be done and not affect a destroyable world.

 
No we're not Bethesda... yet. Coding in followers in a fully destroyable world is a nightmare, and would subtract from the total entities alive in the world and the people (in general) want more zombies and more players not crappy NPCs that get stuck on stuff. I'd love to have followers but until we get believable bandits its not on the table at all.
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That 'crappy NPCs' getting stuck part all depends on you guys, actually. IMO adding NPCs (bandits/followers/wanderers) whatever you want to call them is the next major step in this world. You could technically say it's already in the game in the form of traders but we want more than just the absolute basics. So I think it should be on the table in the near future. I've seen mods with decent NPC features so if you're stuck you could probably ask them for help.

No, only servers want more players. SP people want to play by themselves, hence SP. Somehow I get a feeling that people want more NPCs (and related features) rather than more zombies. Perhaps you guys could confirm with some kind of survey/poll. I mean with the recent changes to zombies where loot is not guaranteed, I could care less if there was a new type of zombie. Before certain zombies dropped certain loot like the nurse would drop health-related items and cops would drop guns/ammo but you guys removed all that. So right now, zombies are seen as XP or as an obstacle for some quest - it really doesn't matter what they look like. Obviously some zombies are tougher to kill than others but all you have to do is pump more bullets into them.

 
Sorry... Followers in a fully destroyable world, yet... digging zombies. hm.
And... Some things about the game don't have to be 100% realistic. They can be... game. I mean, you could do NPC's like loads of other games where their setup as stations or as sentry building structures or simply a plate where the NPC should exist. Then make them like a trader or like a turret. There's loads of things like that which could be done and not affect a destroyable world.
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This is actually a really good point. I would actually be fairly happy even with "Basic" npcs for now... even ones that are totally stationary and have basic rudimentary skills as mentioned here.

 
Sorry... Followers in a fully destroyable world, yet... digging zombies. hm.
And... Some things about the game don't have to be 100% realistic. They can be... game. I mean, you could do NPC's like loads of other games where their setup as stations or as sentry building structures or simply a plate where the NPC should exist. Then make them like a trader or like a turret. There's loads of things like that which could be done and not affect a destroyable world.
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yep, I said probably not followers, but will have npcs, or already do with traders. I'd rather say probably not and then suddenly we have it than promise it and never deliver.

 
I'd rather say probably not and then suddenly we have it than promise it and never deliver.
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Fair enough. I can understand that.

I wasn't necessarily thinking of follower npc's btw, although that would be cool too! I was thinking more like npcs that you order to do something and they go do it on their own, and it would be something limited to your base/town/colony for the most part so they wouldn't have to wander too much and risk getting stuck all that easily.

 
yep, I said probably not followers, but will have npcs, or already do with traders. I'd rather say probably not and then suddenly we have it than promise it and never deliver.
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Ah. Literally people who follow you around "followers". Gotcha. Make way more sense now. Thanks Madmole! And totally understand the the commitment issues. Thanks for the reply.

 
That 'crappy NPCs' getting stuck part all depends on you guys, actually. IMO adding NPCs (bandits/followers/wanderers) whatever you want to call them is the next major step in this world. You could technically say it's already in the game in the form of traders but we want more than just the absolute basics. So I think it should be on the table in the near future. I've seen mods with decent NPC features so if you're stuck you could probably ask them for help.
No, only servers want more players. SP people want to play by themselves, hence SP. Somehow I get a feeling that people want more NPCs (and related features) rather than more zombies. Perhaps you guys could confirm with some kind of survey/poll. I mean with the recent changes to zombies where loot is not guaranteed, I could care less if there was a new type of zombie. Before certain zombies dropped certain loot like the nurse would drop health-related items and cops would drop guns/ammo but you guys removed all that. So right now, zombies are seen as XP or as an obstacle for some quest - it really doesn't matter what they look like. Obviously some zombies are tougher to kill than others but all you have to do is pump more bullets into them.
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Its really about being realistic on what you can deliver at an acceptable quality level. One man's sweet AI is another mans bug ridden garbage.

 
I would be happy if post T5 quests were to rescue a Survivor and in gratitude, they appeared on your base manning a Turret so you no longer needed to supply power to it or even as a lookout that shouted or rang a bell to alert the base to danger.

OR create new turrets that would need to be manned by npcs.. the turrets are destroyable so make the NPCs killable too to prevent players from dropping them out in the open and loosing them after all that quest work to gain them.

Working on what needs fixing shouldn't lead to tunnel vision of potential future possibilities (this isn't an accusation, just a statement of fact)

 
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Ah. Literally people who follow you around "followers". Gotcha. Make way more sense now. Thanks Madmole! And totally understand the the commitment issues. Thanks for the reply.
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Yes, bandits and enemy NPCs will come for sure, but friendly npcs you can recruit and follow you around? Thats a lot harder to deliver at an acceptable quality level so probably not this game.

 
Just in case anyone else was wondering why TFP don't just copy what modders do.
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Hey, do you guys remember that time when Roland, the community manager, insulted the entire modding community of his game by comparing all of their passionate work to make 7d2d better to that of low quality amateurs. Pepperidge Farm remembers.

 
Hey, do you guys remember that time when Roland, the community manager, insulted the entire modding community of his game by comparing all of their passionate work to make 7d2d better to that of low quality amateurs. Pepperidge Farm remembers.
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I forgot momentarily that there are people looking for insults in every post so let me explain my point and hopefully Pepperidge Farm with it's overpriced cookies will remember that.

My point was not that modders are amateurs and that they put out subpar content. My point is that modders don't have to worry about making sure that their mod can be run by everyone who purchased the game. If someone cannot run a mod because it tanks their performance they uninstall it and try a different mod or go back to vanilla. If vanilla doesn't work then the fireworks start.

If a modder had removed LBD and made the player progression purely central pool based people would have shrugged and just not used that mod if they didn't like it. That wasn't the response the developers got when they did it as the new default version of the game. Devs and mods have different levels of expectations and standards they are held to and that is why the devs do not just copy the modders and why asking, "If the modders can do it then why can't the devs?" is a naive question and why accusing, "The devs must be incompetent or lazy if they can't do what my favorite modder could" is asinine.

Personally, I liked my little quip with the pairing of the two quotes better but I am a public educator so the itch to teach is strong when confronted by ignorance. I'm pretty sure the modders, themselves, wouldn't have been offended by the post since they already know what I just explained. Its always those who want to be offended on behalf of some other perceived targeted group that you have to walk on eggshells around.

 
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Yes, bandits and enemy NPCs will come for sure, but friendly npcs you can recruit and follow you around? Thats a lot harder to deliver at an acceptable quality level so probably not this game.
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What are your expectations for when bandits and enemy npcs will be first introduced?

 
Just in case anyone else was wondering why TFP don't just copy what modders do.
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I never said anything about copying. Looking at some ideas and improving or adding to them is done all the time. Then you guys go through your own process.

Haha! Sorry to say but you guys say 'acceptable quality level' after you released (without much internal testing no less) the most recent RWG changes? The one that creates mostly crappy maps? :) Nah that doesn't count because its the experimental branch right? :)

 
Oh...darn....how...could’ve....I....so...thoughtlessly...set...myself...up....for...that....

The sad thing is that yes, we ARE in early access and right now in particular we ARE in experimental so it really DOESN’T count until the game goes gold but you reveal in your sarcasm that you honestly don’t see the truth of that.

It’s like someone walking in during the middle of a birthday party and saying “Don’t tell me...there’s going to be a cake with lit candles on it...pfft!”

Wait I know....Don’t look now! I’m betting someone is going to respond again in this supposed “thread” in these “forums”....

 
I never said anything about copying. Looking at some ideas and improving or adding to them is done all the time. Then you guys go through your own process.
Haha! Sorry to say but you guys say 'acceptable quality level' after you released (without much internal testing no less) the most recent RWG changes? The one that creates mostly crappy maps? :) Nah that doesn't count because its the experimental branch right? :)
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You can absolutely test everything in A17.2 in the Navezgane Map. No one promised you RWG would be working in the experimental.

 
Oh...darn....how...could’ve....I....so...thoughtlessly...set...myself...up....for...that....
The sad thing is that yes, we ARE in early access and right now in particular we ARE in experimental so it really DOESN’T count until the game goes gold but you reveal in your sarcasm that you honestly don’t see the truth of that.

It’s like someone walking in during the middle of a birthday party and saying “Don’t tell me...there’s going to be a cake with lit candles on it...pfft!”

Wait I know....Don’t look now! I’m betting someone is going to respond again in this supposed “thread” in these “forums”....
Click to expand...

You can absolutely test everything in A17.2 in the Navezgane Map. No one promised you RWG would be working in the experimental.
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Geez guys relax it was a joke, hence my smiley faces...

 
* You still can become a millionaire

* RWG will be fixed

* NPC´s that not follow you (all time) are on the to do list

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