Old Crow
Hunter
I posted this in response to Joel's recent subreddit post asking us why we liked jars. I wanted to share my response here as well as a sort of.. I don't know. Open letter? Response? Ahem...
I think what it really boils down to (see what I did there?) is that this isn't specifically about jars. Players are tired. We're tired of development taking so long, projected timelines not being met, the appearance that the development style and choices feel combative, invoking the feeling that you, the developers (not you specifically, Joel) have disdain for the players and how we play in the sandbox.
It feels like a constant flow of "We need to screw with the players, so we're going to make X Y and Z changes to kill how they want to play. They have to play OUR way." Maybe that's not what you're really going for - we're not mind readers. The Fun Pimps say it's a sandbox, but you guys keep pouring water in to turn the sand to mud.
Screamers coming more often to investigate just because the player exists. Erratic AI designed to destroy everything right away. Zombies targeting lower blocks to have an easy way in immediately. Digging, Being Olympic-level swimmers. It's not making them scarier. It's not invoking feelings of danger. It's invoking annoyance, it's invoking punishment for trying to have fun.
Magazines. Oi. Sure, getting out of base from time to time is a good idea, but we already do that. We have to mine, and harvest and gather materials to make that base, to make our gear and food. But it's turning into a looter shooter, with survival elements in the background. Sure there's a better way to do this? Learn by Using, coexisting with books and magazines, maybe? I don't know. Scouring the land for mailboxes, newspaper dispensers and book stores doesn't feel fun or engaging. I don't know if there's too many magazines, or it's just the idea of trying to find dozens and dozens of magazines, but it just feels like a chore. "Want to survive? Better find lots of old copies of Reader's Digest or Martha Stewart Living!"
I know, I know. Realism in a zombie game. Where we can fit an entire 4x4 into our backpacks along with hundreds of bullets, bandages and guns, where the dead walk the earth, and a grumpy old farmer can amazingly not get himself shot by other survivors because he's just that much of a jerk to everyone. We're not asking for realism, but rather common sense and maybe a little logic. We want fun. We want to have fun. Aren't games meant to be fun?
So yes, please, make the game you want. But it's nice to know you guys are listening now. I don't know if it's too late now for this game, but things said here in this reddit thread can definitely be kept as food for thought in future games, should you guys decide to stay in the game development business.
I can't imagine you guys aren't tired by now. Your first game and it's been 13 years in development, and still not done. I'm sure you and your brother and Lathan and everyone else is tired, and maybe not a little bitter after all this time. So thanks. Thanks for listening. We want this game to succeed as much as you do.
I think what it really boils down to (see what I did there?) is that this isn't specifically about jars. Players are tired. We're tired of development taking so long, projected timelines not being met, the appearance that the development style and choices feel combative, invoking the feeling that you, the developers (not you specifically, Joel) have disdain for the players and how we play in the sandbox.
It feels like a constant flow of "We need to screw with the players, so we're going to make X Y and Z changes to kill how they want to play. They have to play OUR way." Maybe that's not what you're really going for - we're not mind readers. The Fun Pimps say it's a sandbox, but you guys keep pouring water in to turn the sand to mud.
Screamers coming more often to investigate just because the player exists. Erratic AI designed to destroy everything right away. Zombies targeting lower blocks to have an easy way in immediately. Digging, Being Olympic-level swimmers. It's not making them scarier. It's not invoking feelings of danger. It's invoking annoyance, it's invoking punishment for trying to have fun.
Magazines. Oi. Sure, getting out of base from time to time is a good idea, but we already do that. We have to mine, and harvest and gather materials to make that base, to make our gear and food. But it's turning into a looter shooter, with survival elements in the background. Sure there's a better way to do this? Learn by Using, coexisting with books and magazines, maybe? I don't know. Scouring the land for mailboxes, newspaper dispensers and book stores doesn't feel fun or engaging. I don't know if there's too many magazines, or it's just the idea of trying to find dozens and dozens of magazines, but it just feels like a chore. "Want to survive? Better find lots of old copies of Reader's Digest or Martha Stewart Living!"
I know, I know. Realism in a zombie game. Where we can fit an entire 4x4 into our backpacks along with hundreds of bullets, bandages and guns, where the dead walk the earth, and a grumpy old farmer can amazingly not get himself shot by other survivors because he's just that much of a jerk to everyone. We're not asking for realism, but rather common sense and maybe a little logic. We want fun. We want to have fun. Aren't games meant to be fun?
So yes, please, make the game you want. But it's nice to know you guys are listening now. I don't know if it's too late now for this game, but things said here in this reddit thread can definitely be kept as food for thought in future games, should you guys decide to stay in the game development business.
I can't imagine you guys aren't tired by now. Your first game and it's been 13 years in development, and still not done. I'm sure you and your brother and Lathan and everyone else is tired, and maybe not a little bitter after all this time. So thanks. Thanks for listening. We want this game to succeed as much as you do.
