PC Alpha 21 Dev Diary

[faatal]

Boats are definitely doable (we have boat mods) and it really does add an element, but I honestly wouldn't consider it game changing unless there was a good *reason* to boat.  

Like fishing or diving.  And fishing mods require the block item swap property to work with the method we use, and I'm super curious if the new water will support that.  

All in all, as much as I like boats, they'd be wasted imo, without a reason for them. 

I hate arguing against new features.

Well, the goal would be to give you reasons to not want to be in the water.

I have a question about game development faatal, is it true that the further you progress with a game the more complicated it becomes. I heard something like this from some people and just wanted to know if any of this is true or not? Sorry if I'm completely wrong. 

Definitely. Games with many features grow massively as they are developed, because at the start they don't have all those features and often when features are added they are basic and then grow over time.

 

[Slasher]

crocodile would be dope

 

[CultOfMoose]

So are all the female clothing going to be stripper outfits or are we getting outfits that cover as much as the male outfits do?

Cause at this point it really seems like you are making female characters for your sex starved male players and giving the finger to your female fans....

And before get guys get butthurt about women asking to be treated like human beings instead of sex objects, hush, if you aren't a women you don't get to have an opinion on how we are allowed to feel.

 

[Crypted]

I just got done watching the A21 dev stream and I really liked all of it especially the Alpha 22+ character models and bandits. A lot more art is always nice and some trader compound models. 

 

[katarynna]

So are all the female clothing going to be stripper outfits or are we getting outfits that cover as much as the male outfits do?

Cause at this point it really seems like you are making female characters for your sex starved male players and giving the finger to your female fans....

And before get guys get butthurt about women asking to be treated like human beings instead of sex objects, hush, if you aren't a women you don't get to have an opinion on how we are allowed to feel.

Maybe i'm missing something, but isn't the party girl the only somewhat scantily clad female?

Jen has big boobs, but her clothes are normal clothes you might see any female anywhere wearing. The old nurse had more of a sexy costumely look, but the new one is wearing scrubs and looks completely normal. Marlene, Arlene, darlene, and big momma are all covered. So is the lab worker. I can't think of a single other female zombie that is scantily clad.

I am fine with adding one scantily clad male zombie for those who really want parity, but i personally don't find it necessary.

As for specifically female character clothing, the only thing i can think of is the skirt, which is below the knee if i remember right. Definitely not a short skirt.

As a female, i neither feel like the female characters are made for the sex starved nor that tfp are giving me the middle finger. I absolutely don't feel the same as you, despite the fact that we are the same gender.

 

[Mister Forgash]

Nothing wrong with women having more tasteful clothing options. Lets hope that steel armor covers everything to your satisfaction.

.. if you're not a man, you shouldn't get to have an opinion over how butthurt we do or do not feel.

 

[Laz Man]

Maybe i'm missing something, but isn't the party girl the only somewhat scantily clad female?

Jen has big boobs, but her clothes are normal clothes you might see any female anywhere wearing. The old nurse had more of a sexy costumely look, but the new one is wearing scrubs and looks completely normal. Marlene, Arlene, darlene, and big momma are all covered. So is the lab worker. I can't think of a single other female zombie that is scantily clad.

I am fine with adding one scantily clad male zombie for those who really want parity, but i personally don't find it necessary.

As for specifically female character clothing, the only thing i can think of is the skirt, which is below the knee if i remember right. Definitely not a short skirt.

As a female, i neither feel like the female characters are made for the sex starved nor that tfp are giving me the middle finger. I absolutely don't feel the same as you, despite the fact that we are the same gender.

My guess is the comment was because of the new desert female player character outfit shown in tonight's dev stream.

 

[Crypted]

Maybe i'm missing something, but isn't the party girl the only somewhat scantily clad female?

Jen has big boobs, but her clothes are normal clothes you might see any female anywhere wearing. The old nurse had more of a sexy costumely look, but the new one is wearing scrubs and looks completely normal. Marlene, Arlene, darlene, and big momma are all covered. So is the lab worker. I can't think of a single other female zombie that is scantily clad.

I am fine with adding one scantily clad male zombie for those who really want parity, but i personally don't find it necessary.

As for specifically female character clothing, the only thing i can think of is the skirt, which is below the knee if i remember right. Definitely not a short skirt.

As a female, i neither feel like the female characters are made for the sex starved nor that tfp are giving me the middle finger. I absolutely don't feel the same as you, despite the fact that we are the same gender.

I don't get what CultofMoose is saying, TFP definitely aren't giving the middle finger to female players for 7DTD. If TFP were they would just have male characters and zombies in there but they don't, there are female characters and zombies in the game too. 

 

[Riamus]

I don't get what CultofMoose is saying, TFP definitely aren't giving the middle finger to female players for 7DTD. If TFP were they would just have male characters and zombies in there but they don't, there are female characters and zombies in the game too. 

Well, they were referring to player clothing.  I haven't seen the dev stream yet (pulling it up right now), but if they show only one outfit for females and it is the way CultofMoose described, then there's enough reason to be upset.  It does often happen that games as well as any other media are often designed in such a way.  When there is a perceived view that more males will play the game (whether correct or not), you can get designs made to create interest for guys even if it's not tasteful.  It isn't really right to do that but it happens everywhere.

That said, I am sure there will be enough other clothing/armor options to fit anyone's chosen style.  Keeping in mind that some women want to wear such outfits in the game, so there should be an option for those women as well as for those who do not like that style.

 

[Crypted]

Well, they were referring to player clothing.  I haven't seen the dev stream yet (pulling it up right now), but if they show only one outfit for females and it is the way CultofMoose described, then there's enough reason to be upset.  It does often happen that games as well as any other media are often designed in such a way.  When there is a perceived view that more males will play the game (whether correct or not), you can get designs made to create interest for guys even if it's not tasteful.  It isn't really right to do that but it happens everywhere.

That said, I am sure there will be enough other clothing/armor options to fit anyone's chosen style.  Keeping in mind that some women want to wear such outfits in the game, so there should be an option for those women as well as for those who do not like that style.

I know what she is talking about, what I meant was why is she saying all of that about the sex starved male players part of it because the female clothes are covering up everything (she said stripper outfits) but there isn't anything similar between stripper outfits and the female desert outfit. I'm sure TFP are adding more clothes/armor (so this clothes part to it shouldn't be a problem right now). I agree with more clothing variety but now isn't really the time to talk about it because there still working on a lot of things, so they're going to get to it I'm sure. 

 

[JayBiggS]

"I didn't show a nak--uh base female just, you know, because that could be controversial..." -Lee

Why would it be controversial? Did they put her in a micro bikini? Is she totally nude?

I hope not

 

[Riamus]

I know what she is talking about, what I meant was why is she saying all of that about the sex starved male players part of it because the female clothes are covering up everything (she said stripper outfits) but there isn't anything similar between stripper outfits and the female desert outfit. I'm sure TFP are adding more clothes/armor (so this clothes part to it shouldn't be a problem right now). I agree with more clothing variety but now isn't really the time to talk about it because there still working on a lot of things, so they're going to get to it I'm sure. 

Ok, so I watched the stream and can comment more directly now.  The desert outfit comparison of male to female is certainly very different, where the male outfit fully covers the male and the female outfit shows a lot of skin.  You're right that it's not a stripper outfit by any means and covers everything, but it is also not necessarily what many women would choose to wear and is certainly designed with male interests in mind.  Chat was clearly thinking the same with their "Jen who?" comments.  That doesn't mean you have to wear that outfit, though.  I'd assume there are still a wide variety of clothing that would provide the style each person wants.  But some women would like to wear a "Tomb Raider" style outfit.  And, right or wrong, many guys who choose to play female characters would want such an outfit.  So there is reason to have it in the game.  If I were TFP, I think I'd at least consider having male and female clothing have the same range of styles (maybe they already do), such that you can also get male clothing that is a male version of the Tomb Raider style, though honestly it would look better to me to have a Raiders of the Lost Ark male style to go along with the Tomb Raider female style even though one is clearly more clothed.  But as long as they offer fully clothed (no skin) female clothing, I think it'll be fine.  Let players choose what suits them best without being too stereotypical in the available choices.  If this was the only clothing option or all were like this, then I could easily see where some women would be offended, but I am certain it will not be and there will be options for those who don't like this style.

I just hope there are still going to be options for a wide variety of body shapes.  I'd prefer not playing a jacked guy and I'm sure many women would prefer not to play women with such a prominent upper half.  There were some different male options shown that do suggest we'll still have some variation in looks and hopefully it's a good variation.  I am also not a fan of the super hairy arms and legs on the one guy they showed.  It just looks really bad to me.

"I didn't show a nak--uh base female just, you know, because that could be controversial..." -Lee

Why would it be controversial? Did they put her in a micro bikini? Is she totally nude?

I hope not

Well, considering the desert clothing is apparently controversial, that base version is also likely to be even though there's no reason why it should be.

 

[Kazgrel]

I find the feedback about the female outfit that's pretty obviously a homage to Lara Croft rather bizzare seeing that it and the female bandit were the only newer female npc models shown.  Now if the female version of that wasteland assassin set is showing skin every which way, sure, a bit bizzare, but I figure it'll be more or less identical to the male counterpart.

 

[Crypted]

Ok, so I watched the stream and can comment more directly now.  The desert outfit comparison of male to female is certainly very different, where the male outfit fully covers the male and the female outfit shows a lot of skin.  That doesn't mean you have to wear that outfit, though.  I'd assume there are still a wide variety of clothing that would provide the style each person wants.  But some women would like to wear a "Tomb Raider" style outfit.  And, right or wrong, many guys who choose to play female characters would want such an outfit.  So there is reason to have it in the game.  If I were TFP, I think I'd at least consider having male and female clothing have the same range of styles (maybe they already do), such that you can also get male clothing that is a male version of the Tomb Raider style, though honestly it would look better to me to have a Raiders of the Lost Ark male style to go along with the Tomb Raider female style even though one is clearly more clothed.  But as long as they offer fully clothed (no skin) female clothing, I think it'll be fine.  Let players choose what suits them best without being too stereotypical in the available choices.  If this was the only clothing option or all were like this, then I could easily see where some women would be offended, but I am certain it will not be and there will be options for those who don't like this style.

I just hope there are still going to be options for a wide variety of body shapes.  I'd prefer not playing a jacked guy and I'm sure many women would prefer not to play women with such a prominent upper half.  There were some different male options shown that do suggest we'll still have some variation in looks and hopefully it's a good variation.  I am also not a fan of the super hairy arms and legs on the one guy they showed.  It just looks really bad to me.

I agree with you, and yeah I think more clothing/armor are going to get added in at some point you know because they showed some clothes and armor already so why not add more variety to it. I think there should be an updated version to clothing suited for each biome if this makes any sense. The option to change your characters body shape will definitely be a great addition to the game in my opinion, so people can go in more depth of what play style they want and what the people want to look like. 

 

[Riamus]

I find the feedback about the female outfit that's pretty obviously a homage to Lara Croft rather bizzare seeing that it and the female bandit were the only newer female npc models shown.  Now if the female version of that wasteland assassin set is showing skin every which way, sure, a bit bizzare, but I figure it'll be more or less identical to the male counterpart.

My thoughts as well.  The female bandit was fully clothed, so they aren't only doing that type of clothing.  I'm sure there will be variety when it's finished and people should wait and see how it turns out.  I also picked up on the Tomb Raider similarity and think it is fine to use a well known style here.  It isn't a bad thing to bring this up, though.  Letting the devs know that you think they need to offer other styles of clothing rather than styles that can be considered sexist is fine regardless what others think or even if you think they are already going to offer alternatives.

I am interested in seeing how the clothing actually works, though.  Is the outfit an actual outfit that is all one "piece", or can you mix and match as we do now?  If someone wanted that top but with snow pants (or whatever passes for the winter outfit's pants), can they do that?  I like how single piece outfits can look, but at the same time I really like having the option to mix and match rather than only having set looks to choose from.  Considering we have probably hundreds (thousands?) of possible looks currently and if we have to choose from one-piece complete outfits, we will never have anywhere near that many options.

 

[Jugom]

The desert outfit comparison of male to female is certainly very different,

hat, glasses, shirt, shorts, boots, kneepads, gloves and backpack. I think they have the same outfit. 

 

[Gronal]

I can understand the problem with the desert costume difference between male and female.
It seems the equivalent of emphasizing the dude's bulge giving him super tight shorts.
The female desert clothing looks real, don't get me wrong. I could see an IRL woman wearing something like that. In a zombie apocalypse though? Just seems needlessly skin-prominent. I think it needs to be a bit more practical looking and a bit less sexual.

Edit for perspective: I asked my gf what she thinks:
"well they obviously sexualised the woman more, more skin showing but idc at this point lol"
"the shorts are cute, the bralette is a bit much"

 

[RipClaw]

The female desert clothing looks real, don't get me wrong. I could see an IRL woman wearing something like that. In a zombie apocalypse though? Just seems needlessly skin-prominent. I think it needs to be a bit more practical looking and a bit less sexual.

A woman would only wear this in the desert for a photo shooting. If you look at the clothes of nomads, they cover as much skin as possible. On the one hand to protect from the sun and on the other hand from the cold nights.

 

[Gronal]

A woman would only wear this in the desert for a photo shooting. If you look at the clothes of nomads, they cover as much skin as possible. On the one hand to protect from the sun and on the other hand from the cold nights.

True, I mentioned practicality but didn't even think about it in terms of keeping the sun off you xD

 

[Doomofman]

I'm not surprised to see a bit of a negative reaction to that female character model/outfit. I immediately saw the Lara Croft parallels, but as someone else mentioned, it kinda feels like a cosplay outfit for a photoshoot rather than something suited to the apocalypse.

But I don't think it's massively different from how the aesthetics of the Stripper or Jen models are. 7 Days has always had quite a stylized look to it and never took "practicality" too seriously, so for me, it fits in with the established 7 Days aesthetic.

Having said that, I'm speaking from a male perspective so I can't really speak to how a woman might feel seeing a character model like that