PC A20 Developer Diary Discussions

[Adam the Waster]

Huh. So with Intellect 4 (with the Nerdy Glasses) I can automatically craft chemistry stations, but when I take the glasses off I am unable to craft them.

they just make you feel smart

 

[Thaledwyn]

How about this idea:

Give us the ability to build a skateboard with 1 wood (1 iron) and 4 plastic (rolls).

No items storable but a little bit faster moving at beginning without blueprint.

 

[Jost Amman]

How about this idea:

Give us the ability to build a skateboard with 1 wood (1 iron) and 4 plastic (rolls).

No items storable but a little bit faster moving at beginning without blueprint.

That's a nice idea on paper, but in reality it would entail a huge amount of work for the whole team.

A few issues I can think of out of the top of my head are:

• They'd need to do MOCAP sessions to capture the movements of a skater
  
• They'd need to add the new animations into the game while you're skating
  
• They'd need to add a new vehicle type and crafting recipes and probably update the connected skills
  
• They'd need to do all the testing to see if there are any problems with collisions
  

 

[Matt115]

That's a nice idea on paper, but in reality it would entail a huge amount of work for the whole team.

A few issues I can think of out of the top of my head are:

• They'd need to do MOCAP sessions to capture the movements of a skater
  
• They'd need to add the new animations into the game while you're skating
  
• They'd need to add a new vehicle type and crafting recipes and probably update the connected skills
  
• They'd need to do all the testing to see if there are any problems with collisions
  

and probably 3 months of fixing bugs xd 

 

[Fanatical_Meat]

^^ if the goal is to make early game run speed faster or longer why not just increase the run speed?
What I am saying is why make something easily craft able that will stay with you the entire game?
 

 

[Fanatical_Meat]

This outfit doesn't really work if the mask is broken, though.

On a serious note, it looks like broken glass on the mask. Isn't it made of plastic or acrylic, though?

It is made of pure cool

other materials are irrelevant

 

[uncle.heavy]

And yes, that includes figuring out when a situation warrants using a weapon other than the stun baton.

This is a huge step for immersion.

@faatal @madmole Some time ago there was a discussion about possibly giving the option to only make electric wires visible when you have a wire cutter in your hands... if this option was added, MANY players that love building nice stuff would be very happy. So I was wondering how difficult would it be to add that, and also if there's any chance you guys could add this to the TO-DO list for A20. Thanks.

I would so love this. It is no bother at all when building completely on your own because planning is part of the whole building aspect executed properly. 

In team play, though, your choices may be more limited, and it is sad to see those wires all over - so I usually pass on them, which is even sadder.

 

[Roland]

And yes, that includes figuring out when a situation warrants using a weapon other than the stun baton.

But that is simple for so many players:

If I perked into a weapon then I use it

If I didn't perk into a wapon then I don't use it (even though it kills zombies just fine).

This is where the anger over the expense for crossing over attribute trees comes from. A kid really wants to use a shotgun but didn't go strength and now to cross over to strength and perk up shotguns it is super expensive so OBVIOUSLY the kid is FORCED to never use shotguns. Can't use them if he didn't perk into them....

It's an unfortunate fixed belief....

 

[Roland]

How about this idea:

Give us the ability to build a skateboard with 1 wood (1 iron) and 4 plastic (rolls).

No items storable but a little bit faster moving at beginning without blueprint.

Sure, but only if collision with every rock, garbage pile, cinder block, etc. is turned on and if you skate off the paved road into gravel or dirt you fly off with critical chance to break both your arm and your leg.

 

[Jost Amman]

Ironically wouldn't a hazmat zombie be the least threatening of the lot? Their mouth, hands, and almost every part of their body is trapped inside the protective suit.

Quite the opposite. In fact, it was them who were spreading the infection when it started and the Hazmat was to avoid being infected themselves. But the plan went wrong, the people turned into zombies started attacking them too and broke their suits, so the virus they were carrying turned them with the strongest of effects since they had the biggest concentration of it in their suitcases. Now they roam the land and can easily infect anyone they come in contact with... BWAHAHAHAH!  :evil:

 

[Matt115]

Quite the opposite. In fact, it was them who were spreading the infection when it started and the Hazmat was to avoid being infected themselves. But the plan went wrong, the people turned into zombies started attacking them too and broke their suits, so the virus they were carrying turned them with the strongest of effects since they had the biggest concentration of it in their suitcases. Now they roam the land and can easily infect anyone they come in contact with... BWAHAHAHAH!  :evil:

But he can't bite anyone  and his glove probably are more clean that bare decying hands

 

[Matt115]

Sure, but only if collision with every rock, garbage pile, cinder block, etc. is turned on and if you skate off the paved road into gravel or dirt you fly off with critical chance to break both your arm and your leg.

Well better idea would be to create a metal cart with rolls and using it like hobo ( transporting stuff)

 

[doughphunghus]

Btw he should have some wound it torso and destroyed gloves xd

Agree on the destroyed gloves, so you can get scratched.

 

[MechanicalLens]

Agree on the destroyed gloves, so you can get scratched.

Maybe the nightclub girl had a thing for guys in hazmat suits. Surely we wouldn't see some long fingernail scratches here and there?

 

[Blake_]

Well, yeah. It's not reasonable to expect a club (no matter how nice it is) to have the dps of a machine gun.

I don't remember any major change.

The whole premise of your balancing approach is that every weapon, seen in isolation, must be "equal" to any other weapon.

That would be fine for a mod but is not what we're doing here. The intellect attribute is a bit more complex than club-on-head.

And yes, that includes figuring out when a situation warrants using a weapon other than the stun baton.

So are you saying that a top tier stun baton fully modded has the same damage than a tier 1 primitive bow (actually has less, because I'm not taking into account a fully perked tier 1 primitive bow, which beats the baton in everything but maybe a bit in speed----> not really, as the bow gets pretty fast fully perked and 'booked').

Forget the bow. The baton tier 6 is WORSE than an stone axe and kills less both fully perked and booked (they are similar in stats but the fire mod makes the stone axe go on top. FACT. Tested. So what is your (TFP) point?

I've never seen that bad of a balance on class weapons in any game. Low damage weapons need to be 30-50% less powerful than it's peers in videogames (I actually exaggerate, weapon types in Diablo and Skyrim and Titan Quest and Torchlight and Fire Emblem and whatever you throw at me are usually on the 25%-30% difference) . You made it 400% less + vs a club, 500%+ vs a sledge. There's no excuse here. (baton tier 6 fully modded has 20 entity damage, steel club fully modded around 75-100+. Sledge is even stronger).

I used to agree with you. And then I tried full INT build baton-turrets only. 

It's crap. I stand corrected from my asumptions that all 3 would fend off an horde. They do not. but not only they (int weapons) do not, but they don't kill that much either. They do delay them a bit.... but that's it.

As I said, telemetry the hell out of the baton and you will see that its uses are none to never. Sometimes yeah, because the repulsor is very cool and electrocution effect is nice. But you soon realize that not even the Lord will save you from death (Lord sledge and Lord turret) . 

My next test will be horde night level 300 every perk and book unlocked of machine gun+ sledge VS baton + turrets (top tier ammo and full books ). I know the answer. Even if they were equal, which they are not (they should fall short by a lot in kills) they will never have the mobility of the rest of the builds rendering it innefective in many parts of the night AND in POI Clearing (which does not really matter in this case).

So the test will force a funnel base, or else any other base will spit on INT even further. 

Maybe the drone should stay on INT. 

Solution? How about the baton (edit: meaning tier 6 stun baton fully modded) has around the same damage as a lvl6 baseball bat? (2nd tier) Good as it should be but not much beheading going on. I dig it. 

 

[Matt115]

Maybe the nightclub girl had a thing for guys in hazmat suits. Surely we wouldn't see some long fingernail scratches here and there?

@SnowDog1942 hacked you account or what? XD 

Ironically, that and rabbits were discussed yesterday, but don't hold your breath.

@faatal please no , please better add zombie gator  i Beg you ! 

So are you saying that a top tier stun baton fully modded has the same damage than a tier 1 primitive bow (actually has less, because I'm not taking into account a fully perked tier 1 primitive bow, which beats the baton in everything but maybe a bit in speed----> not really, as the bow gets pretty fast fully perked and 'booked').

Forget the bow. The baton tier 6 is WORSE than an stone axe and kills less both fully perked and booked (they are similar in stats but the fire mod makes the stone axe go on top. FACT. Tested. So what is your (TFP) point?

I've never seen that bad of a balance on class weapons in any game. Low damage weapons need to be 30-50% less powerful than it's peers in videogames (I actually exaggerate, weapon types in Diablo and Skyrim and Titan Quest and Torchlight and Fire Emblem and whatever you throw at me are usually on the 25%-30% difference) . You made it 400% less + vs a club, 500%+ vs a sledge. There's no excuse here. (baton tier 6 fully modded has 20 entity damage, steel club fully modded around 75-100+. Sledge is even stronger).

I used to agree with you. And then I tried full INT build baton-turrets only. 

It's crap. I stand corrected from my asumptions that all 3 would fend off an horde. They do not. but not only they (int weapons) do not, but they don't kill that much either. They do delay them a bit.... but that's it.

As I said, telemetry the hell out of the baton and you will see that its uses are none to never. Sometimes yeah, because the repulsor is very cool and electrocution effect is nice. But you soon realize that not even the Lord will save you from death (Lord sledge and Lord turret) . 

My next test will be horde night level 300 every perk and book unlocked of machine gun+ sledge VS baton + turrets (top tier ammo and full books ). I know the answer. Even if they were equal, which they are not (they should fall short by a lot in kills) they will never have the mobility of the rest of the builds rendering it innefective in many parts of the night AND in POI Clearing (which does not really matter in this case).

So the test will force a funnel base, or else any other base will spit on INT even further. 

Maybe the drone should stay on INT. 

Solution? How about the baton has around the same damage as a lvl6 baseball bat? (2nd tier) Good as it should be but not much beheading going on. I dig it. 

YEEEZ I GAVE ME IDEA : police nighstick connected with teaser 0.0 it could be something weaker baseball bat but high electric dmg and high stun dmg

 

[BFT2020]

Even if they were equal, which they are not (they should fall short by a lot in kills) they will never have the mobility of the rest of the builds rendering it innefective in many parts of the night AND in POI Clearing (which does not really matter in this case).

weird, we must be playing different games as I did not have any issues clearing out POIs and defending against hordes when I spec’d into Int as my main build.

 

[dcsobral]

So are you saying that a top tier stun baton fully modded has the same damage than a tier 1 primitive bow (actually has less, because I'm not taking into account a fully perked tier 1 primitive bow, which beats the baton in everything but maybe a bit in speed----> not really, as the bow gets pretty fast fully perked and 'booked').

Forget the bow. The baton tier 6 is WORSE than an stone axe and kills less both fully perked and booked (they are similar in stats but the fire mod makes the stone axe go on top. FACT. Tested. So what is your (TFP) point?

I've never seen that bad of a balance on class weapons in any game. Low damage weapons need to be 30-50% less powerful than it's peers in videogames (I actually exaggerate, weapon types in Diablo and Skyrim and Titan Quest and Torchlight and Fire Emblem and whatever you throw at me are usually on the 25%-30% difference) . You made it 400% less + vs a club, 500%+ vs a sledge. There's no excuse here. (baton tier 6 fully modded has 20 entity damage, steel club fully modded around 75-100+. Sledge is even stronger).

I used to agree with you. And then I tried full INT build baton-turrets only. 

It's crap. I stand corrected from my asumptions that all 3 would fend off an horde. They do not. but not only they (int weapons) do not, but they don't kill that much either. They do delay them a bit.... but that's it.

As I said, telemetry the hell out of the baton and you will see that its uses are none to never. Sometimes yeah, because the repulsor is very cool and electrocution effect is nice. But you soon realize that not even the Lord will save you from death (Lord sledge and Lord turret) . 

My next test will be horde night level 300 every perk and book unlocked of machine gun+ sledge VS baton + turrets (top tier ammo and full books ). I know the answer. Even if they were equal, which they are not (they should fall short by a lot in kills) they will never have the mobility of the rest of the builds rendering it innefective in many parts of the night AND in POI Clearing (which does not really matter in this case).

So the test will force a funnel base, or else any other base will spit on INT even further. 

Maybe the drone should stay on INT. 

Solution? How about the baton (edit: meaning tier 6 stun baton fully modded) has around the same damage as a lvl6 baseball bat? (2nd tier) Good as it should be but not much beheading going on. I dig it. 

Curious that the fireman mod makes the stone axe go over the stun baton, since it decreases the amount of damage to entities. The stone axe at quality 6 does 945 damage per minute, and the quality 6 stun baton does 1134 damage per minute (random stats not counted). There's no perks or magazines increasing the damage of either, though there's  a magazine increasing the speed of the stone axe by 5% (maybe -- it's about fireaxes, not sure the stone axe is included), which amounts to 47 damage per minute which is not enough to surpass the stun baton. Other than that, any mods ought to benefit the stun baton more than the stone axe. Perhaps you got a bad stun baton in your test?

But I'm surprised you had any trouble fending off a horde with the stun baton, because I could do so easily. The stun baton will stun every nearby zombie, and throw them away, so it's trivial to make a base where any pressure from zombies is relieved by dropping them to the ground so they have to go around to you again, and having a robotic sledge hitting them on their way back to you. Not to mention electrical traps, since they are part of the Int build and you get up to 50% XP from their kills.

Then you compare the stun baton with other weapons. 400% less than clubs? The base damage of the baseball bat (the club at the same tier as the stun baton) is 17.4, and the stun baton's 10.8. That's not even 50% less (or 100% more). And that does not even account for speed. Your math is just wrong.

As for your next test, first make sure you are using the repulsor mod on the stun baton and taking nerd tats, plus using fort bites and recog (physician) and electrical traps on the Int horde night, and not doing so on the machine gun test.

Though using electrical traps is kind of OP. I made an AFK base with them and during horde night I just fly around with the free camera to watch the carnage. Then again, Double Robotic Turrets is also very OP, as is the stun baton with repulsor mod and nerd tats.

And for POI clearance? Yeah, the stun baton is not the best weapon, just like the club is not the best melee weapon to use on horde night.

 

[Junuxx]

This is still more of a dev history or chronicle than a dev "diary" (from diarium, daily), isn't it?

I feel awkward asking for things that must have been asked hundreds of times already, like an ETA. But I'm not digging through 51 pages of posts, and without a FAQ or clear status in the first post, how else am I supposed to find out?

 

[MechanicalLens]

This is still more of a dev history or chronicle than a dev "diary" (from diarium, daily), isn't it?

I feel awkward asking for things that must have been asked hundreds of times already, like an ETA. But I'm not digging through 51 pages of posts, and without a FAQ or clear status in the first post, how else am I supposed to find out?

By "ETA" if you're asking when A20 might be released, nobody knows. When it's done basically. Could be a month (very doubtful imo), or two months, or three, or six+ months from now. TFP have stopped giving out release windows or exact dates years ago due to very understandable reasons.