2.6 Difficulty Changes

[Kyoji]

True when it happens on the odd playthrough. I certainly don't get an early game toilet pistol every time I play and the primitive level of progression doesn't often get skipped entirely. Now put T1 pistols, shotguns, rifles, and machine guns in certain POIs and you'll pretty much be skipping the primitive stage every single playthrough.

Sure if you can beat the Golden Knight as soon as you enter Elden Ring but most people can't so they build up before they kill. The point is that yes in some situations there will be people who could get those early T1 weapons on day 1 which a lot of luck or skill but that would be the minority.

Plus it only saves you less than a week about of time. Hardly too OP. If anything progression is still too fast. I can get to the next tier of weapon by Day 2.

 

[Roland]

Sure if you can beat the Golden Knight as soon as you enter Elden Ring but most people can't so they build up before they kill

I bet if Elden Ring employed a voxel world a lot more people could beat that Golden Knight as soon as they enter....

 

[Kyoji]

I bet if Elden Ring employed a voxel world a lot more people could beat that Golden Knight as soon as they enter....

In this game time is a resource. If you spend hours trying to clear Navezgane corrections for some good loot then well on ya.

 

[meganoth]

Sure if you can beat the Golden Knight as soon as you enter Elden Ring but most people can't so they build up before they kill. The point is that yes in some situations there will be people who could get those early T1 weapons on day 1 which a lot of luck or skill but that would be the minority.

But a "build up" is no "build up" if you can or have to jump over a whole tier of weapon qualities. When a class of weapons in a game is not viable, the solution for the game designer must be to make them viable, not to let players easily avoid them.

You are expected to survive and progress with pipe weapons quality by quality step in the first few days.

Plus it only saves you less than a week about of time. Hardly too OP. If anything progression is still too fast. I can get to the next tier of weapon by Day 2.

If you can do that I don't understand what your problem is. Aren't you saying right now "Progression is too fast. Proposed solution: Make it faster" ?

 

[theFlu]

If you can do that I don't understand what your problem is.

Probably mainly realism; that's at least what I'm getting from it - and can somewhat agree. It wouldn't break progress all that much if certain military loot etc was always a minimum of T1 (T0 being pipes). Say anything POI-T3 and above, military themed, those places shouldn't really hold stone axes or pipe machine guns, ever. Same with the sealed pre-apo shotty boxes ...

Progression wouldn't speed up too much, and at least non-cheesed, most of those places are a decent challenge.

 

[Kyoji]

If you can do that I don't understand what your problem is. Aren't you saying right now "Progression is too fast. Proposed solution: Make it faster" ?

The issue is realism to a degree and game logic in another. In EVERY other zombie survival game I can think of military bases have better loot than most other POIs. Generally speaking they do unless you are in the early game in which they do not. You could put toxic miasma around such locations to prevent early access and I wouldn't mind, but finding pipe weapons in the locations is just plain stupid.

If you have such locations and are able to explore them early on then they should offer as much. Otherwise put them in a toxic zone or something. It is a massive waste of time to do them early and it's counter intuitive to game logic.

 

[bartek251]

Zombies now deal significantly increased damage, and even though I had 75 damage reduction from armor, on Insane difficulty a group of 5 Ferals was able to quickly take out 150 health points from me, even though previously Ferals were unable to do anything to me on Insane difficulty, unless there were about 20 of them.
besides, it's much easier to attract screamers

 

[BFT2020]

True when it happens on the odd playthrough. I certainly don't get an early game toilet pistol every time I play

I had a streak of getting them very early (along with hunting knives), but I think that is because I typically play agility and deep cuts / gunslinger is an early perk I would invest in

 

[MiTHMoN]

You are expected to survive and progress with pipe weapons quality by quality step in the first few days.

I take a pipe weapon from the quest pipe bundle, then I loot something in the next tier. If I loot a higher quality pipe weapon along the way, sure, I replace my old pipe weapon, but "quality by quality step in the first few days" is a bit of a stretch. Especially considering a toilet pistol outclasses all pipe weapons, and you can get those on day 1.

 

[MiTHMoN]

As far as I understand the topic of this post, I agree.

A new player I'm playing with mentioned how there were Working Stiffs crates in the Shotgun Messiah factory. And I think it speaks to the issue 7DTD has with loot not matching the POI.

I like that filing cabinets and bookshelves have magazines/books. That's good. I like that kitchen cupboards and refrigerators and ovens have food-themed loot. That's good. It's good to have cohesion between what room you're looting and the loot you're getting.

To that end, yes I think "military / police" themed POIs should have guns. Not stone axes or pipe weapons.

And it would make a lot more sense that those "hobbled together" survivor-type junk POIs should have pipe weapons. (I don't know any of them by name, but you know the ones with dew collectors, etc. I can think of at least 4 specific POIs of that theme currently).

There's good cohesion with Savage Country having clothing loot, and Crack-a-book having magazine/book loot, but some of the other places need more loot cohesion.

 

[Lax]

Would be nice to see pipe weapons get a buff to make them more viable/attractive. Because they're so ineffective the temptation to completely ignore them is too great.

Be curious to know if anyone actually has success using pipe weapons, other than the pipe machine gun, and don't mind them in their current state.

 

[4sheetzngeegles]

Be curious to know if anyone actually has success using pipe weapons, other than the pipe machine gun, and don't mind them in their current state.

Well, I hope this doesn't get nerfed, how low can it go. sling shot maybe.

I like to use the pipe baton when charging the spitter, the wide cross swipe
often dispels the swarm. and in the time he draws back to exhale again I
stab him in the head with a high tier bone knife because it has a fast power
strike reload.

For the Pipe machine gun, I have to admit This one I cheat on. I turn it into
a single shot 15 round rifle, that can be expanded. The rate of wasted fire,
and the recoil, especially if not standing still, is like shooting an uzi bb gun.
No thanks. Pop on a 4x scope, and it actually starts to make sense.