PC My A18 feedback

i am confused with the struggle people have with cooking. i get heaps of recipe schematics in cupboards, and the buried supplies gives a recipe nearly every time.
i do struggle early game to get enough farm plots going for ingredients, but not recipes.

am i missing something?
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Recipes are easy to come by and I always invest at the very least 1 point in cooking. It's just hard early game to have a steady source of food until the farm is up and running, as you said. Buying canned food from vending machines fixes the issue but as I feel it's cheating for me I try and not buy from vending machines. I choose to struggle until the farm provides enough food. Makes the game a little more challenging and fun you know.

 
Remember when the zombies would do this in A16? lol :-PA16 was way to easy due to the horrible AI.

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A16 AI - is the beginning problems of A17-A18.

You remember any problems with AI in A15....or even A1 ?

 
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A16 AI had a very small chance for spinning zombies (less than 1 in 20) but had no super obvious exploits. The randomness of the AI in A16 is something I miss.

Also, spam carafting and auto mining were fixed in A16.

 
A16 AI - is the beginning problems of A17-A18.
You remember any problems with AI in A15....or even A1 ?
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Yes. The two big problems that AI always had since the beginning were fixed in A17.

1) Entities got stuck on terrain and could not path through the world very well.

2) If zombies couldn’t reach you they just stood still or spun in circles below you.

A17 brought new issues to be sure but many of those new issues have been fixed since then.

 
A16 AI had a very small chance for spinning zombies (less than 1 in 20) but had no super obvious exploits. The randomness of the AI in A16 is something I miss.
Also, spam carafting and auto mining were fixed in A16.
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Zombies walking in large circles during the day was uncommon but still present but the worst game killer was their complete inability to find you at night (on non blood moon nights). Six days out of seven all you had to do was crouch right next to them and they would instantly lose you. Killed the nights for me.

 
Yes. The two big problems that AI always had since the beginning were fixed in A17.
1) Entities got stuck on terrain and could not path through the world very well.

2) If zombies couldn’t reach you they just stood still or spun in circles below you.

A17 brought new issues to be sure but many of those new issues have been fixed since then.
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Unfortunately, for me personally, intelligence at A17-18 is the worst I've seen in games for 40 years.

And not just for me... Come on - let's be honest with ourselves!

In the end, i don't care how complex and effective it is. The way they behave - it seems very stupid, because it immediately catches the eye. I don't believe this is purely subjective ;)

Which is better - a stuck on terrain zombie or a sitting pecking at a ladder?

It turns out that, in fact, the main problem was not solved at all.

Regarding the second point... it turned out that before the zombies could eventually get to me in a rough way, but now they do not - they walk in ant mazes and jump out of the window when i go into the room.

To sum up: - It's not how smart the AI is that matters, but how it seems to the player. (what an illusion it represents for the player)

Thank You, Roland for your work, i sometimes just wonder how you can be everywhere at once! :)

 
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I just can’t disagree more N. Sorry, but I think the current AI is light years beyond what we had. Pathing is of utmost importance and whatever it is that catches your eye doesn’t trigger me. Oh yeah....and not only me......

I see zombies that are relentless and horrifying in how they get to you. Sorry if they don’t act like your preconceived notions of how zombies should act. I’ve decided to treat these monsters the way they are presented and not worry about how zombies have been presented in the past. What’s better? To stick rigidly to a definition of how zombies “should” act and because of that hate the game or to free your mind about TFPs version of monsters and enjoy the challenges and fun of how they behave?

 
It doesn't matter what you or I or Joel think... then, after the release, look at YouTube - for You and for Joel - everything will be explained...and ridicule.

And, believe me, it won't be nice for me to realize that i was right.

You probably think i want to quarrel with You. No - I'm really worried about the future of the game that i Love.

(I read the Russian Wikipedia section about the game "GORE US". Developers repeat their mistakes.)

 
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Agree with Roland. The zombies now are much more insistent on getting to me. Since I upped the spawn rate (4x) it's much more dangerous to go into a POI without first clearing out a 1- or 2-block radius because they will come to the noise inside the POI if they wander near and they will find the entrance and they will surprise the F*** out of me when they show up in a previously-cleared room.

On horde night, we're currently in a tower/POI base where they just can't reach us and they are much, much more effective now at tearing the crap out of the base trying to collapse it on us.

They even will walk around the rim of my pit mine to get to the ladder so they can climb down and eat me (versus just dropping over the edge). Step 1 for mining: put a junk turret in the pit, pointing at the ladder.

More on topic with OP - one level in Master Chef is a must-have if you don't plan on surviving on canned food. And when you see both Master Chef (or any perk) and a schematic in the unlock screen, it means either will work. Read the descriptions of the perk levels to see what unlocks at which level.

 
Yeah... they have become smarter...

...but why are they batter into a tree away from me?

 
It doesn't matter what you or I or Joel think... then, after the release, look at YouTube - for You and for Joel - everything will be explained...and ridicule.And, believe me, it won't be nice for me to realize that i was right.

You probably think i want to quarrel with You. No - I'm really worried about the future of the game that i Love.

(I read the Russian Wikipedia section about the game "GORE US". Developers repeat their mistakes.)
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The game is enjoying more long lasting popularity than ever before. I doubt it is in spite of the zombie behavior.

 
I just can’t disagree more N. Sorry, but I think the current AI is light years beyond what we had. Pathing is of utmost importance and whatever it is that catches your eye doesn’t trigger me. Oh yeah....and not only me......
I see zombies that are relentless and horrifying in how they get to you. Sorry if they don’t act like your preconceived notions of how zombies should act. I’ve decided to treat these monsters the way they are presented and not worry about how zombies have been presented in the past. What’s better? To stick rigidly to a definition of how zombies “should” act and because of that hate the game or to free your mind about TFPs version of monsters and enjoy the challenges and fun of how they behave?
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Agreed 100%. I just cannot understand how anyone could think that the AI prior to A18 is better, especially in A16. I'm still waiting on a well thought out and articulated argument as to why it was better.

 
....I'm still waiting on a well thought out and articulated argument as to why it was better.
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...but why are they batter into a tree away from me?
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.... a sitting pecking at a ladder
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Regarding the second point... it turned out that before the zombies could eventually get to me in a rough way, but now they do not - they walk in ant mazes and jump out of the window when i go into the room.
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And i'm not saying that A16 had a good AI - i say that it started to deteriorate there.

Well, in A1 there was a good AI - there they started running in unlit places.

it's strange you guys can't see all this :D
 
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...but why are they batter into a tree away from me?
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Some do but not all. This is in response to feedback from A17 that people didn't want all zombies to be able to follow long convoluted pathways to the player. The devs agreed and so added some random behaviors and also made a chance for zombies to forget long pathways and go into destruction mode. It isn't every zombie going after trees in the opposite direction of you. It is a variety of behavior ranging from stupid to very canny. Also, its better for a zombie to fell a tree and keep moving rather than get stuck on it.

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.... a sitting pecking at a ladder
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Bad translation. Sorry, not sure what you mean.

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Regarding the second point... it turned out that before the zombies could eventually get to me in a rough way, but now they do not - they walk in ant mazes and jump out of the window when i go into the room.
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See point one. You are going to get a mix. I've seen what you describe AND I've seen them come straight for me. I've seen some walk through an open door to get me and others try to go through the wall next to the door. At least it is a mix which actually is more creepy when they act so bizarre and alien.

And i'm not saying that A16 had a good AI - i say that it started to deteriorate there.
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There was nothing relatable between A16 and A17. A17 was brand new code. A16 was an extension of the original code that always had been in the game. It didn't start to deteriorate in A16 and get worse in A17 and A18. A16 was the end of the old pathing system. A17 was the beginning of the new pathing system-- completely new. Alpha 18 is an iteration of A17 that brings more randomness and forgetfulness into their behavior.

 
Some do but not all.

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:) I love this...

Some do but not all. This is in response to feedback from A17 that people didn't want all zombies to be able to follow long convoluted pathways to the player. The devs agreed and so added some random behaviors and also made a chance for zombies to forget long pathways and go into destruction mode. It isn't every zombie going after trees in the opposite direction of you. It is a variety of behavior ranging from stupid to very canny. Also, its better for a zombie to fell a tree and keep moving rather than get stuck on it.
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See point one. You are going to get a mix. I've seen what you describe AND I've seen them come straight for me. I've seen some walk through an open door to get me and others try to go through the wall next to the door. At least it is a mix which actually is more creepy when they act so bizarre and alien.
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Yes, i am aware of the technical features, but still - they batter into a tree, whatever it means.

Ok...Before that, they were stuck in the bushes... some but not all ;) .

Bad translation. Sorry, not sure what you mean.
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this

 
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Stairs is the word you want. Not ladders.

The reason they dig through stairs is because the pathing code tells them to dig if they detect a player below them. They can’t tell the difference between you being below them underground and you being below them downstairs.

Faatal knows about this and will get it sorted when there is time.

But better that they sometimes dig inappropriately than that they never dig at all.

Digging & leaping zombies is another huge plus imo over the previous pathing code.

 
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I had one z from a wandering horde turn tail and sprint away after his arm was blown off! there is certainly randomness to their behaviour.

its ok, he came back (eventually) so I didn't have to chase him :-)

 
I had one z from a wandering horde turn tail and sprint away after his arm was blown off! there is certainly randomness to their behaviour. its ok, he came back (eventually) so I didn't have to chase him :-)
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I’ve read reports of people losing their spear because the zombie took off with it stuck in them and they couldn’t find him afterward....lol

 
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