PC Junk turret poll
- Thread starter Synvastian
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Synvastian
New member
he's gonna want costs like ammo production, time spent mining for coal/nitrate vs purely iron, the fact bullets need brass....pretty much everything except the actual stats of the items
forgoing of course, damage over time, reload speeds, accessibility to armor piercing (turret gets NONE) being made from iron only actually strains base defense instead of helping, coal and nitrate contribute nothing to base defense except as parts to make ammo and springs{coal} same as brass.
the whole issue has so many facets to it, he'll just use one I haven't covered and try and make us look dumb (I may be, just so we are clear...)
forgoing of course, damage over time, reload speeds, accessibility to armor piercing (turret gets NONE) being made from iron only actually strains base defense instead of helping, coal and nitrate contribute nothing to base defense except as parts to make ammo and springs{coal} same as brass.
the whole issue has so many facets to it, he'll just use one I haven't covered and try and make us look dumb (I may be, just so we are clear...)
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LordSoth01
New member
I actually found the junk turrets to be a very nice thing. Wasn't sure how I'd like them til I started using them. Im a fan of various turret type classes in games, going back to at least the Animists in Dark Age of Camelot, so it was an unexpected and welcome surprise.
Crater Creator
Community Moderator
Maybe they're just too common. Playing on default difficulty, 50% loot, and not going out of my way to find them, I've stumbled on four, level one junk turrets after the first couple weeks. I was kind of like, I guess I'm doing a turret build now. It was more than another week after that until I could even get a bicycle, actively trying every avenue to acquire one, and I'm still short of being able to power anything. So in comparison, these junk turrets felt like stumbling on alien technology, way beyond what I could do myself. In that sense, they haven't 'fit' well.
In terms of balance, they are pretty powerful, but only having one active at a time curbs that power. I find the biggest limitation is the clip size, and having to pick them up to reload them. I could've designed my base to better accommodate reloading and their limited range, though.
In terms of balance, they are pretty powerful, but only having one active at a time curbs that power. I find the biggest limitation is the clip size, and having to pick them up to reload them. I could've designed my base to better accommodate reloading and their limited range, though.
So you did a turret build instead of a bicycle build :cocksure: .
I get what you are saying, but you have a strange way of comparing. How many AKs have you found after the first couple weeks?
Laz Man
Fun Pimps Staff
Have you seen my latest horde night vid? I stumbled upon a good method using electrical defenses to buy time for turret reloads. Skip to the 8 minute part where I start alternating the power on/off.
https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?135281-LazMan-vs-Day-42-Horde
People who say Insane is anything more than just making them extreme bullet and damage sponges make me REALLY laugh.Anyone playing on less than Insane makes me laugh, m8.
You're not doing anything by playing Insane except nerfing your hits and boosting their hits.
Their AI isnt different. Their numbers arent different.
A17 made them into ridiculous damage sponges at default and A18 is only a hair better. Insane make the game pretty stupid, IMO.
SenpaiThatIngnoresYou
New member
So the junk turret should have multiple types of ammo. I think for it's ap ammo it should use darts made from the forge, for it's hp ammo it should be glass. The normal junk turret ammo, and fourth: Stones. The downside of stones is that it will wear them out faster.
Each point of the perk will unlock and allow the usage of the different ammo: But only when the correct mod is built and installed into the turret. The different turret mods will require junk turret parts, so now you have a reason to scrap old ones.
Next: the turret needs a means to reload it without picking it up. Picking up the turret to reload is annoying.
Finally the turret needs programmable modes of firing. What i mean is telling a turret to: only shoot zombies, only shoot vultures, shoot everything would be beneficial. Maybe this can be done by a craft able turret mod as well?
The thing about the turrets being "op" is that they are the projectile weapon for the int tree. If you go int then you are losing the perk benefits for: Machine guns, shotguns, pistols, and bows. So nerfing the turrets too hard will kill all the nerds out there.
So to balance it out, Turret benefits need to be locked behind perks and special mods, mods that can only be crafted from perks, and are not found by schematics. So for a crafting game, in the crafting tree, with the main weapon for crafting builds: Why not lock the potential behind crafted mods? It makes sense to me when i look at it that way.
Each point of the perk will unlock and allow the usage of the different ammo: But only when the correct mod is built and installed into the turret. The different turret mods will require junk turret parts, so now you have a reason to scrap old ones.
Next: the turret needs a means to reload it without picking it up. Picking up the turret to reload is annoying.
Finally the turret needs programmable modes of firing. What i mean is telling a turret to: only shoot zombies, only shoot vultures, shoot everything would be beneficial. Maybe this can be done by a craft able turret mod as well?
The thing about the turrets being "op" is that they are the projectile weapon for the int tree. If you go int then you are losing the perk benefits for: Machine guns, shotguns, pistols, and bows. So nerfing the turrets too hard will kill all the nerds out there.
So to balance it out, Turret benefits need to be locked behind perks and special mods, mods that can only be crafted from perks, and are not found by schematics. So for a crafting game, in the crafting tree, with the main weapon for crafting builds: Why not lock the potential behind crafted mods? It makes sense to me when i look at it that way.
I assume they use the same "magic" that a pneumatic nailgun without a hose (or expended nails) uses.
Again, full realism isn't that much fun in a game.
Man...I really want to use this nailgun for this mine.
:: takes 60 in-game minutes to load a gas generator, battery bank, compressor, hoses, fittings kit, boxes of nails, wood, t-square, cement mixer, cement, sand, and other accessories into his bike to go put up some walls around a mine ::
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seagas
New member
For those thinking the junk turret is OP, don't use it, to us occasional solo player users, it's like having a teammate who has your back. They have limited range, limited to one operational at a time. Maybe limit them to single player games only if they are OP in multi-player games.
Crater Creator
Community Moderator
Zero. I found one, level two hunting rifle the second week, and that was the only firearm I found in that time period. That seemed suitably balanced to me (keeping in mind the 50% loot), to have a gun but certainly not a wide variety of guns nor a surplus of guns in that time. The four junk turrets... well I was thankful for them because I wanted to try them out and my base design included spots for turrets. But I think it's fair to say they gave me a huge, honestly undeserved advantage against those early hordes. Again, the only thing limiting their effectiveness was that they had a limited clip and were awkward to reload.
Big ol' lawnmower size, laser sighted, running on "love", stun and stagger givin', small clip havin' Magical Turret you can poop out of your pocket.
Sounds legit. I really don't see how they, or the auto-shotgun turrets from A16 that I've never used for the same reasons, even work. Here in the PRE apocalypse.....I ain't got nothing like that.
As someone said, "too much realism can ruin a game". I'd agree. I guess it's where we draw the line.
I think there's a greater chance for the game to inflict what I consider the games biggest achievement and what it should do to a gamer, and that's "Gripping Fear", without those turrets. Therefore making it "out of place" for lack of a better expression.
I think the overall potential "fear factor" of being in that situation is lessened on an immersion level. At least for me.
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Laz Man
Fun Pimps Staff
Altho I am pro turret....
In comparison, the latest Borderlands game has the soldier class with a deployable turret as one of its special abilities but only allows it to be deployed for a limited time before recalling it.
On the flip side, the engineer class in Valves Team Fortress has a deployable turret that only requires ammo/repair and can be left up indefinitely.
My gut tells me it will be left alone the way it is for game balance reasons, +/- some minor balancing adjustments (especially in pvp)
I could list loads of games where people can pull a huge turret out of their pocket all the way from Ratchet and Clank to the very ultimate example of an Engineer class in Tribes spitting out a mobile inventory and proceeding to spam the area with turrets.
There's loads of video games with players pulling amazingly huge turrets right out of their pocket. We could go on for days with that.
No, I doubt it will be changed or removed either. I think it shouldn't even be there and just doesn't fit the game, IMO. But we're all entitled to our opinion on that. I can pretend they're not there and just not use them, ultimately.
Crater Creator
Community Moderator
That could be viable, once I get to electricity. Since I'm still in a lower-tech 'era', I'm not to a point of having traps I can turn on and off from a distance. I do like your use of giant 'stairs' they have to jump up; I'd gone with a simpler but less durable ladder climb.Have you seen my latest horde night vid? I stumbled upon a good method using electrical defenses to buy time for turret reloads. Skip to the 8 minute part where I start alternating the power on/off.
https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?135281-LazMan-vs-Day-42-Horde
Since you asked...
My first idea was to put turrets on either end of this trench, but the range was too short. My next idea was to put them up top on the central platform, where I stand, but they don't aim down sharply enough. So I placed them at ground level, near the central platform with two facing in and two facing down the corridors. They hold about 60x4=240 rounds, and I use all of those rounds (along with plenty of ammo for handheld weapons) before the horde is over.
With 100% loot I find a lot of weapons in the first few weeks (there is still a bug with the loot abundance setting) and also sold many already. So I don't have hard numbers but subjective impression is that I find a lot of turrets, more than of any other weapon. Maybe the probability of finding turrets was doubled because the INT player can use two.
PS: I think a good balance would be if unperked turret does stagger less often and you get to the current state after investing 3 points in INT and 2 points in the turret perk.
Just look at the AK for comparison if you think the turret is hopelessly OP.
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Laz Man
Fun Pimps Staff
If you spec into turrets, their active range also increases so you will have more options where you set them up.That could be viable, once I get to electricity. Since I'm still in a lower-tech 'era', I'm not to a point of having traps I can turn on and off from a distance. I do like your use of giant 'stairs' they have to jump up; I'd gone with a simpler but less durable ladder climb.
Since you asked...
My first idea was to put turrets on either end of this trench, but the range was too short. My next idea was to put them up top on the central platform, where I stand, but they don't aim down sharply enough. So I placed them at ground level, near the central platform with two facing in and two facing down the corridors. They hold about 60x4=240 rounds, and I use all of those rounds (along with plenty of ammo for handheld weapons) before the horde is over.