PC Do you guys like this new leveling system ?

[Voqar]

A17 is the best version of the game yet, by far.

As a bonus, the amount of crying from cupcakes brings me extra joy.

I hope the Pimps stick to their guns instead of caving to whiners.

7DTD is a game in development and what is most clear is that MANY people should not play early access games because they have no idea what "in development" actually means - nor do they even remotely grasp that this game isn't just minecraft with different graphics.

 

[Jugginator]

I couldn't mod my game enough in 16 (and same with friends on servers) to come close to a remote challenging survival difficulty. 17 has hit all the heads on each nail this time around. I didn;t die in 16 for months, just died 3 times with the new nightmare running on Warrior. Think I may make the days longer and make just ferals nightmare speed lol. Jog during the day is nice. But I am loving it doesn;t take 1 or 2 ingame days to become a god, that's what make me put the game on the shelf in 16.. it just got too damn boring too fast. 17 it never gets boring lol.

 

[SenpaiThatIngnoresYou]

I couldn't mod my game enough in 16 (and same with friends on servers) to come close to a remote challenging survival difficulty. 17 has hit all the heads on each nail this time around. I didn;t die in 16 for months, just died 3 times with the new nightmare running on Warrior. Think I may make the days longer and make just ferals nightmare speed lol. Jog during the day is nice. But I am loving it doesn;t take 1 or 2 ingame days to become a god, that's what make me put the game on the shelf in 16.. it just got too damn boring too fast. 17 it never gets boring lol.

Its more of a horror game now. In the previous updates it was an ok crafting game. It was a "lets build a pretty house that can survive an attack" simulator. Now it is legitimately creepy and scary at times. The vulture hordes are creepy, the random bear + dog horde is creepy, the morning dog visits are creepy, the wolves are creepy, and the poi's are suspenseful.

So nerfing the player in a survival game makes sense. You are not supposed to tank through a house, it is supposed to be scary. Getting jumped by a feral edger is a serious concern now. In a 16 it was a stupidly easy game. leveling did not matter. There were youtubers who had 70 skill points that they did not use, now leveling is an important thing and no one wastes skill points.

 

[Kalarro]

Its more of a horror game now. In the previous updates it was an ok crafting game. It was a "lets build a pretty house that can survive an attack" simulator. Now it is legitimately creepy and scary at times. The vulture hordes are creepy, the random bear + dog horde is creepy, the morning dog visits are creepy, the wolves are creepy, and the poi's are suspenseful.

Prefering one type or another is subjective ofc. What isnt subjective is that there are a lot of better "horror"/combat games out there, but this was the best crafting/survival game. So, even understanding some players may prefer the combat aproach, I think the game should keep focusing on its building survival aspect, since it is where it excels.

 

[Kaiote]

Prefering one type or another is subjective ofc. What isnt subjective is that there are a lot of better "horror"/combat games out there, but this was the best crafting/survival game. So, even understanding some players may prefer the combat aproach, I think the game should keep focusing on its building survival aspect, since it is where it excels.

Literally every sentence fragment of this post is purely subjective.

 

[Kalarro]

Literally every sentence fragment of this post is purely subjective.

You are right, but I think it's also clear what I mean. Prefering cars or bikes is totally subjective. If a ferrari or a kia is better is strictly speaking also subjective.... but the ferrari is better.

 

[Ghostlight]

What did you have to find before ? Gun parts? Now you have to find mods

No you don't. Put points into Daring Adventurer and run trader quests for a day or two and you will have more mods than you could ever fit onto a hundreds guns.

The simple fact is that come level 100 the player will have everything in the game at top tier, and all the mods he wants. There is absolutely no need to explore or go looting ever again. The world has NOTHING the player wants except glue and gunpowder. Nothing.

And for me, this point in my play-through happened just after day 30 when I had looted HALF of the town I spawned beside, and nowhere else. Shortest play-through ever.

I'd love MM to explain why he thinks never having to loot in the game after hitting level 100 is good, and where the replayability is. Seems to me this is an elephant in the room that TFP are simply ignoring.

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Thanks. If your not a min maxer type you will love the new system. We're balancing it and improving it.

I have been saying this all along, except I have been describing those who WILL like the new system as casual players. However the game's long-standing player base who have supported it it and played it for many years now, are generally NOT casual players.

 

[Doctor3D]

Maybe we need to only have 1 or two attributes you can go to 10 on, so that people actually have to decide if they want to suck at guns in order to craft the best stuff.

I would love for you to try this. I know that the idea itself is probably not a very popular one to even mention. But, I think once people tried a specialization like this (if done right) where the top tiers of everything cannot be had by one single character - and say only 2 or 3 unique max tiers per character build class would make the game much more repayable and you wouldn't be so darn OP so quickly.

I know it takes time - but I think it's worth a try. You could even just spit-ball an internal proof of concept and see how it plays out.

If it were me - I would love to try a mixture of various class types such as Tank, Stealth, Slayer, Miner, Carpenter, etc etc

Then you give different perk paths for each of them. The same overall perks - but a different path and gate. So a Stealth character would maybe not be able to get a forge until i dunno let's say level 40 - but a Builder could get one on Level 10. The Stealth could get perks earlier like the Hidden Strike, possibly a archery or knife perk or some Agility perks than the builder.

The max tiers could then be used for specialization. A Tank character might be able to max out the health or armor perks to the max tier but a Stealth character couldn't.

By doing this you create different gate levels for different characters. If someone wants to play a particular way - they can pick that class and get 'there' faster. This still allows balance and in my opinion is even easier to balance and it also provides much more replay value.

Just try something like that..even if it's on paper or in your head..just think about it. Lots more options and could make the game much more deep and fun.

 

[Nighty]

Personaly, taking away book recipes completly killed any will to go out of base into cities, there's literaly nothing to gain from exploring unless some rng gods shine and give something good early game, the more into the game, the more worthless pois become.

Zombies stacking inside eachother and getting group damage to bust thro anything that is not a steel door or reinforced concrete just make us decide that is better to suicide and wait for morning to respawn than waste time and resources "defending". Zombies power and gating behind levels machines needed to improve base into anything capable to survive just make us skip first hordes.

For those 2 points above, please try the "the higher the level in something the more it costs points" strategy with removing the gating, this + stoping zombies from actualy stacking inside eachother would make the game much better.

 

[Gilthanaz]

#levelgates need to go (or seriously scaled down. Like, Forges-and-bikes-latest-with-level-10 down). Feels like a brick to the head every time when I check and think "Ah. 137 more Zeds to go". Or rather, an anchor on a necklace that makes the first 10 game hours a nuisance instead of fun.

If someone wants to have Strength 10 and nothing else at Level 11, let 'em. If I want to be very specialized in a thing with level 20, why not - let me build good stuff but I can't fight to save my life. If you want to "gate" certain things, go back to Skillbooks, that actually made a nice reason to "get out there" instead of holing up on the roof of a skyscraper

Oh, and Zombie Block damage should get lowered _at least_ by 50% or so. Being a threat? Okay, sounds good. Tearing apart a full concrete building in two in-game hours on the day 14 horde? Eh... no. Not masochistic enough to enjoy that.

 

[Davy Crockett]

I just feel like there are easy solutions to the stone axe power leveling.

Agreed. I'm not even in favor of having a crafting skill in the game; finding schematics unlocking some recipes with perks was fine. I just want to make the point that there's no dichotomy between spamcrafting and not having skills at all. A16 already had a hybrid system with skills yet no spamcrafting.

A few more ideas would be

- crafting exp gained depends on quality/quantity/rarity of ingredients or the base time it takes to craft the item

- scrapping tools that you loot raises crafting skill

- crafted items only give their full exp the first time or first few times you make them

- skill books that you can loot

- having a not-so-small chance to craft a higher quality item

- using a mining tool you crafted gives you crafting exp

Again, my only point is that it's not all black and white. There are many little nuances you could add to a system to balance it, you don't always need to scrap it completely.

 

[Corbit]

The real meat and potatoes in this last update is how they buffed slow metabolism and minor 69er. Those are perks to take now.

Its funny how MM talks about focusing on survival when they have skills like slow metabolism which make surviving insignificant. No doubt they will balance it by nerfing food and how easy it is to get.

 

[Kosmic Kerman]

Its funny how MM talks about focusing on survival when they have skills like slow metabolism which make surviving insignificant. No doubt they will balance it by nerfing food and how easy it is to get.

If you don’t like slow metabolism don’t take the perk. If you are just being passive aggressive, you are better off making the real criticism.

 

[Corbit]

If you don’t like slow metabolism don’t take the perk. If you are just being passive aggressive, you are better off making the real criticism.

It is a real criticism. The perk, and others like it, makes part of the game insignificant.

 

[Kalarro]

It is a real criticism. The perk, and others like it, makes part of the game insignificant.

Well, if getting perlks wouldnt make things easier, why would there even be perks?

Since I 1. dont have much trouble with food 2. like the need to still have to worry about it, I dont take the perk and can use it somewhere else.

 

[Corbit]

Well, if getting perlks wouldnt make things easier, why would there even be perks?
Since I 1. dont have much trouble with food 2. like the need to still have to worry about it, I dont take the perk and can use it somewhere else.

There is a difference between making the game a bit easier with each perk level and making part of the game insignificant.

I am the same as you, I don't have issues with food and so will never take that perk. The game has cooking which could easily be used to replace the perk while adding more depth to cooking.

 

[Ghostlight]

The problem with the INT tree is that everything that you can craft in the game is completely mapped out for you. This essentially makes every playthough the same.

I wish the devs would acknowledge this issue or at least tell us their feelings about it. Because right now from where I am sitting this is easily the biggest problem of all with A17. And the more you play A17 (especially the more you restart from day 1) the more this problem will start to eat away until you realize that the game has lost its replayability big time.

Prior to A17, I would have declared 7 Days my favorite video game of all time (I am 52 so I have played a lot of them, believe me). However if TFP stick to the mechanics of giving me every item in the game at exactly the same level every play-through - thus rendering looting pointless - I will be hard pushed to want to play further than a couple of full on play-throughs, I think. This breaks my heart.

The idea that choosing different perks for a different type of character can add replayability is an illusion. Firstly, I've played many playthroughs with groups and what I've noticed is that human nature dictates that people (generally) choose the same perks or very close to it on each playthrough.

This ties into what I was getting at when I called people who will enjoy A17 "casuals". You are of course free to place your early points anywhere you like, and the more casual player might see this as replayability ("this play-through I will be a Stealth assassin!"). However anyone who knows the game well knows tat all this does is make the early game even more tedious.

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A17 is the best version of the game yet, by far.
As a bonus, the amount of crying from cupcakes brings me extra joy.

You work for TFP, admit it.

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I couldn't mod my game enough in 16 (and same with friends on servers) to come close to a remote challenging survival difficulty. 17 has hit all the heads on each nail this time around.

Well this is bizarre since A17 becomes easier and less challenging than any alpha I have played before it, once you are past the first couple of weeks.

 

[Ghostlight]

It is a real criticism. The perk, and others like it, makes part of the game insignificant.

Food quickly becomes insignificant with or without this perk. I currently have 1500 meat in my storage box that I didn't even try to collect, it just happened. No need for it, and I have no points in Slow Metabolism either. Is this the time to mention that the game's best foods (like Meat Stew etc) are now pretty much useless? You will never let your max stamina fall low enough to make eating one worthwhile, so it is a total waste to ever make them. Again.....why is this good?

 

[HerrKingsley]

I couldn't mod my game enough in 16 (and same with friends on servers) to come close to a remote challenging survival difficulty.

In entityclasses.xml

Add this:

<entity_class name="zombieTemplateMale">

<property name="ApproachSpeed" value="2.2"/>

<property name="NightWanderSpeed" value="2.08"/>

<property name="NightApproachSpeed" value="3.1"/>

In items.xml

Add this:

<item id="71" name="handZombie">

<property name="DamageEntity" value="100" />

<property name="DamageBlock" value="500" />

In spawning.xml

Replace every biom with this::

<spawn maxcount="30" respawndelay="1"

You can thank me later!

 

[ktr]

There is a difference between making the game a bit easier with each perk level and making part of the game insignificant.
I am the same as you, I don't have issues with food and so will never take that perk. The game has cooking which could easily be used to replace the perk while adding more depth to cooking.

It probably could, for sure. With the perks split, it does allow for more player choice. People trait-ing high into INT can use master chef to manage their food needs, while those who would rather play more scavenger/nomad can take Slow Metabolism instead. I do think what food gives needs some more tweaking. Bacon and Eggs seems to be pretty OP for being a 1st level perk.