PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17
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DaVegaNL
Beloved Curmudgeon
I'm just wondering. What will they use to replace the plains biome? The forest biome? Both in Navezgane and in Random Gen.
The same applies to the maple forest biome. Will the game just be one big forest (be it either burned or with snow), and some desert here and there?
The same applies to the maple forest biome. Will the game just be one big forest (be it either burned or with snow), and some desert here and there?
Jost Amman
Well-known member
I can't understand why you're so worried... TFP are not dumb fools, they'll surely find a way to use the new A17 biome configuration in a nice way, that's what Joel said "Trust me the new art will make you quickly forget about the old stuff. One gorgeous forest is better than two ♥♥♥♥ty ones".
I'd say after so much time in development you either trust the devs will do a good job or you don't.
DaVegaNL
Beloved Curmudgeon
I'm not per se worried. I'm just wondering why the decision to cut 2 biomes was made all of a sudden (from our perspective). And this is not about trust, thank you, I was honestly wondering what they will do now.
But it's nice to see that my honest question gets twisted around and results in a semi-personal attack/strawman-galore. That seems to be the trend here on the forum.
Aldranon
New member
It's almost always best for some section of a group to find fault in what is made/presented/designed. If counter-points can be presented in a professional way and not childishly insulting, then it tends to be more useful.
The only exception I know if is in emergency situations. Discussion then can be disastrous.
The only exception I know if is in emergency situations. Discussion then can be disastrous.
Crater Creator
Community Moderator
Trying to blend more than 4 textures on one surface pass sounds bad anyway: it would become visually indistinct. What's the most the game would want to blend if it could? 6 textures? That would allow influence from the next and previous voxel in the x, y, & z dimensions. I assume different channels (diffuse, specular, normal, etc.) have to be rendered on different passes anyway.
Couldn't this new shader be written with some rules for which textures take priority, and just blend among the top 4? Again, I don't think players would even be aware of missing textures if they're already looking at a blend of 4 different ones.
The thing is, subbiomes aren't a substitute for biomes. There's less control over their shape, and as far as I know you can't have sub-subbiomes. That means, for example, a plains subbiome wouldn't have clay deposits or denser stands of trees sprinkled within it like we have now, and the distribution of ore veins under it would be more generic.
And, while I admit the gameplay of the two forests is similar, to the notion that "plains is just basically desert," I have to point out that a ground made out of sand instead of a ground made out of dirt is kind of a big deal.
The one advantage I do see is that this could mean fewer odd transitions, like cold, wet snow one block away from hot, dry desert, depending on how it's implemented.
Couldn't this new shader be written with some rules for which textures take priority, and just blend among the top 4? Again, I don't think players would even be aware of missing textures if they're already looking at a blend of 4 different ones.
The thing is, subbiomes aren't a substitute for biomes. There's less control over their shape, and as far as I know you can't have sub-subbiomes. That means, for example, a plains subbiome wouldn't have clay deposits or denser stands of trees sprinkled within it like we have now, and the distribution of ore veins under it would be more generic.
And, while I admit the gameplay of the two forests is similar, to the notion that "plains is just basically desert," I have to point out that a ground made out of sand instead of a ground made out of dirt is kind of a big deal.
The one advantage I do see is that this could mean fewer odd transitions, like cold, wet snow one block away from hot, dry desert, depending on how it's implemented.
You mean Max Stamina = Base level + Fullness level, right? Don't tell me we can't sprint when we're hungry. Didn't you guys watch Madagascar?
But then, would you ever not want to drink something? This might be missing an opportunity to present more interesting choices. Me, I don't like that hydration and fullness can go beyond 100%. Full should mean you are full. So if you drink at 99% hydration, it could cap at 100% and you'd be wasting most of it. Then you'd have a tradeoff.
NukemDed
New member
how about a slider control for hud brightness?
its too bright as it is at the moment at night in the game if you are trying to sneak about without lights.
even with all the curtains closed on a real life rainy day with the reflection off the screen and the bright hud in your eyes you simply have to have a mining helmet or the game is almost unplayable at night in the game
plus if it could go all the way off that would satisfy those who would like it gone completely
its too bright as it is at the moment at night in the game if you are trying to sneak about without lights.
even with all the curtains closed on a real life rainy day with the reflection off the screen and the bright hud in your eyes you simply have to have a mining helmet or the game is almost unplayable at night in the game
plus if it could go all the way off that would satisfy those who would like it gone completely
Jost Amman
Well-known member
The reason why has been already explained loud and clear by Madmole in his own post... how could you miss it?
As for the "semi-personal attack/strawman-galore" I don't know what to say... I couldn't care less about attacking you for any reason, you just gave me the impression of the kind of person who's always asking too many questions instead of letting things "flow". But I understand that is a question of attitude, guess everyone is different.
For me this is a great game but it is "just a game" after all. I see the devs are passionate about it and are (all in all) doing a great job, so I don't lose too much time wondering about this or that or trying to step on the devs toes.
If you are paranoid about people targeting you personally, that's your problem not mine. :behindsofa:
A Nice Cup of Tea
New member
I'm surprised that none of the people complaining about the hit point bar "ruining their verisimilitude" have commented on the huge intrusive quest markers in front of the houses. I'm expecting that they won't all be visible when A17 comes out - only one in front of the house that contains the quest you're currently doing. But it's still a huge blow to any kind of realism to have a huge ! in front of you when you're walking around the town. It's as intrusive in the game as it is in this paragraph!
Can we get a confirmation that they'll be invisible in the game, and any kind of quest marker we get will just be on the map and/or compass rather than in the main view?
Also, while I realise that DaVegaNL was being rather rude in his post and not all their points were valid, one of them was...
Can we also get a confirmation that (especially in random maps) there will still be plenty of open-plan buildings for freeform exploration and they won't all be replaced by linear "dungeon" buildings?
Can we get a confirmation that they'll be invisible in the game, and any kind of quest marker we get will just be on the map and/or compass rather than in the main view?
Also, while I realise that DaVegaNL was being rather rude in his post and not all their points were valid, one of them was...
Can we also get a confirmation that (especially in random maps) there will still be plenty of open-plan buildings for freeform exploration and they won't all be replaced by linear "dungeon" buildings?
Darkwingknight
New member
Not to sound like a jerk to people stating their worries for a game they hopefully enjoy and dont just enjoy complaining about. We are just seeing test footage they are giving us to stay intrested. I'm sure during experimental if there are to many complaints about a feature they will make adjustments. Frankly I'm happy to see anything, with the thoughts this is NOT a final product.
beerfly
Colony Rounder
You sound good. Just some ppl are not informed enough to watch what they complain about. There are always, happened to me, too.
But yes, slowly locking the content is proven now with the new video, nothing easy is on pimps way, we must be happy for the time they spend and keep us up with the developement
horymarten
New member
already wants to be Alpha 17!
faatal
One of the biggest things that bother me is that zombies seem to randomly attack everything when they wakeup in a building and can't get to you. For example: I'm outside of a POI, either breaking in or shooting zombies with a noisy weapon. The sleepers wake up and start tearing though walls and other things.
I would be great if they would choose to try the door first on POI's or a window. That way it is an easier path for them and random stuff like loot would not get destroyed.
Sometimes coming through a wall can be cool. Or when your on the stairwell and suddenly it gives way and a hand comes out through them to grab you. Because they are behind the stairwell breaking though.
But much of the time it's just random destruction and much too easy for me to kill them. Like when a zombie is trying to get in and I come out and attack them in the back or they are attacking some random block and I walk right up to them and smash them. Sometimes they wont even fight back. Just keep attacking the block.
Hoping that gets fixed.
One of the biggest things that bother me is that zombies seem to randomly attack everything when they wakeup in a building and can't get to you. For example: I'm outside of a POI, either breaking in or shooting zombies with a noisy weapon. The sleepers wake up and start tearing though walls and other things.
I would be great if they would choose to try the door first on POI's or a window. That way it is an easier path for them and random stuff like loot would not get destroyed.
Sometimes coming through a wall can be cool. Or when your on the stairwell and suddenly it gives way and a hand comes out through them to grab you. Because they are behind the stairwell breaking though.
But much of the time it's just random destruction and much too easy for me to kill them. Like when a zombie is trying to get in and I come out and attack them in the back or they are attacking some random block and I walk right up to them and smash them. Sometimes they wont even fight back. Just keep attacking the block.
Hoping that gets fixed.
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