PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

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Always keep a blunderbuss and a handful of ammo for it, seriously, vultures are a nightmare to hit with a bow but you just have to aim in their general direction with a blunderbuss and you'll have more feathers than you know what to do with.
Hmm, never considered the blunderbuss as a viable weapon. Used it once for fun, and it was fun. I think a muzzle loader like a brown bess or other late 1700-mid 1800 style gun/rifle would be interesting as a old school "slug" slinger to compliment the blunderbust.

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I really hope this means pooping becomes an actual thing, even if only for a gag at that location.

 
It will be "Random Days To Die" )))
I actually dislike the name of this game solely because I think the 7 day horde is too predictable, and sometimes too monotonous depending on your base situation.

 
Apparently a simple logic and loop system is being integrated into the xml's, this might make it possible to randomize things like horde nights... if you want to.

This is largely speculation on my part, logic and loops are not an inherent part of xml.

 
I fully support the idea of World War Z zombies, it would make the game a lot more fun and challenging. It has already begun with the "Feral Wight" and the "Spiders" but we need more of these types.Cheerleaders should be climbers like spiders for sure because they are gymnasts.

Giving zombies more abilities should be foremost on the minds of the developers because behavior is important and relevant.
I agree, or even a randomizer that gives each zombie that spawns a random ability... Lets see we current got: radiation healing. suicide bombs, spitting acid, running, climbing, Might be one or two more I am missing. But it'd add a sense of randomness that would be welcomed imo. Only zombie I actually worry about myself is the cops and thats only because of the suicide charge/explosion. The rest of the zombies are pretty much jokes, they are easy to kill and since they are carbon copies of each other you know what to expect and even how many hits it will take to kill them. I'd like to see zombies that can jump 3-4 blocks high, World War Z zombies would make for intersting things to fight against.

For the "magic zombies" there is sort of a lore excuse for them: the fact navezgane was nuked, radiation mutates things. As for the AI, no matter what the devs try players will find a easy way around it. In a17, it seems just making a base underground will still be autowin. I make mine underground mostly because its alot less work and has 0 maintence needed. On horde night I usually go to some multifloor POI knock out stairs and make a hole in the floor filled with wood frames to have a shooting gallery. My horde night poi thing though might not be as good in a17.

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Hmm. “Endgame content” can also mean gameplay that’s fun to do after you’ve reached the endgame, i.e. maximum level, maximum gamestage, etc., with nowhere left to advance. I assumed that’s what people were talking about this time, rather than a climax to the storyline or actual game over screen.


My point is waking up the zombies in the POI does make for easy kills - easier than tiptoeing stealthily room to room as intended.

Ha! Now I’m picturing a squad of zombie cheerleaders coordinating tosses and pyramids to get over your walls. Go team Z! :lol:
I usually don't wake up all the zombies in a poi for another reason, they are too noisy and their screeching gets on my nerves, so I usually just stealth thru.

 
yeah but they REALLY shouldn't be working on new features at this point, right? they should be polishing up features that are already 'mostly' done and pushing anything 'iffy' features off until 17.x or later.

what i am asking is "when are the devs going to say 'these are the features that we are going to roll out a17 with'?"

to ask another way: have the pimps implemented a soft cap on new feature implementation? or are there still major features on the to do list?
Well , I am sure they are not going to try and implement anything "new" that we know of...but probably are very close to getting some things added in that they have been working on...so they are still working on getting them "presentable" and working so we can at least try them out when A17 launches...

Still though , more excited for AI changes that faatal has mentioned then all the other known and possible additions...

 
They're pretty vulnerable to a blast from a blunderbuss, I like that mechanic, I hope it survives the weapons overhaul. Always keep a blunderbuss and a handful of ammo for it, seriously, vultures are a nightmare to hit with a bow but you just have to aim in their general direction with a blunderbuss and you'll have more feathers than you know what to do with. It sometimes makes going to the wasteland biome worthwhile as a low-level character, you can hang around the edge of the biome and see them from quite far away.
I usually handle them with a hunting/sniper rifle, usually 1 shot is all it takes 2 at most. in a16.4 you always get the 2x stealth attack bonus when crouched even if the vultrue is charging at you, as they never set the hunted status on you. So you can use that to your advantage as well. Hitting them with a bow/xbow though IS a nightmare cuz of the ammo's travel time, where as guns are pretty much hitscan.

 
Well , I am sure they are not going to try and implement anything "new" that we know of...but probably are very close to getting some things added in that they have been working on...so they are still working on getting them "presentable" and working so we can at least try them out when A17 launches...
Still though , more excited for AI changes that faatal has mentioned then all the other known and possible additions...

ditto on that. only things i want done as much as pathing are water fixes and underground enemies.

 
I usually handle them with a hunting/sniper rifle, usually 1 shot is all it takes 2 at most. in a16.4 you always get the 2x stealth attack bonus when crouched even if the vultrue is charging at you, as they never set the hunted status on you. So you can use that to your advantage as well. Hitting them with a bow/xbow though IS a nightmare cuz of the ammo's travel time, where as guns are pretty much hitscan.
A blunderbuss can usually be made within the first few days, a sniper rifle often takes a lot longer to obtain.

The term you're looking for is "raycasting" as that's the actual mechanism used to cast a ray from the gun to the target. Apologies, pedantry is a curse of code-monkeys :-)

 
@faatal:


I had another brilliant stroke of pure and utter genius, what if certain zombies attacked blocks that were under the heaviest SI load?

...goodbye supports, hello crashing base? :)

/geniusing since 1971
I have not needed to look at any SI values for anything, but when I implement "can't reach player destroy stuff" mode, targeting nearby high SI blocks, would be rather crafty.

 
The last we heard the zombies now attack the block with the lowest hp that they can reach. Still a bit smart for a brain-dead walking corpse but it should prove more challenging.
One way of justifying it, is the weaker blocks allow more heat (body heat, fire, breathing) to leak through, so zombies get more excited by those. Doors would attract, since they usually aren't sealed that well, and zombies have a dim recollection of the doors purpose.

 
Faatal, Gazz, will zombies guess to destroy the pillars of the structure as a "stool"? Now Zambi just run around the center and do not attack the supports. This makes them easy prey for the player.
Probably. I plan to add an attack mode to handle that situation.

 
The salt from that would be beyond imagine.
Zombies that focus on supports and level your base destroying all your loot and all your supplies.

No thanks.
Hopefully we can get some nice AI intelligence scaling working, so they get smarter and more capable as the player gets more skilled and capable.

 
One way of justifying it, is the weaker blocks allow more heat (body heat, fire, breathing) to leak through, so zombies get more excited by those. Doors would attract, since they usually aren't sealed that well, and zombies have a dim recollection of the doors purpose.
Fair point on the doors. I'm not really convinced by weaker blocks being less sealed though, a drywall is less sealed than iron bars? A zombie can see you through armored glass but attacks a wooden pillar in the opposite direction to the player?

Whoops, may have just figured out an exploit, a lot of sacrificial pillars to keep the Z's occupied while you shoot them.

May have just figured out a cunning trap, a heavy platform supported by weak pillars to crush the Z's when they demolish the pillars.

 
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Hopefully we can get some nice AI intelligence scaling working, so they get smarter and more capable as the player gets more skilled and capable.
Is animal AI getting some attention too? I love everything you're describing so far, just wondering if there was any tweaking going on under the hood of the creatures as well to make them feel more natural and less rigid in their actions.

 
May have just figured out a cunning trap, a heavy platform supported by weak pillars to crush the Z's when they demolish the pillars.
True, but you would potentially have to waste expensive resources to do so and spend the time building the thing. This wouldn't be hard late game, but I can imagine a more efficient way of dispatching zombies at that stage.

 
True, but you would potentially have to waste expensive resources to do so and spend the time building the thing. This wouldn't be hard late game, but I can imagine a more efficient way of dispatching zombies at that stage.
Spread them around the area, on horde night they should stop to demolish those before attacking your base. Resource wise? A hardened wood platform should suffice to splat, or at least damage, early horde night Z's.

 
Spread them around the area, on horde night they should stop to demolish those before attacking your base
It will be interesting to see how they react to something like that. I would think that on horde night, since they know your exact location, they would ignore those traps and head directly for the structure you're in. Perhaps if you put up a perimeter "fence" of this style that forces the zombies to attack it first I can see that working once until a hole is made and they pour in. But again you spent that effort to build and it is only a one shot deal. Additionally, in my experience collapsing structures don't always hit what's underneith 100% of the time.

I've found that the best traps don't keep zombies out, or even kill them. They take advantage of pathing and the zombies take damage getting through "openings" you left in the perimeter to funnel them into. Don't need 8 turrets when 2 will do just nicely pointed at the one hole in your outer wall. Spiked channels in the ground chop off limbs and slow them down and barbed wire slows them down more. Well placed crossbow does the rest.

edit: I think a "dumb" standard mode works, but have a timer associated with the spotted/sensed attribute. If they can't find/get you after sensing or hunting you for 'x' amount of time they berserk and hit all the important stuff for a set time then calm down and move on if they still can't find you.

On horde night you would have to make sure you hit the zombies that have been banging on your wall the longest before they berserk and do real damage since they can't move on and always hunt you

 
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The one change I would love to see for animals is them running into and getting killed by a cactus or spikes...I hate running thru the desert and hearing a rabbit or chicken dying near me to vegetation...should just make all animals immune to cacti in general. Nothing major but something that has always bothered me! But they should definitely always avoid spikes no matter what...hearing a pig outside my base killing itself on spikes is sort of funny...and hey , free food! but still...kind of lame...

 
I usually build a small tower on my first night, this also serves as my last line of defence should they breach the perimeter walls during later stages. This is then fortified with concentric rings of walls with overhanging battlements (known as machicolations). The zombies should never have a clear path to your position although I can see the logic in leading them into bottlenecks, preferably with murder-holes above them. We have a lot of castles in this country, source material isn't hard to find. :-)

I was kind of assuming the behavior of attacking blocks would only come into effect if they can't find a clear path to your location otherwise there would be no point in adding it as the z's would rather destroy your base than kill you.

Walking around your battlement will attract horde z's directly below you, all it takes is a line of spikes and a few shots to the head to kill them while minimizing damage to any particular area.

 
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The one change I would love to see for animals is them running into and getting killed by a cactus or spikes...I hate running thru the desert and hearing a rabbit or chicken dying near me to vegetation...should just make all animals immune to cacti in general. Nothing major but something that has always bothered me! But they should definitely always avoid spikes no matter what...hearing a pig outside my base killing itself on spikes is sort of funny...and hey , free food! but still...kind of lame...
That happened to me during my last game. I heard a lot of noise outside, opened the door to see a pack of wolves flailing around on the spikes, closed the door until the noise stopped. I ate well that night :-)

 
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