PC Bring back water jars or let us craft them!

Vaeliorin said:
The stamina penalties kick in at 75/50/25 percent thirst, if I understand correctly. 
Click to expand...
Yeh, just did a little test in my test world (old world, patch 21.2 b30), can confirm that 75% & 50% seem correct, 50% having halved your regen. At 50% you also get a small reduction to your Max sta.

Kinda just saying, don't aim for "not getting hurt by the lack", more like "Am I going to need sta? => Drink" kind of deal.. helped me :) Carrying the water in the bottle isn't going to be consuming it any slower than having it in your gut, so unless you plan on getting lit on fire, you should have little reason to wait.

meganoth said:
Dividing up into single player in this case would mean everyone had to go to a different town and use a different trader to get an advantage from it, not just run to a different POI.
Click to expand...
Well, my main point was that "balancing a broken system won't help".. but indeed; it might not be a "multiplayer experience to aim for", but it will always be possible (unless they implement some new mechanics to hinder groups from splitting up). If it came down to actually Having to split down to a trader per player for reasonable success, I'd argue the traders need a hefty nerf and the world a buff ;)

meganoth said:
I would be glad if there was a more interesting problem to solve, crafting 500 jars is not my idea of "more interesting" though.
Click to expand...
Yeap, we're agreeing on this part.

EDIT: "might not BE"

 
Last edited by a moderator:
theFlu said:
Yeh, just did a little test in my test world (old world, patch 21.2 b30), can confirm that 75% & 50% seem correct, 50% having halved your regen. At 50% you also get a small reduction to your Max sta.

Kinda just saying, don't aim for "not getting hurt by the lack", more like "Am I going to need sta? => Drink" kind of deal.. helped me :) Carrying the water in the bottle isn't going to be consuming it any slower than having it in your gut, so unless you plan on getting lit on fire, you should have little reason to wait.
Click to expand...
I always carry a stack of food and water on me, since I tend to go through ~300 units of food and water every (2 hour) in game day.  But yeah, I try and keep topped up, I just have a tendency to get distracted and forget to drink until I start running out of stamina.

 
I do find it interesting the debate of water and jars continues. I choose to take it as confirmation of the oddity of the current design.

I've flogged the topic to death, myself, so I'll keep it brief. I don't really think the problem is a lack of jars. They're just an inventory complication. I think the problem is the inability to carry unpurified water away from a water source. You can make it so that you dip your hand into water and extract a jar of water.

The awkward part of the current system is rather than find water where you would most likely expect it to be (lakes, rivers, puddles after rain, collectors made by survivors) you find it in the least likely places (ruined buildings, freshly stocked vending machines, and traders without a supporting survivor community).

As weird as the situation is. the Vanilla game is quite playable. Still, three cheers for the modlet feature that lets us satisfy our own tastes.

 
This again?

Look, I play without Traders right now. So I have even less possibilities to get water. Can't even have Water Filters! But I go out and explore POIs to get murky water from toilets, coffee/soft drink machines, refrigerators, etc. Mind blowing, right?

Exactly how a basic and core design feature of the game should be playerd: explore and loot. I don't get why people are over-thinking this with comments that go deep like we're trying to find a sense to life...

I'm not swimming in water bottles, but I'm not overwhelmed with them either and I gotta make choices about what to do with them. I go out looting like, 2 mid-size POIs?, in which you could find murky waters and I usually come out with ten or a dozen of them. This is without a single point in Lucky Looter yet. So, why the big existential chat about this again?

 
Kyonshi said:
 in which you could find murky waters and I usually come out with ten or a dozen of them.
Click to expand...


Not my experience, but maybe is just the RnGeezus who hates me.

I also play no quest, no buy from traders, but I do sell to traders and buy from vending machines.  Because I have been forced to by the change.  I usually do this prior to BM, so as not to use any Jars I may have found during the day.

In my case the change forces me to a PoI every day.  I like PoIs and exploring, is why dont quest.  But I like to do it on my own terms, like it used to be.

I can give 2 poops about the water jars.  Unless you remove the rivers and lakes from the game world and make all water radioactive then I should be able to carry my pot over yonder, for as long as I want/am able to walk and fill'er up.

I play 100% loot no respawn, 60 min days.

It irks me, but I play /shrugs.

 
pApA^LeGBa said:
@Ramethzer0 I mean what do you expect people to do if they really don´t like something? And on steam, wich i think you are talking about as the last topic on here is from November,  it´s not the only the same people over and over that keep that topic going with new posts until today (merging is happening pretty fast there). Also a lot on steam are on the same page as me wich is we don´t necessarily want the jars back but we don´t want this system wich forces the trader and heavy looting. 

I think not even the A17 death penalty had such a negative feedback.
Click to expand...


I can tell you right now that this could end up being a long and nuanced topic, one that would need its own thread.

I do expect the worst, most of the time.  Because it usually is (against, back to the cynicism I'm also struggling with).  I have nitpicks on standby, but I don't think it's going to move the thread forward in a way I think will be of benefit to anyone.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Kyonshi said:
This again?

Look, I play without Traders right now. So I have even less possibilities to get water. Can't even have Water Filters! But I go out and explore POIs to get murky water from toilets, coffee/soft drink machines, refrigerators, etc. Mind blowing, right?

Exactly how a basic and core design feature of the game should be playerd: explore and loot. I don't get why people are over-thinking this with comments that go deep like we're trying to find a sense to life...

I'm not swimming in water bottles, but I'm not overwhelmed with them either and I gotta make choices about what to do with them. I go out looting like, 2 mid-size POIs?, in which you could find murky waters and I usually come out with ten or a dozen of them. This is without a single point in Lucky Looter yet. So, why the big existential chat about this again?
Click to expand...
Look, I really don't care that much about the water change, I mostly think it was pointless (because I still end up with hundreds of jars of water in storage), but I used to be able to go weeks without stepping foot in a POI (I like to build/mine) and now if I want to do that I have to build a field of dew collectors.  It's not an issue, maybe a slight annoyance (let me pipe all my dew collectors together to a single collection point, please), but it has without a doubt changed the ways you can play, and not really in a positive way.

I'd be fine with making water harder if they'd actually made water harder.  I don't care one way or the other about jars.  But they've changed from something that wasn't an issue to something that's slightly annoying, and I don't see that as a good change, personally.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I kinda thought he was linking it because Fram didn't.  Definitely going to try it out on my next new world (already got 9 dew collectors in my current world, so couldn't really give good feedback.)

 
Vaeliorin said:
Look, I really don't care that much about the water change, I mostly think it was pointless (because I still end up with hundreds of jars of water in storage), but I used to be able to go weeks without stepping foot in a POI (I like to build/mine) and now if I want to do that I have to build a field of dew collectors. 
Click to expand...


It surprises me to still read people who think that the point of the change had anything to do with how much water you end up with. It's like they think TFP were trying to stop players from eventually being able to stockpile all the water they need and want and were trying to make players struggle for water the entire playthrough despite all the communication to the contrary. And no matter how many times it gets repeated that the change was for how we start with dealing with water and the journey of getting to the point where we are flush with water, this old false idea that TFP wants to stop players from ever having an abundance of water keeps coming back.

The water change was to affect the beginning of the game and not the middle or end. Instead of gaining a stack of water jars on day one and never having to put any thought or choice in the actions you take to acquire water or use it since it just naturally ended up in your inventory in stacks from the get-go and with infinitely refillable jars making it so players never really had to ever choose between drinking it and crafting with it--instead of that-- now we often need to choose how to use water in the early days, and sometimes we may have to drink murky water so we can make glue with our clean water, and building a dew collector becomes one of the tasks that joins the mix of other early game tasks we need to juggle and plan for.

As to whether it is all annoying and a worse gameplay loop, all I can say is different strokes for different folks. I like it and enjoy crafting dew collectors and gaining satisfaction from harvesting the water from them. I like that there is enough water to be found to survive but often I must choose whether I use water for drinking or for crafting during the first week. It was a choice absent from the game until A21 and I think such choices are good gameplay.

Does water eventually get solved and become something I never have to worry about or think about? Yes, and that is by design. It isn't something they were trying to change and failed at. But at least water is something never to be worried over only in the mid to late game whereas before it never had to be worried over in the early game either. I've gone back to play A20 as well as some mods that return empty jars and I hate it. It feels like playing with creative mode enabled. But that's me.

I just want to point out that what you find annoying, I find fun and there are probably others just like both of us.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top