PC Best alpha and launch so far! "Cough" craft vs loot....
- Thread starter Amotaraso
- Start date
HungryZombie
New member
Fair enough. I'm glad for the clarification of what your mean by progression being too slow.
warmer
Well-known member
100% agree.
Make the REALLY powerful items (chainsaws/augers) be more like 1 in 300. Now it feels more like 1 in 50.
Halfway between 17.4 and now would be perfect for me in regard to drops. I found 3 tier 2 chainsaws day 2. That seems pretty unlikely.
I think low level tools like wrenches and hammers shouldn't be as rare as 17.4 and the current drop rate feels realistic. However, what I would do is scale back the tier leveling in drops a bit. Make the higher tiers more rare overall.
guardianangelmp
New member
Solution:
Keep frequency of loot the same, just lower the quality of loot by 50-75% (of what it is now with lucky looter maxed).
Then, add in a mechanic where after you use a certain number of weapon/armor parts via crafting you can be able to craft tier 6 weapons/armor.
So, you can still live a nomadic life and be perfectly viable, you can't just stay in your base and craft your way to top tier gear (since you can only get weapon/armor parts from scrapping items), crafting becomes relevant again (and adds a slight "learn by doing" in the game without cheesing the whole gameplay), and you will have use for all those tier 1-4 items again.
This will make the game a little more challenging, will allow scavengers to feel like they don't have to craft, and allow Crafters to feel like they have a purpose (since you won't have tier 6 items coming out your ears with loot quality toned down).
Keep frequency of loot the same, just lower the quality of loot by 50-75% (of what it is now with lucky looter maxed).
Then, add in a mechanic where after you use a certain number of weapon/armor parts via crafting you can be able to craft tier 6 weapons/armor.
So, you can still live a nomadic life and be perfectly viable, you can't just stay in your base and craft your way to top tier gear (since you can only get weapon/armor parts from scrapping items), crafting becomes relevant again (and adds a slight "learn by doing" in the game without cheesing the whole gameplay), and you will have use for all those tier 1-4 items again.
This will make the game a little more challenging, will allow scavengers to feel like they don't have to craft, and allow Crafters to feel like they have a purpose (since you won't have tier 6 items coming out your ears with loot quality toned down).
Ghostlight
New member
Nitpick: I have 0 points in Lucky Looter, and have many tier 6 items by day 15.
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Magnum Clint
New member
Putting everything into Lucky looter for now since you can find better stuff than you can craft and don't need to drag around a bunch of parts you can sell to trader for a good price.
Khulkhuum
New member
I have a different solution. Why not "gate" equipment so it can only be looted when attaining a specific Looting Level? This Looting Level (or looting quality) rises with each Character Level, rises with GameStage, as well with perks. Additionally, make it possible to loot lower Tier items after obtaining the said Looting Level, the higher Tiers unlocked in looting after more Looting Levels are obtained.
I know this poses a threat of unbalanced diversification, but hear me out. We all know that we don't want to have Grade 3 (the best tools/weapons) items in loot early on, no matter what Tier it has. It doesn't add up to the "balance" everyone is talking, when people get early on THE BEST items (and more often than not on higher tiers). Sure IRL you would find any type of item, but we're talking about a game here, whereas looting should scale to some extent, so you get better loot as you progress.
This is of course A LOT of work to be done, considering that we need not only Grade 3 items, but also special items such as Chainsaws and Augers (that are outside of any tool/weapon grading) to be included here. Sure we could say an early Chainsaw is a lucky find, but i'd also say it flips the balance on its head.
What you guys and gals think?
I know this poses a threat of unbalanced diversification, but hear me out. We all know that we don't want to have Grade 3 (the best tools/weapons) items in loot early on, no matter what Tier it has. It doesn't add up to the "balance" everyone is talking, when people get early on THE BEST items (and more often than not on higher tiers). Sure IRL you would find any type of item, but we're talking about a game here, whereas looting should scale to some extent, so you get better loot as you progress.
This is of course A LOT of work to be done, considering that we need not only Grade 3 items, but also special items such as Chainsaws and Augers (that are outside of any tool/weapon grading) to be included here. Sure we could say an early Chainsaw is a lucky find, but i'd also say it flips the balance on its head.
What you guys and gals think?
Gating seems like easiest solution. I'm just afraid it will feel like it was an easy solution, and not a good one.
One of the amazing things in this game, is exactly the unknown elements to looting. You fight with sweat and tears and risk your life to get through a POI (POI tier is irrelevant). At the end of the POI you find the loot room. So what will it give? What amazing or dumb stuff is waiting for me in those boxes? "UH A WEAPON SAFE!!!" oh, well that won't matter. The loot in the safe is gated cause of the POI, or the gamestage.
It's an easy solution, but it will kill the suspence.
I have other ideas in mind;
- Lower the quality over the entire base! By a lot. Make it, so a tier 6 item is seriously like looting an Exalted Orb in POE before act 5. Make it feel like it's absolutely crazy! The kind of crazy, where the hair on your back get's a hard on, even before seeing the stats.
- Don't lower quantity. Sorting through loot, especially if it's needed for crafting, is a good thing.
- Make crafting unique, so that crafting can give stats or something, that looting can't give. Thereby, not making crafting better than looting per say, but giving it the potential to be stronger in a specialized way instead.
- Tier 5 and 6 needs the same "MAX" amount of mod slots. I think it could be interesting if mod slots was a roll, but regardless, make it so that they can have the same MAX.
That's my 2 cents for now.
One of the amazing things in this game, is exactly the unknown elements to looting. You fight with sweat and tears and risk your life to get through a POI (POI tier is irrelevant). At the end of the POI you find the loot room. So what will it give? What amazing or dumb stuff is waiting for me in those boxes? "UH A WEAPON SAFE!!!" oh, well that won't matter. The loot in the safe is gated cause of the POI, or the gamestage.
It's an easy solution, but it will kill the suspence.
I have other ideas in mind;
- Lower the quality over the entire base! By a lot. Make it, so a tier 6 item is seriously like looting an Exalted Orb in POE before act 5. Make it feel like it's absolutely crazy! The kind of crazy, where the hair on your back get's a hard on, even before seeing the stats.
- Don't lower quantity. Sorting through loot, especially if it's needed for crafting, is a good thing.
- Make crafting unique, so that crafting can give stats or something, that looting can't give. Thereby, not making crafting better than looting per say, but giving it the potential to be stronger in a specialized way instead.
- Tier 5 and 6 needs the same "MAX" amount of mod slots. I think it could be interesting if mod slots was a roll, but regardless, make it so that they can have the same MAX.
That's my 2 cents for now.
Tuning down the quality of loot, could be a solution - But not the loot abundance.
My personal experience, is that the loot quality ramps up really, really fast - Too fast.
The fact that we're playing on a multiplayer server, might be part of the issue, but it shouldn't be.
Finding tier 6 items before the first Blood Moon shouldn't happen - It really shouldn't. We've found end game gear on the first few days, that we haven't replaced yet, and we're on day 61. We've even found tier 6 items that were WORSE than tier 3 items, but the mod slots makes the said tier 6 item better - Even tho' it has worse stats. Something also has to be done about the random stats rolling.
I don't like the fact that I don't have to craft items anymore. It takes away the fun (for me) especially now that we have random stat generation - And the increased mats count on crafting items, makes it a no-go to craft several items in hopes of getting a nicely rolled item that (hopefully) can replace that amazing tier 6 you looted on day 4.
My personal experience, is that the loot quality ramps up really, really fast - Too fast.
The fact that we're playing on a multiplayer server, might be part of the issue, but it shouldn't be.
Finding tier 6 items before the first Blood Moon shouldn't happen - It really shouldn't. We've found end game gear on the first few days, that we haven't replaced yet, and we're on day 61. We've even found tier 6 items that were WORSE than tier 3 items, but the mod slots makes the said tier 6 item better - Even tho' it has worse stats. Something also has to be done about the random stats rolling.
I don't like the fact that I don't have to craft items anymore. It takes away the fun (for me) especially now that we have random stat generation - And the increased mats count on crafting items, makes it a no-go to craft several items in hopes of getting a nicely rolled item that (hopefully) can replace that amazing tier 6 you looted on day 4.
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guardianangelmp
New member
Crafted items are supposed to set stats that are an average of the range of RNG stats.
USMC_Grunt
New member
Ok, people love looting stuff...and why many were irritated about the removal of loot from Z's(random). I think the immersion and fun is finding awesome loot, but, what if we leveled required the loot you found. Thus you cant use that lvl 5 pick until your level 40, you can still scrap it for good mats and crafted ones have a much lower level requirement. Change the ratio of mats vs items found, more on mats. Things to help crafting. Change it so only lvl 6 items can only be crafted and not found. When you think about it, some pre-apocalyptic items wouldnt be created for the world were in now, they would have to be crafted or like what FP's did even better, mods to items(maybe certain mods have level requirements to apply to an item)...