PC Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow

Roland said:
The idea that you should be able to build within your claimed zone and have no spawns within that zone is based on faulty assumptions.
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I believe I read somewhere that LCB does protect against POI sleeper respawn (does it?) If it's true, then I could see how people might make incorrect assumptions by extending that logic to blood moon spawns

Especially when people make threads like these asking "how do I stop zombies from spawning in my POI?" and people say LCB/Bedrolls prevent spawns, it might be implied they mean sleeper spawns, but since it's not clear it could be interpreted as all spawns

https://www.reddit.com/r/7daystodie/comments/ih8t06/is_there_a_way_to_stop_zombie_spawns_at_pois/

 
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VestedStorm6108 said:
This IS the issue. Those people don't WANT to craft. They want to be out in the world exploring, looting, or killing. Whereas I WANT to craft, mine, and build, but now am being forced to go out and loot for the magazines that scale with how many magazines I have. Especially since the magazines ONLY effect crafting and not how effective those tools, weapons, armor are.

It's a lose-lose for everyone involved.
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I think in a group with decent people, you can work it out that they will give you the magazines if you are crafting and they aren't.  As you said, it won't help them to use the magazines if they aren't creating anyhow.  If you aren't in a group willing to do that, then maybe a better group would be a good thing? 😁

 
Falcon197 said:
One more passing thought I'd add to this on the matter of balancing the size of bases is that if I correctly understood what was mentioned earlier about the distance from players for horde spawns being ~35 blocks - that also creates a chance of imbo spawning inside of bases that only fill a quarter of a max-size LCB if the defenders ever move too far from the portion of the claim occupied from the base.

So even building smaller may not matter in the grander scheme of the spawn mechanics.  I could envision zombies still popping up inside a base or perimeter wall on setups like this, where the LCB radius is big and placed to cover farms or other stuff outside the base, but even if the radius was 71 and the base size ~40, everyone moving to engage horde spawns in one corner of their base still opens the possibility for spawns to shift behind them and end up inside the wall / base.

Really appreciate the consideration though, @Roland!

View attachment 26436
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I think the biggest difficulty is that the safe spawn zone is defined by distance from you and other players and not on your LCB.  So every time you move, the safe zone changes.  It might be nice if you could have a "ping" button that would temporarily show the safe distance from where you are.  You could then stand where you expect to be during horde night and get an idea of where the safe borders are.  It wouldn't be tied in any way with the LCB.

That said, I think that the LCB area should be the size that if you were to stand in one corner, the opposite corner is still safe.  If that means shrinking the LCB to accommodate it, that may be okay.  Unfortunately, the limitation on moving things outside of your LCB means shrinking it would be a pain for people with large bases.  I'd really like it if you could have multiple LCB placed, but only one active at a time by toggling which one you want active.  That would allow you to build large bases without having to destroy and rebuild LCB blocks anytime you want to move things that aren't within the current LCB.  It would also benefit everyone who had a separate horde base.  The limitation on only one active at a time would help to prevent any issues they may have with players having multiple LCB, though perhaps not all.  I'm not sure the issues involved.

 
The problem  comes back to the limitations imposed by the game. The zombies can only spawn outward from the player so far before they simply fall out of the world. The minimum distance is 35 blocks but the maximum isn’t much further. They had reduce the maximum not too long ago because spawns were falling out of the world and people weren’t getting horde nights. 
 

So it is a function of what the game can literally not do and that is to accommodate players who build large bases that extend past the minimum spawn distance. If you do that you will get spawns inside your base. It has nothing to do with how much area you can land claim. Those are unrelated. 
 

The devs are unlikely to allow people to simply pave over every square meter to prevent spawns. If they see that happening then they will probably allow spawns on water and player placed blocks as backups if no grass can be found in the spawning region. 
 

Building a base so large that it in order for the game to find a place to spawn bloodmoon enemies that they are just going to fall out of the world is not a problem with the game, it is a user problem. 
 

For horde night bases to work properly they must be smaller than the minimum spawn distance. Period. There are plenty of creative base ideas that can be done within those parameters. 
 

Mega-bases can still be done but just not used for horde night if having some interior spawns are problematic. Many people choose to have an everyday base and a horde night base. If you want a mega-base then it should be your everyday base and then keep a smaller but still creative horde night base on the side. 
 

It could be that distances might extend farther out in the future but we shouldn’t expect it—especially not for A21.  At any rate, there is no bug. The LCB is not intended as a protection against bloodmoon spawns so it doesn’t check for them and there is no plan to have them check for them. 

 
meganoth said:
I have a similar machine, ryzen 5 2600x with RX580. I get 90 fps normal and huge dips on horde nights, but still very much playable at about 40 FPS I think(?). No problem at all with aiming and hitting targets at horde night, at 1080p.

But I turned off shadows and reflections completely and also turned off dynamic meshes (separate tab in the configs menue).

I also heard that external gaming tools often make problems with the game, not a problem I would be able to get as I am playing on Linux 😉

If this doesn't help (or you want to keep shadows turned on), turn down the resolution one step.
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I see.. yeah i don't like the concept of turning off shadows lol.  Reflections i can do without, so maybe i'll try removing those completely (if i hadn't already, tho i imagine i might have them set to low).  As far as external gaming tools.. I don't think i use any.  I'm sure nvidia has some kind of tool in the background, if that's what you mean, but otherwise gaming tools feels like a broad-in-scope term and i can only really think of things that might be considered hacky (cheat engine, wallhacks and aimbots).

@bdubyah Using your vehicle mod, love it, tho can say the Duster was a terrible first pick (or maybe the best if you want a progression XD) lol.  Any chance i can dm you a couple small .xml files to see why my buff isn't clearing when the timer runs out?  I've mostly been referencing the original 7 days docs to figure out how to implement my own stuff, and so far i have an item from the farmlife mod (doesn't originally have a use) to be use-able and apply my own buff with it's own icon and everything works... roughly.  At first it applied the correct amount of duration, but now it just is acting very weird (where it supposed to give an hour, it gives like 8min, and sometimes the second counter goes into negative.. some weird stuff).  If not maybe point me to a good place for such question and debug help?  The modding section here doesn't seem to have a "mod help" section that's specifically relevent to getting such help.

 
Kalex said:
You don't know that A21 system is horrible because you haven't ACTUALLY PLAYED IT.
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True, we don't know. But it isn't going to be the environment we've all become acustomed to. Come back @Kalex when its released, and tell us how much you like the change. We'll chat again.

 
Hi ! any news about a21? Or is the Twitchcon being just a cosplay event with the Integration feature and a very bald and gentle man entertaining the 7dtd booth's visitors?

 
You can estimate the gains in performance you would get from features like dlss by simply running under your monitors native resolution. You obviously won't get the image quality benifits but it can show you how much performance you could get if it was hypothetically implemented in 7dtd (which doesn't look likely) 

If 1080p is your native res run the game at 720p and see if you get anything significant from that. However 7dtd is heavy cpu bound so chances are these upscaling technologies will do little to nothing for you in 7dtd even if it was implimented. 

It depends heavily on your hardware and the resolution you're running but I'd wager for the vast majority it wouldn't make any appreciable difference unfortunately. 

 
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Off of the topic, but when is A21 release date ? 

*Running away...Oh, Roland hi, hello sir, it was the other guy I swear*

*Helpp*

 
Naz said:
You can estimate the gains in performance you would get from features like dlss by simply running under your monitors native resolution. You obviously won't get the image quality benifits but it can show you how much performance you could get if it was hypothetically implemented in 7dtd (which doesn't look likely) 

If 1080p is your native res run the game at 720p and see if you get anything significant from that. However 7dtd is heavy cpu bound so chances are these upscaling technologies will do little to nothing for you in 7dtd even if it was implimented. 

It depends heavily on your hardware and the resolution you're running but I'd wager for the vast majority it wouldn't make any appreciable difference unfortunately. 
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But even though it is CPU bound you can see fps go down above a specific resolution. In a quick test my PC showed 100 FPS no matter what resolution up to 3k I set in windowed mode. But above 3k I could see FPS go down until it was half at 4k. So presumably for me DLSS would help if I had a 3k monitor.

 
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Naz said:
You can estimate the gains in performance you would get from features like dlss by simply running under your monitors native resolution. You obviously won't get the image quality benifits but it can show you how much performance you could get if it was hypothetically implemented in 7dtd (which doesn't look likely) 

If 1080p is your native res run the game at 720p and see if you get anything significant from that. However 7dtd is heavy cpu bound so chances are these upscaling technologies will do little to nothing for you in 7dtd even if it was implimented. 

It depends heavily on your hardware and the resolution you're running but I'd wager for the vast majority it wouldn't make any appreciable difference unfortunately. 
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Both DLSS and FSR were primarily designed to run at high resolutions not low ones. Yes, most people are not on resolutions above 1080p, but they're likewise not on graphics cards above 1060/1650 performance either.

 
Ryiah said:
Here's an implementation of FSR 1.0 for Unity's built-in render pipeline.

https://github.com/tatoforever/AMD_FSR
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You can use FSR 1.0 even without introducing it into the game.The necessary program is available on Steam.I think it's not about the impossibility of its implementation, but as a final picture after using FSR.I tried to use it.For Full HD and below, it's terrible, honestly.You won't be playing with this picture quality.

 
mstdv inc said:
You can use FSR 1.0 even without introducing it into the game.The necessary program is available on Steam.I think it's not about the impossibility of its implementation, but as a final picture after using FSR.I tried to use it.For Full HD and below, it's terrible, honestly.You won't be playing with this picture quality.
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There's a major disadvantage to running it through an external application or driver setting: it upscales everything including the UI.

 
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Melange said:
True, we don't know. But it isn't going to be the environment we've all become acustomed to. Come back @Kalex when its released, and tell us how much you like the change. We'll chat again.
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And I've been thru multiple radical reworks of game mechanics so far they have been either livable or for the better.

 
Kalex said:
And I've been thru multiple radical reworks of game mechanics so far they have been either livable or for the better.
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Me too. Actually walked away from some 'alpha upgrades' because the were not imo player friendly. And I don't suspect A21 is gonna be any more friendly. Livable? Sure, but even using that term indicates TFP messed up on our interpretation of player enjoyment, agreed? And as 'for the better', we'll have to see. Better for whom? But, its all moot. They gonna do what they gonna do, that's been proven. Now, if they'll just release the damned thing....

 
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