PC Alpha 21 Dev Diary

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i don't want to be negative just i'm disspointed . This remind me  a game very  popular in Poland in 2010 . It was called Metin 2  and in this game  If you want to make your skill better you have to buy this same book few times (at least this depends on server because it could be changes by main admin) level up this skill xd people hated this solution and was joking about that a lot but as negative 

 
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Just i don't know what to say about that. Honestly i never seen similiar crafting system that's true. but this "book" system remind me Metin2 skills system so much. Yeah and as always people will be saying that will be fun and that's is more important that realistic system. And they  can say " it was used in this game and as you said it was popular so this mean it was ok" .... and this will be not so true why? metin 2 was good not because it was good game but was F2P mmo -- WoW was too expenstive here. Even sometimes was hard to buy good game so people just going to newsstands and was buying 19,99 zł games (  20 zł was like dunno 4 dollars? and usually so cheap games were terrible except old games like Serious sam or "hidden diamonds" like painkiller). So if someone had more money and lived in bigger city played dunno cod or crysis. i don't know even why i'm writing about this but ... just don't fix things that work maybe not perfect but at least works. Just.... this sounds more casual that older system. I know 7dtd don't want to make 7dtd more hardcore.

Everything that left is just waiting for  more news. 

Ps. Just don't write that "mods will solve your problem" because this is not true

 
it's still a mystery to me in the current crafting system, why, if I made a club out of iron, then I can't figure out how to make a club out of steel? Is there some fundamentally different approach? or what about a pickaxe? also, different technologies? if you introduce a new system for leveling up crafting levels in A21, it’s better to let any tool be made immediately after leveling up the basic skill, but the quality, resource costs for creating and repairing will increase depending on the books you read. I may have to do this mechanic myself later, unfortunately, so that it would be more pleasant to play.

 
Matt115 said:
So if you want to make realitic --> magasine should be extreme rare and to make 1 gun you need at least few diffrents number -  for example part 1 , part 2 part 3 for pipe shotgun , 4 5 6 for double barrel shotgun etc.
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This is basically how it works. It takes finding a few magazines in order to learn to craft anything. You can think of it as part 1 2 and 3.  
 

The system does deliver a realistic sense of searching for knowledge and piecing it together from a few different sources. 

 
Roland said:
This is basically how it works. It takes finding a few magazines in order to learn to craft anything. You can think of it as part 1 2 and 3.  
 

The system does deliver a realistic sense of searching for knowledge and piecing it together from a few different sources. 
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I had... terrible lecturer on my university. He is old and... hm we don't like him because he forced to use his books on few diffrent subjects. And i found after 2-3 weeks part 2 and 3 but i coudn't find part 1. i manage to find this after... 2 months. 

7dtd take part after fall of nukes right? i'm not living in USA but i think it could be hard to find some books in more country states. And after fall of nukes it should be extreme rare. Yes it would take a lot of time ( at least 12 hours of playing) to finish on "gun" but... that's a point. But i know players hate undynamic gameplay

 
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Will things like headshot bonus and dismemberment chance still apply only to certain tools/weapons/robotics under each attribute  (for example, Strength currently governs the headshot bonus and dismemberment chance of shotguns, clubs, sledgehammers and tools, specifically), or is that going to be changed as well?

(I apologize if this has already been addressed somewhere and I just missed it.)

 
Matt115 said:
I had... terrible lecturer on my university. He is old and... hm we don't like him because he forced to use his books on few diffrent subjects. And i found after 2-3 weeks part 2 and 3 but i coudn't find part 1. i manage to find this after... 2 months. 

7dtd take part after fall of nukes right? i'm not living in USA but i think it could be hard to find some books in more country states. And after fall of nukes it should be extreme rare. Yes it would take a lot of time ( at least 12 hours of playing) to finish on "gun" but... that's a point. But i know players hate undynamic gameplay
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You’ll have to try it out to see if the books feel rare enough to you. I’m certain there are probably values in the config files that could be changed to make magazines so rare that you won’t be able to figure out Bacon and Eggs until Day 100 if that’s what you want. 

Frozendreams said:
Will things like headshot bonus and dismemberment chance still apply only to certain tools/weapons/robotics under each attribute  (for example, Strength currently governs the headshot bonus and dismemberment chance of shotguns, clubs, sledgehammers and tools, specifically), or is that going to be changed as well?

(I apologize if this has already been addressed somewhere and I just missed it.)
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There is no change to that. Some rebalancing of perks and revamping will need to take place since so many were mostly for unlocking crafting recipes and tiers. But attributes still do what they did. 

 
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Roland said:
You’ll have to try it out to see if the books feel rare enough to you. I’m certain there are probably values in the config files that could be changed to make magazines so rare that you won’t be able to figure out Bacon and Eggs until Day 100 if that’s what you want. 

There is no change to that. Some rebalancing of perks and revamping will need to take place since so many were mostly for unlocking crafting recipes and tiers. But attributes still do what they did. 
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Gotcha'.  Thanks.  :)

 
meganoth said:
To add to that, everyone should be pleased: Haters of LBD have vanilla and mods, lovers of LBD as well have multiple excellent mods to play.

Yes. Since you get xp for many activities and can get better with xp LBD was never gone in the strict sense.
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Mods are not solution. it is like only car dealer in town said  - " well if you don't like this cars buy a helicopter" but helicopter is much more expensive and  even less avalible.

You know my opinion about 7dtd mods so in short - mods are not solution

Roland said:
You can find a lot of magazines. 10-12 of one type per day?  Maybe. I’m sure the amounts in loot will change several times before A21 comes out. It’s still a WIP. 
 
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Well this supposed to be 1 magazine per 10-12 days

Roland said:
You’ll have to try it out to see if the books feel rare enough to you. I’m certain there are probably values in the config files that could be changed to make magazines so rare that you won’t be able to figure out Bacon and Eggs until Day 100 if that’s what you want. 
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... now i'm even more disspointed because i was thinking it's just connected with weapon. This make thing even less realisic. Why? you can figured out how to cook Bacon and eggs just... by sitting in kitchen so you don't have to find info about that just  tries and errors. I had a lot of problems fry meat got when i was making spaggeti and i found how without looking in google etc. But okay let say we are talking magasine. Still i don't living in USA but at least in my country most of people have cooking books. So if add magazines using logic you should have maxed top chef after looting one house.

 
Just to be clear on a few points being discussed about the new crafting skill system:

It is the perk's loot probability boost that will drop off once a crafting skill is at 100%. NOT the magazines themselves. You can still find shotgun mags and give them to your friends, scrap them for paper, or read them for XP.

Tool and weapon parts are still required in recipes.

The only thing different for perks and perk books are the crafting unlocks. Everything else is the same. Some of them will have new perks added to them to beef them up a bit.

 

 
I dunno, I think the devs have been pretty open about their approach to realism/plausibility, which I would sum up as "nice to have, but will always be behind gameplay/tech/fun considerations". This system doesn't seem particularly more or less realistic than the other system to me, but it does seem like a tighter and better-integrated design. 7DTD has been moving in a more looting-focused direction in recent years (dungeon POIs, skill books, un-mineable resources like brass & plastic) so something like this isn't too surprising.

I do concede that if I hated looting or was just more into mining/crafting, I'd probably feel differently about this.

 
so will a blue pump shotgun still require 15 shotgun parts in the new system? or will the part cost to craft be cheaper because you need to grind and find skills and it will take alot longer to get there. (i.e 9-11 parts). 
 

In a20 you would rush the shotgun skill perks and maybe have enough parts to only make 1 by the time you had the recipe.

 
LeksColman said:
it's still a mystery to me in the current crafting system, why, if I made a club out of iron, then I can't figure out how to make a club out of steel? Is there some fundamentally different approach? 
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Yes, forging iron and forging steel are VERY different IRL.  

It is the perk's loot probability boost that will drop off once a crafting skill is at 100%. NOT the magazines themselves
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Maybe I am not understanding "loot probability".  Are you saying that once my Shotgun crafting skill reaches 100% My chances to find shotguns and shotgun parts drops off? 

 
POCKET951 said:
so will a blue pump shotgun still require 15 shotgun parts in the new system? or will the part cost to craft be cheaper because you need to grind and find skills and it will take alot longer to get there. (i.e 9-11 parts). 
 

In a20 you would rush the shotgun skill perks and maybe have enough parts to only make 1 by the time you had the recipe.
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Per MM' post:

"Perking into shotguns for example, increases the odds of finding shotgun magazines, shotgun parts, and shotguns in loot."

So more parts should be available to find in loot.

 
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Matt115 said:
Mods are not solution. it is like only car dealer in town said  - " well if you don't like this cars buy a helicopter" but helicopter is much more expensive and  even less avalible.

You know my opinion about 7dtd mods so in short - mods are not solution

Well this supposed to be 1 magazine per 10-12 days

... now i'm even more disspointed because i was thinking it's just connected with weapon. This make thing even less realisic. Why? you can figured out how to cook Bacon and eggs just... by sitting in kitchen so you don't have to find info about that just  tries and errors. I had a lot of problems fry meat got when i was making spaggeti and i found how without looking in google etc. But okay let say we are talking magasine. Still i don't living in USA but at least in my country most of people have cooking books. So if add magazines using logic you should have maxed top chef after looting one house.
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Mods are not a solution eh? Sorry the game is not made specifically for @Matt115 they are indeed a solution! The simple fact is there is legit no way for the TFP to please everyone 100% of the time that is why they are supporting deeper and deeper levels of modding. Stop shutting down anyone who defies you.

 
Question for TFP:

Does movement ingame will ever be upgraded/reworked? It feels a little bit clunky, the game now has pretty high quality standards but movement always felt like Alpha 4 (when i started playing the game)

Thoughts? 

Edit: I'm talking about player movement, vehicle movement is pretty neat now.

 
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Are magazines the only item affected? If not and if parts are affected too then an exploit was just born : perk up X weapon to almost max and don't expend the last point, then enjoy boosted "part looting" until you are satisfied. That exploit can be done with magazines, but to what purpose other than gift them to your cluncky newbie partner? Good exploitable feature right there.

Parts boosted, on the other hand, results in a flaw. And it is easily solved by just maintaining part abundance (if it ever does get implemented) and never dropping it down once perked up. If it is too much then making the boost smaller is the solution.

Otherwise, good luck explaining how a perk "downgrades" anything, specially part abundance after completion. Specific magazine " loot table boost" we can live without when reaching max skill.

So I believe parts should be out of that boost if not permanent, they are "canny and wormy".

 
My biggest hope for A21 is that the lighting and shadows get fixed so I can actually turn the shadows on without my PC crawling to sub 20 FPS. Please, for the love of all that is holy, fix the system intensive shadows. 

 
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