PC Alpha 19 Dev Diary

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The advantage of a "key code" instead of a key-card or actual key is that its not necessary to spawn any inventory object, or such thing.

It would be basically just a memories piece of information, specific for that POI.

 
MechanicalLens said:
Again, what if they were to be destroyed? This is assuming of course they would be lootable or physical objects.
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If they get destroyed they get destroyed. That would be a normal event in the game. Whats the issue with that?

The player needs to prevent loot getting blown up in any case.

 
MechanicalLens said:
Again, what if they were to be destroyed? This is assuming of course they would be lootable or physical objects.
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make it a zombie drop? Kill the Zed, drops the yellow bag, put the code/key in the bag. I've never tried, can you destroy them?

Edit: Actually there is usually a cop in these poi's make the cop drop it, security would have the code/key

 
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Looked at from a different angle nerd poling isn't the problem really is it?

It's that the majority of the really good loot is at one location. Often at the top of a building.

Simply spread the loot around in the high tier pois.

And, just guessing here, but code wise I'd assume that randomizing between a given set of containers would be a heck of a lot easier than spawning in multiple full 3d models in random rooms.

 
Damocles said:
If they get destroyed they get destroyed. That would be a normal event in the game. Whats the issue with that?

The player needs to prevent loot getting blown up in any case.
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Personally I agree with this. I mean, right now, if you get killed when trying to finish a quest, you fail that quest. How would this be any different in terms of gameplay?

 
Damocles said:
Make the POI contain "key code" notes along it "dungeon" path.

The Loot room then has key-code locked containers. Or a key code locked vault door to it.

Now the player can decide to get to the loot room quickly, but must break open the locks.

Or get instant access with the picked up notes. (entering the code can be an automatic action)

This mechanic should be quite easy to implement, and solves the problem of direct access to the "final" loot.
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I really hope an idea similar to this is implemented.  It encourages exploration, encountering zeds, and offers a nice alternative to wrecking a straight path to the goodies.  As for the concerns over note destruction, I really don't care either way.  If they are destroyed, move on, or work the longer process of opening the hardened safe.  If notes are indestructible you could level a building to find them, but the cost and time to do so may not be shorter than trying to crack the safe or find the notes.

Excellent idea Damocles.

 
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MechanicalLens said:
Nevertheless, here are the reasons why, in my opinion, keycards are the obvious choice out of the two:

1. It's a simpler system and therefore more user-friendly to new players

2. If keycodes would be physical objects, then a singular keycard would save on inventory space

3. A similar system is already in place, and that is the supplies from the satchels. A similar system for keycards could be developed off of that

(And no, having both is not an option, since TFP are going for consistency here.)

The difference is you would then likely have a chest or two which would be impossible to break into. (Unless of course they had ridiculous amounts of health; 40k plus.)
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Maybe we're talking about the same thing?

My idea (which is just a slight tweak of something TFP said) is to have different "colors" of key cards, a la Doom, and those key cards are destructible (once they open up one door/chest/whatever of that color, they're gone).

The situation where you would have a chest that is impossible to break into - would only happen if you don't have that specific "color" of card.

When would this happen? If you lost that card (e.g. due to being killed) or if you got that colored key but voluntarily used it somewhere else.

In those situations, yes, you would have a chest (or POI area...) that's impossible to access. But where's the problem? It seems entirely consistent, gameplay-wise.

It's also newbie-friendly, since colored key cards have been around for, what, forty years now? If you're such a newbie that you can't grasp the concept of colored keys, you probably can't even do WASD movement.

 
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MechanicalLens said:
I agree, it is an excellent idea, but thinking realistically here, which system do you think TFP are going to select? Thinking of new players here.

1. You going on a wild goose chase to find some random numbers to unlock the code to an otherwise almost indestructible door/loot container

2. A physical, lootable object that always spawns in the same location in every POI and that has arrows pointing to it on the compass and on your screen?

Most definitely the latter. 😛
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I don't really care what the Fun Pimps select.  The idea is excellent for any player.  What the Fun Pimps select is their business and does nothing to lower the quailty of the idea itself.  Also "New Player".... are you suggesting that ALL new players do not like searching / exploring content?

 
in my opinion instead of having developers wasting time into coding a feature to fix something that isnt broken, id rather see them using that time to release updates to the game's engine, more weapons, items, etc

 
MechanicalLens said:
Again, I'm not arguing for or against it, that's not the point here; I'm just making an observation. :)  I edited my comment above detailing three such examples.
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Yeah, the radius hints are great.  Could work the same for notes, key cards, fobs, etc, giving you a hint of which room(s) contain the needed pieces to open the safe.

 
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MechanicalLens said:
And so it seems that we have reached a bridge in this discussion. To keep things consistent, a singular keycard or a series of keycodes would need to be easy enough to find and, if current trends continue, they would probably have arrows pointing towards them. At that point, does it matter which one TFP could pick? I argue... not really. ;)
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Yeah, the main strength of the original idea was the promotion of exploring a POI more fully, prompting more zed encounters, and the additional satisfaction of finding something.

 
i mean, sure i understand that there is a bunch of people that want a zombies apocalypse to be 100% realistic, with food spoilage, no nerd poling, etc. but there are mods for that.

i agree 100% with you saying that nerd poling is a problem if you want it to be a problem, i cant see that being an issue, its not a race, you are not affected if other players want to get fast loot let em be with it, it's up to each individual after all should they choose to make their own game more difficult or realistic by not allowing themselves to place frames.

 
Perhaps this was answered already, but in the previous stream I noticed infection rate going down, not up and infection started at 3%. Are %’s random? Will infections stack? Will infection rates begin to increase instead of decrease if severe enough?

 
I've played games where nerd polling was removed, and although it certainly makes building more interesting, it also removes all cheesiness associated with nerd polling.  

The change to building wasn't so dramatic that it causes frustration or chaos, it just made you think differently and approach problems with the idea you needed to solve them, not just cheese around them.

It's not game breaking, and is actually quite fun. 

 
Eighmy_Lupin said:
Unless they give us some sort of scaffolding, like Minecraft currently has, nerd polling has to stay or building will be ruined. 

The scaffolding in minecraft really isnt any different than nerd polling.
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Naw you just have to build differently.  You have to think/plan it out. 

 
MechanicalLens said:
If you want to build differently, you already can. Just don't nerdpole, it is as simple as that.

Imagine if it was proposed that jumping has to be removed because a tiny minority of people abuse it in a way that wasn't intended (and don't affect anyone else but themselves and anyone mimicking them). You could argue, "Well, you now have to use your brain. Use ladders, use ramps using the shape menu." But the sole question here would be... "Why"?

But again, it's all up to TFP. If they find it justifiable to remove a mechanic because 1% of people abuse it and use it in a way that wasn't intended, then *shrugs* so be it.
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Well the answer to 'why' is simple.

The game used to be complicated, you had to think more, and was fun.  It is now linear, has cartoon arrows telling you what to do and is less fun.

Mind you, I'm not advocating the pimps remove nerd polling; I no longer care... but to believe "building will be ruined" is simply incorrect. 

Remember when everyone was wondering why you couldn't just build blocks that float in the air like you could in Minecraft, and that physics "ruined" building?  

It's like that. 

 
The person I quoted said it. 

Oh, and tfp is going to get backlash no matter what they do.  Either from the few of us that still haven't moved on or from the console crowd that likes the easier gameplay.

Tfp should do what is right for them.  

 
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