PC Alpha 18 feedback and balancing thread
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meilodasreh
New member
Concerning water/hydration:
Since introduction of the big water bottles, i have hardly had to use anything but those to keep me hydrated.
Next to some canned food also giving some water, those bottles are the only thing necessary for me.
Most water coolers i find when looting POIs contain at least 3 or 4 bottles, which is enough for days, cause they give so much water.
Next to having spent some points into sexual TRex, there is no need for tea or coffee and their corresponding stamina bonuses.
...oh and i don't know if it is due to my continued savegame from b4, but when I empty a bottle I get an empty glass jar, but shouldn't it be scrap polymers since it's obviously a plastic bottle?
Since introduction of the big water bottles, i have hardly had to use anything but those to keep me hydrated.
Next to some canned food also giving some water, those bottles are the only thing necessary for me.
Most water coolers i find when looting POIs contain at least 3 or 4 bottles, which is enough for days, cause they give so much water.
Next to having spent some points into sexual TRex, there is no need for tea or coffee and their corresponding stamina bonuses.
...oh and i don't know if it is due to my continued savegame from b4, but when I empty a bottle I get an empty glass jar, but shouldn't it be scrap polymers since it's obviously a plastic bottle?
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I loaded into a game with a friend today and we had two issues that we're not sure about. This was in pregen01.
1. Didn't confirm this because we quit the game and went to navezgane but in town there were radiated zombies and wights spawning in when we were on day 3 with GS around 5-7.
2. We fell through the floor a few times and ended up just being able to tp out. Is this just a bug in pregen01?
1. Didn't confirm this because we quit the game and went to navezgane but in town there were radiated zombies and wights spawning in when we were on day 3 with GS around 5-7.
2. We fell through the floor a few times and ended up just being able to tp out. Is this just a bug in pregen01?
T_Rawls
New member
So I was thinking about upgrading my Charismatic nature perk which gives a boost to Agility and Fortitude I think, but only one person around me uses one of those attributes. The other people would get no benefit whatsoever because it only boost damage with those weapons.
So I got the idea of wanting to add stats to the attributes such as every point of fortitude is a +10 to health so you can get an extra 100 health at level 10 on top of the way it you get health now for a possible 300 health now that may be too much but it'd damn sure be fun running around horde night with 300 hp and for agility boost stamina for a +10 up to and extra 100 stamina. strength could be a +0.5 or +1 of stamina regen up to a max of +5 or +10 stamina regen.
I couldn't think of anything for perception and maybe intellect boost xp gain and craft speed or something. also you could boost allies hp and stamina with the charismatic nature perk so it'd be useful even if no one uses it's specified atrributes.
If i knew how to mod i'd mod those things in myself but i can't.
So I got the idea of wanting to add stats to the attributes such as every point of fortitude is a +10 to health so you can get an extra 100 health at level 10 on top of the way it you get health now for a possible 300 health now that may be too much but it'd damn sure be fun running around horde night with 300 hp and for agility boost stamina for a +10 up to and extra 100 stamina. strength could be a +0.5 or +1 of stamina regen up to a max of +5 or +10 stamina regen.
I couldn't think of anything for perception and maybe intellect boost xp gain and craft speed or something. also you could boost allies hp and stamina with the charismatic nature perk so it'd be useful even if no one uses it's specified atrributes.
If i knew how to mod i'd mod those things in myself but i can't.
Minandreas
New member
Some feedback after playing A18 every Friday night with my gaming group:
Praise
Potential Improvements
Praise
- Horde nights feel amazing compared to how they felt in the past. We had so many zombies spawned in attacking us at once it was intense, and while the game certainly ran worse than normal during the horde nights, it was a huge step up from the past. Still needs polish. But massive step forward. Haven't had so much fun with horde night... probably ever.
- Quantity of zombies in PoIs feels much better. Haven't noticed any silly clown cars yet in A18.
- Leveling speeds between miners, looters, etc. feels much better. (Miners still have the edge early game. But it flip flops later and becomes much slower than questers/looters. So it balances out imo.)
- A million other things. Seriously, this alpha is a huge success in my eyes.
Potential Improvements
- Biggest complaint across the board is that base stat level ups feel really bad. Particularly the higher rank ones where you might have to spend 8 or so levels getting a stat to 10 so you can pick up the final ranks of the skills that actually feel meaningful and interesting. Feels real bad knowing your next 8 level ups are basically meaningless.
- Cooking skill needs a look. We found so many food recipes in loot that I will be ignoring the cooking skill outright next time we restart. I got 4 ranks in it, and the farmer wound up doing all the cooking anyways with 0 ranks in the skill because it was just easier for him to take his harvest right to the cooking pot. And having the cooking skill doesn't actually DO anything if you know the recipes. Reduced cook time is useless. Make 1 more campfire and voila, you've doubled your cooking speed. Cooking skill should reduce the food poisoning chance of the food you've cooked at the very least.
- As the mining guy of the team, I found it silly that I needed to ask the Int guy to que up the iron bars, steel bars, etc. since they crafted way faster for him than for me. It was just really inconvenient. Let me craft that kind of stuff faster too. Would also be nice if I somehow improved the meltdown time of the raw resources in the forge.
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JaxTeller718
New member
Well its a tinted mining helmet so that should show how much they care about it
Crater Creator
Community Moderator
Bricks are useless.
I've been playing A18 off and on and am finally ready to leave feedback. I'll try to avoid a giant wall of text and stick to one issue at at time.
There is never a time when it's logical to use bricks. They're straight up inferior to cobblestone. Let's do a cost/benefit comparison, with numbers I just tested in A18.2.
[table=width: 100%, class: grid, align: center]
[tr]
[td][/td]
[td]Brick (1 block)[/td]
[td]Cobblestone (1 block)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Cost: prerequisites[/td]
[td]forge, anvil*, adv bellows*[/td]
[td]stone axe[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Cost: material[/td]
[td]15 clay
2.4 stone[/td]
[td]14 clay
14 stone[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Cost: time[/td]
[td]51 s to smelt 75 clay
+ 22 s to forge 1 brick block
= 73 s[/td]
[td]14 s to craft 14 cobblestone rocks
+ 1 s to craft 1 flagstone block
+ ~2 s to upgrade flagstone block to cobblestone
= 17 s[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Benefit: HP[/td]
[td]1200 HP[/td]
[td]1500 HP[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Benefit: XP[/td]
[td]0 XP[/td]
[td]120 XP for upgrading flagstone block[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]
* these are optional, but used to show the best conditions for brick
Brick wins on required stone, but the acquisition cost of stone is super low. It's literally the most common block in the game besides possibly air. In every other category, cobblestone wins. So what am I missing? What is the use case for bricks? Their cost should come down, or their benefit should come up, or both.
I've been playing A18 off and on and am finally ready to leave feedback. I'll try to avoid a giant wall of text and stick to one issue at at time.
There is never a time when it's logical to use bricks. They're straight up inferior to cobblestone. Let's do a cost/benefit comparison, with numbers I just tested in A18.2.
[table=width: 100%, class: grid, align: center]
[tr]
[td][/td]
[td]Brick (1 block)[/td]
[td]Cobblestone (1 block)[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Cost: prerequisites[/td]
[td]forge, anvil*, adv bellows*[/td]
[td]stone axe[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Cost: material[/td]
[td]15 clay
2.4 stone[/td]
[td]14 clay
14 stone[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Cost: time[/td]
[td]51 s to smelt 75 clay
+ 22 s to forge 1 brick block
= 73 s[/td]
[td]14 s to craft 14 cobblestone rocks
+ 1 s to craft 1 flagstone block
+ ~2 s to upgrade flagstone block to cobblestone
= 17 s[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Benefit: HP[/td]
[td]1200 HP[/td]
[td]1500 HP[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Benefit: XP[/td]
[td]0 XP[/td]
[td]120 XP for upgrading flagstone block[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]
* these are optional, but used to show the best conditions for brick
Brick wins on required stone, but the acquisition cost of stone is super low. It's literally the most common block in the game besides possibly air. In every other category, cobblestone wins. So what am I missing? What is the use case for bricks? Their cost should come down, or their benefit should come up, or both.
Adam the Waster
Well-known member
you would think that bricks made from a forge would be better then ones made by just shaping rocks together. but OK!
still like scrap blocks...
Not that I dispute that bricks could get some further benefit. But time used in one or more forges is different to time used while building in the backpack. For both materials the most time **for the player himself** seems to be used in aquiring the materials. And hasn't clay a comfortable lead there compared to stone ?
I always thought brick was an alternative for people who want to build good looking buildings, not for defense. Is there even a big enough gap between wood and cobblestone OR cobbelstone and concrete to put brick in?
Adam the Waster
Well-known member
i just make my home into a Makeshift looking Town or settlement like one of those white river bases
and uses everything from food for walkways , scrap , rock etc
Laz Man
Fun Pimps Staff
Agreed. In regards to stat balance feedback, hopefully the incoming perk level reduction will help that feel better.
In regards to number 3, I know that's a balance thing for INT skills/perks. Perhaps there is another way to balance instead crafting time. However, being an INT build in my current playthrough, I do appreciate the bonus...
- - - Updated - - -
Good point. However, if there really is no benefit other than aesthetics, then it might as well be a paint option instead. Personally, I would rather have an alternate use case (pro/con vs cobble). For example, brick plating (if not already a thing
) that you can layer over for added defense.With the current balance of A18, cobble feels like the route to go. Early game I was even buying cobble from the trader to save time. It's relatively inexpensive (A18.1)
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Master Chef should also allow you to feed other players IMO, so any benefits from the skill also help other players.
Idea for the Advanced Engineering problem: instead of having forge/workbench perk crafting bonuses apply to the player, have them apply to the crafting stations that the player builds. The items don't stack, so you could make them have Quality tiers based on the Advanced Engineering level. Could do the same with Yeah Science! and chem stations too.
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Liesel Weppen
New member
I completely disagree. The leveling speeds are completely messed up in A18.
Not just between miners and looters. Now the most OP leveling is building stuff.
I assume with "looting" you mean getting XP from killing zombies. The fastest way to level up is now building (especially upgrading blocks). From time to time i get even more XP from placing new (reinforced concrete) blocks where they have been destroyed during bloodmoin than from killing Zs during the bloodmoon even with shared XP from my mates.
We already switched the building activity because of level differences. Our builder just places rebar frames and then another player upgrades them just to farm XP. If our builder would do that all himself, he would be at least 20 level ahead of the rest.
The other difference with mininig is, zombies are limited, with mining you can dig just one tunnel until you puke, just for leveling purposes. And without any risk, too.
I'm not sure how to do it properly, but imho killing Zs should be the best source of XP. Other things should still give XP, but in a matter of risk and reward and how repatable the aktion is.
Minandreas
New member
Don't really know anything about the building thing. I wasn't building stuff. So I can't speak to that at all.
Mining was way faster at first. I was outleveling everyone pretty easily. But that was me doing nothing but mining almost non stop. (I'm weird and find that mind numbing activity relaxing after a long week.) But once people got geared up and clearing huge POIs filled with higher level enemies, they started leveling faster than me. Not by an enormous margin. But they did.
It's not perfect. But it felt better than prior alphas to my group. I've left the mines now to join the looters in our group at this point and only go mining if we need the resources. I'm level 40ish.
As for the part about zombie killing should give more exp because it has risk, I'm pretty neutral to that statement. I made a post that kind of makes commentary on that a while ago that I'll link. It was during early A17 when killing zombies was far far better for leveling, at least early game. So much so that it felt like THE way to go if you wanted exp. https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?111778-Alpha-18-Dev-Diary!!&p=973060&viewfull=1#post973060
Not quite sure what you mean. But ya, I'd definitely like to feel like someone with ranks in cooking has a distinct edge over someone that doesn't. A reason they should be cooking the food and not someone else that just so happened to read recipes from loot. But atm that's not how it is.
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dcsobral
New member
Does it drive anyone else crazy that railings do not protect against falling? In fact, they make it somewhat _easier_ to fall, particularly on narrow staircases. I wish a class was added for it, similar to the ladder's, but making it so players get stuck to the ground next to a railing.
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