PC Alpha 18 feedback and balancing thread

[khzmusik]

A18 B139～A18.1 B5
Turbo is used on the bicycle, the character's physical strength is consumed to 0, and the turbo can still continue to function.


Is this a wrong setting?

I'm sure it's a bug. I noticed it too... but didn't report it, because I don't want it fixed. :smile-new:

EDIT: Also, apologies, it's been a while since I read this thread and didn't realize these posts were so old. I didn't intend to necro-post.

 

[madmole]

Insane, Nightmare all day, 64 hordes Day 49
As far as A18 goes, I must say that the developer has done a great job on FPS and texture improvement. I have been playing none stop since A18 was in experimental.

But there are a few things I want to address.

1. Hit box is off sometimes in both melee and mining. I missed my power attack multiple times when zombies got really close to me. As for mining, the game would intentionally hit the ore behind, instead of the ore that was directly targeted by my hit box.

2.Weapon quality and cloth quality bug. I have Q6 leather chest armor that yields 9 armor rating, while a Q5 leather cheat armor yiles 10 armor rating. The Q6 marksman rifile has a size of 4 magazine, but the Q3 marksmen rifle has a magazine of 5.

3. I really enjoy going out to look for books. However, I was hoping that the developer can do a combination of "learn by doing" from A16 while keeping perks/skills from A18.

4. The only problem I have with the perk system in A18 is that, I personally like the baseball bat/club, but not a fan of the shotgun. Therefore I invested in fortitude because I want to use the AK and the machine gun. Problem is, in a solo game, Intellect is a must have(transportation, forges, workbench, crucible) unless the player was really lucky to find the blueprint of those. As a result, I have always find myself having a hard time to lv up, and not have enough skill points to spend.

5. This is not a bug, but I really wish that the team can bring back steel polish/stainless steel upgrade. On insane difficulty, with 64 zombies, 90% of zombies were feral radiated. I had about 10 feral radiated cops and couple demolishes showed up, and my steel defense did not stand a chance. I am aware that a 10k hp block may make a defense invincible on lower difficulty(enemies are easier to kill), but I still hope that the developer can bring back the steel polish upgrades. Maybe make is very hard, expensive to obtain.

I appreciate the time and effort TFP has putted into 7D2D. The game has made great improvements, and I really enjoyed playing it.

2: Stat are random. A Q3 is generally better than a Q2 but not always.

5: Turn down zombie block damage. We don't need super high hit point blocks breaking the easier modes with invulnerable forts, or build a better base, with several meters of concrete and multiple air locks.

 

[madmole]

office chairs.
we can slowly harvest them for 1-2 leather. 4 with all talents

we can just scrap them in a second for 6 leather.

in my server I made it unscrapabble (is that a word?), but I wish I knew how to change the scrap results

Lower the weight of the item.

 

[madmole]

MM, sunset in the desert seems unnecessarily red, i even confused it several times with the beginning of a bloody night.

I'll nerf it a bit. With the new saturated post processing filter it is now too much.

 

[madmole]

Timed charges seem very worthless and not at all in line with their in-game description.
This was incredibly disappointing. A stick of dynamite can leave a large crater, but a block of C4 literally does not damage blocks. At all. At best, it damages doors. And even then, barely. It's supposed to do thousands of damage, yet it did a mere 500 damage to an ordinary iron door.

Why are timed charges so useless? They're supposed to be a top-tier explosive. We were looking forward to using them as mining tools, but they do not damage blocks at all. In fact, they don't even damage people! We dropped them to give them to each other, not realizing they auto-armed, and it blew up at our feet, doing zero damage.

They are meant to be a very small explosion to take out one metal block, like a locked safe or vault door, I'll do some testing and tune them, they were dealing significant damage.

 

[madmole]

So by that logic you'll remove pipes , electrical components and batteries too ?

Everything you say has the opposite effect of my intent, so I give up with you. Go troll someone else.

 

[custom_hero]

Been playing A18 I'm really happy with the balances and fixes the devs have put in his time around. After A17 I almost thought it was game over for me since I didn't like the new direction of the game at all back then.
I see others address a lot of the small things I would have mentioned, so I'm just gonna stick to two:

1. This game really needs a FOV slider that works, not console command, FOV slider. This game is one of the few games that can make me a bit seasick while playing because of the 65 FOV lock.

2. Shared XP on traps, atm we're 5 people plaing together, only one of us gets XP when a zombie dies on trap because of the talents and who "owns" the trap. This is counterproductive for the coop experience and has led us to avoid the traps because one player ended up with most of the XP. We tried putting points into the same talent to get the XP as well, doesnt work.

fov needed, I agree, more than once wrote about this.

- - - Updated - - -

1-Why you delete jail door?

in 16 alpha there was a jail door block. Which could be crafted and used in building.

do you add it to the game in the next builds?

2-Is it possible to add a advanced rotation to the rolling garage door?

I want to use it as a bunker door.

 

[Hollowprime]

I am either getting paranoid or my reply has been removed. Either way, the who trolls the community is you madmole. I digged this reply from another thread :

If I could do it all over again I'd have thrown out the diggable terrain. Alpha 1 could have had static Unity terrain, a simple water plane, ran 30% better, used way less ram, console wouldn't have been so beat down, allowed faster vehicles, looked as good as 18's terrain does now, (Minus the Justin talent) and we wouldn't have wasted energy on mining, cave systems, multiple versions of trees, etc. Mining could have been mining POIs with respawning nuggets like rust/skyrim/subnautica with a nice model. We'd anger 10% and gain 200% new players that don't give a ♥♥♥♥ about deformable terrain and buggy water.
At some point we might release a static terrain option for 7 days just to see the performance gains. IMO most people would run it for the performance gains and better pvp, none of this wimpy underground base business, fight like a man like in TWD. You don't see those guys living in caves/mines.

What may have made us great has also slowed us down and kept us indy looking/performing. I think mining is ok but its not part of the secret sauce, we'd still have mining it just wouldn't be ugly 3d mining. At this point we'd kind of solved it mostly but it could have saved us a lot of time and headaches, allowing us to focus on cool stuff like we are able to now.

So you effectively cheesed half the community into buying a voxel game which you progressively turn into a fortnite/pubg/rust clone ? You think the gamers will accept a game they paid to turn into a completely different genre?

I dare you to make a sticky thread out of this and see the reactions from the community.

Because I'm frankly done with supporting this game.

 

[MelT]

To be clear, perks and books have zero overlap. Schematics are poor man's versions of the perk, which we will prove more as time goes on and we finish the game. Some are just basic unlocks because other features aren't in yet, such as grease monkey.

Noice, that's what I had hoped for. Looking forward to it!

 

[madmole]

I am either getting paranoid or my reply has been removed. Either way, the who trolls the community is you madmole. I digged this reply from another thread :


So you effectively cheesed half the community into buying a voxel game which you progressively turn into a fortnite/pubg/rust clone ? You think the gamers will accept a game they paid to turn into a completely different genre?

I dare you to make a sticky thread out of this and see the reactions from the community.

Because I'm frankly done with supporting this game.

What is wrong with adding an option to let players have static terrain that would improve performance and allow for faster vehicles, high performance water, and way more zombies on screen? I think a few players might appreciate that.

I never said we'd remove diggable terrain completely. Its people like you who don't comprehend what I say that make it impossible to talk shop/pie in the sky ideas here.

 

[Blake_]

2: Stat are random. A Q3 is generally better than a Q2 but not always.5: Turn down zombie block damage. We don't need super high hit point blocks breaking the easier modes with invulnerable forts, or build a better base, with several meters of concrete and multiple air locks.

I know how random stats are supposed to work. You said that generally speaking, the best random tier 1 will be the same as a tier 3 (yellow) or even a tier 4 (green) mid stats.

Well. I need to test it a bit more. but armor is FULLY random, and that is confirmed and (I hope) a big fat bug. Tier 1 leather armor can have better defense than tier 6.

And that, my friend, sucks. There ought to be a range per quality in everything, so they are consistent.

Example :

Tier 1 leather : 7- 10 defense

Tier 2 leather : 8- 11 defense

Tier 3 leather : 9- 12 defense

Tier 4 leather : 10- 13 defense

Tier 5 leather : 11- 14 defense

Tier 6 leather : 12- 15 defense

Current:

Tier 1 2 3 4 5 6: 8-15 defense (not the real values, I think leather only goes up to 13, but you get the point)

(needs further testing, but that is based on about a hundred pieces of leather and iron armor)

Your current Random is random results in the same crap that when mods were the only thing that improved weapons, because you have exactly the same system, just 4 times the stuff.

 

[Laz Man]

I know how random stats are supposed to work. You said that generally speaking, the best random tier 1 will be the same as a tier 3 (yellow) or even a tier 4 (green) mid stats.
Well. I need to test it a bit more. but armor is FULLY random, and that is confirmed and (I hope) a big fat bug. Tier 1 leather armor can have better defense than tier 6.

And that, my friend, sucks. There ought to be a range per quality in everything, so they are consistent.

Example :

Tier 1 leather : 7- 10 defense

Tier 2 leather : 8- 11 defense

Tier 3 leather : 9- 12 defense

Tier 4 leather : 10- 13 defense

Tier 5 leather : 11- 14 defense

Tier 6 leather : 12- 15 defense

Current:

Tier 1 2 3 4 5 6: 8-15 defense (not the real values, I think leather only goes up to 13, but you get the point)

(needs further testing, but that is based on about a hundred pieces of leather and iron armor)

Your current Random is random results in the same crap that when mods were the only thing that improved weapons, because you have exactly the same system, just 4 times the stuff.

Damage resist is not currently tied to quality at all but should be in my opinion. Also the damage resist spread is so small it probably doesnt matter all to much in the grand scheme of things. Overall I think the current implementation just needs alittle more balancing. Here was my XML analysis and recommednations.

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?132496-Randomized-stats-and-different-tiers&p=1054449&viewfull=1#post1054449

Edit: For weapons this is different. Damage is tied to quality for those.

 

[Hek Harris]

I am either getting paranoid or my reply has been removed. Either way, the who trolls the community is you madmole. I digged this reply from another thread :


So you effectively cheesed half the community into buying a voxel game which you progressively turn into a fortnite/pubg/rust clone ? You think the gamers will accept a game they paid to turn into a completely different genre?

I dare you to make a sticky thread out of this and see the reactions from the community.

Because I'm frankly done with supporting this game.

Madmole isn't your mom. You should stop testing the limits of his patience.

 

[beHypE]

I am either getting paranoid or my reply has been removed. Either way, the who trolls the community is you madmole. I digged this reply from another thread :


So you effectively cheesed half the community into buying a voxel game which you progressively turn into a fortnite/pubg/rust clone ? You think the gamers will accept a game they paid to turn into a completely different genre?

I dare you to make a sticky thread out of this and see the reactions from the community.

Because I'm frankly done with supporting this game.

Jesus then just be gone already. You're obviously not having a good time playing nor visiting the forums so enjoy something else and everyone will be happy.

 

[Eatit]

My wife and I play together on default settings.

The first day of our game is difficult. We may die once or twice. Once we have a gun it's game over and that happens rather quickly.

The bow is garbage, inaccurate, too few feathers, too little damage. Eclipsed by the Spear.

Crafting is gone... We find everything we need usually long before we can make it.

Bullets are the only thing we craft on a regular basis. There are exceptions like an occasional gun mod.

Gardening/Cooking is gone... we find more than enough canned food to live on without the risk of food poisoning.

Building is gone... We now make a cheap disposable Blood Moon base after day 14 every 7 days to combat the destructiveness of the Zs.

Nothing in the game is hard after day 3 save the bombers, they are way to OP. We make separate bases for crafting/storage and Blood Moon. I can't imagine the new player experience being good if the bomber wipes out everything they've worked for up to that point. They don't know to make a separate base for Blood Moon.

The game is over around day 28 as we have achieved everything. There is nothing left to do.

Guns and Ammo abound, we stockpile ammo in the thousands for horde night. The 150 stacks of 7.62 are annoying. We require 1500-2000

7.62 each for a horde night. That's 20+ inventory slots and an a**load of clicking to manage inventory. <--- annoying

Steel tools are too few and become obsolete when we find chainsaws and augers before steel tools.

Why create the 4x4 or the gyro? The motorcycle is better in every respect. No sense wasting the points to get them. With the investment required they should be better in some way. Right now the gyro is the highest level and is the slowest least storage. What's the point?

Vehicles are for faster movement from home to poi and back with added inventory space. The 4x4 is slower and carries less than 2 motorcycles. What is it good for?

18 Feels more like we are playing coop Fallout 3 than 7D2D. Zombie shooter nothing more. Where in the past is was so much more.

Who took the time to arrange all the lamps in the POIs to point to all the holes blown in the walls? Make a ladder and climb to the roof. The magic pile of loot is there. Why are there dungeon crawls in every house?

 

[Jugginator]

My wife and I play together on default settings.

There's your main issue, raising the difficulty a bit / changing the run settings / horde count / lowering the 24 hour cycle and etc. will make you change your mind a bit about mid/late game challenges. Turning off loot respawn, force airdrops weekly or off, that stuff. You also won't be building a basic cheap base for horde nights when your gamestage rapidly increases with above settings, too. You gotta get crafty (as well as craft a lot of items). Those guns you find become pathetic and you need to craft or find better ones. Same for mods, you'll be crafting plenty as well as need traps and various different building blocks. Try jog or run (or sprint) during the day, nightmare speed rest of the settings too.

You'll need to be somewhat of a gardener and hunter with loot respawns off... and in previous alphas, food was completely irreverent to begin with lol, the only time one gardened was to eat 9000 meat stews to lvl up wellness or to roleplay. Kill a few vultures and you'll never worry about arrows again.

 

[rdunham3]

There's your main issue, raising the difficulty a bit / changing the run settings / horde count / lowering the 24 hour cycle and etc. will make you change your mind a bit about mid/late game challenges. Turning off loot respawn, force airdrops weekly or off, that stuff. You also won't be building a basic cheap base for horde nights when your gamestage rapidly increases with above settings, too. You gotta get crafty (as well as craft a lot of items). Those guns you find become pathetic and you need to craft or find better ones. Same for mods, you'll be crafting plenty as well as need traps and various different building blocks. Try jog or run (or sprint) during the day, nightmare speed rest of the settings too.
You'll need to be somewhat of a gardener and hunter with loot respawns off... and in previous alphas, food was completely irreverent to begin with lol, the only time one gardened was to eat 9000 meat stews to lvl up wellness or to roleplay. Kill a few vultures and you'll never worry about arrows again.

While I agree that playing as an experienced team probably means they should up the difficulty a notch, most of the feedback they gave is perfectly good opinion material for a feedback and balancing thread.

Canned food being the safer option has, in my opinion also, made gardening and cooking less desirable. I'll still do it if I run a game long enough but as long as I'm focusing on looting I don't even care if a deer gets away.

The primitive bow is indeed garbage, and sadly this is by design. May as well have no primitive bow and have the starter quest direct you to make a spear. There are still plenty of other bow/crossbow weapons. Feathers aren't really an issue. There are still plenty of nests, vultures, feathers in trash etc.

Crafting by design won't get you the great guns. Those have to be looted. Gun crafting has been rendered pointless for many players, catering only to those who want a particular gun and RNG refuses to provide it. I'd like to see weapon crafting get a little more love so it's not a feature of last resort, but their focus lately seems to be demoting crafting to a 2nd class aspect of the game so it's unlikely to make a comeback. Much like building fancy structures has been relegated to an only-for-BM and expect massive destruction thing. It's mostly pointless to make a casual-grade base or a less-than-fortress fighting base now. Use a disposable POI or put your single-player crafting stations out in a field somewhere and save yourself the headache when the game decides to path everything right through the area simply because you've been there in the last few hours.

My last session I came to the realization I was seeking out trash and cars and ignoring most of the other lootables as less reward for the effort, because I needed schematics and the occasional rare good thing that cars provide far more than I needed anything contained in the buildings. If I continue that world much longer I'll have to go in to get to end-POI crates for the chance at decent weapons and probably a bit more food, but currently (early game) the rewards inside structures aren't worth the risk.

 

[Laz Man]

Madmole isn't your mom. You should stop testing the limits of his patience.

 

[Eatit]

What you said doesn't make much sense to me.

Loot respawns off? We finish before anything respawns in 30 days.

We loot town after town, and find more than enough food.

In previous Alphas making meat stew had a reason, you said it. Get Wellness up. It no longer has a reason. It actually has a negative, you get food poison.

Craft better than you can find??? You can't craft higher than T5. You can find T6. Crafting Dead!!!

You won't be creating cheap base with high game stage??? What we're supposed to invest tons of hours so they can knock it down in seconds?

Yes we can make it harder with settings and we do. I was commenting on the default. Changing the difficulty won't make the basic game mechanics different. It will still be boring AF zombie shooter, not the amazingly different thing it used to be.

 

[Freshzombie]

I agree with you on the part where crafting becomes somewhat pointless in a18.

I would like to see T6 is craftable, but not lootable nor can be purchase from trader.

Im currently playing on insane difficulty with nightmare speed (pretty much just as fast as the player, if not faster) all day, 64 hordes. Ihad to not be reckless looting houses after houses.

A lot of time i just had to disenagage, build a 2x2 platform outside, place the junk turret down and get ready to melee. Not enough ammos because looting was very challenging.

On insane difficulty, it drives up the game stage faster. If you like, set the xp to 300%.

The faster you lv up, the faster your game stage increases.

The reason why i play on this difficulty is not because im good. But i find it more challenging and keep me in the game.

The default difficulty is meant to captures the attention of new players.

But yeah, i do agree with you on how the crafting and looting need a rebalance.