PC A question on force fields.

[WarMongerian]

Is there a max size you can force the zombies to path around, using a 5 deep, 3 wide force field?  When I finished building mine, within my 71x71 land claim base, the zombies kept crossing the force field to get to the sidewalk I had running around my base, instead of circling the whole thing and comins at me from the wide open path/entrance in the east,  when that happened, I extender my walls out one more block, meaning the force field now runs right up to my walls, without any space between the FF and the walls.

What am I doing wrong, fifth Horde night didn't work at all as I had planned, the zombies kept bunching up around back, and only  trickle ever came through the open path, and I had to go out and kill them outside the base, which wasted all the time building the base in the first place.

Help?!!?

 

[stample]

There is a limit.  Its basically how far the AI looks to find a path.  I don't recall exactly, but I think it was around 33 blocks horizontally.  Vertical doesn't seem to apply, and the path can be any length within that 33 block distance.  i.e. as long as the path starts 32 blocks away, it can swerve back and forth like a country ridge road and require 200 blocks of traversal to get to you, and that's fine.

 

[Riamus]

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "force field."  I'm going to assume you just mean a wall that you want them to path around.  Zombies try to take the easiest route to you, however they are only going to go a certain distance out of the way to reach you.  I don't know that exact distance as that would require a lot of testing to figure out, I think.  But I know that even if you make a maze for them to go through, if that requires them to move away from you for very far, they will not follow the maze and will instead just try to break through.  As long as they are mostly heading towards you, it's usually fine.  And some moving away is fine, but you would likely have trouble if you made a maze that had them come up one path almost to you, then turn and go down another path 20 blocks away from you and then back towards you and back away from you and so on.  That distance heading away from you would probably be too great and they wouldn't follow it (at least, most wouldn't).

As far as just distances involved to get around your base (or wall), I've had zombies path correctly around bases that were around 30x30 (estimated).  I have had a larger base where they wouldn't path around and would just beat on the walls on the side they came from if the "entrance" was on the opposite side.

 

[Vaeliorin]

Yes, there's definitely a limit, though it used to be much larger.  I had the same thing happen to me when they changed the limit, all of a sudden I had zombies piling into a trench and attacking the back wall of my base instead of following the route I had laid out.  Sadly, you can't really make massive horde bases any longer.

 

[Riamus]

Yes, there's definitely a limit, though it used to be much larger.  I had the same thing happen to me when they changed the limit, all of a sudden I had zombies piling into a trench and attacking the back wall of my base instead of following the route I had laid out.  Sadly, you can't really make massive horde bases any longer.

Well... not if you want a single path.  However, I made a really large (long) horde base where there were identical paths from both directions on the short sides and it worked very well.  You could also make a very large square base with entrances on all four sides.  Those multiple entrances can either converge near your location or just remain separate.  But yes, you can't just have a single opening on one side of a large horde base now.

 

[Dead Smarty]

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "force field."  I'm going to assume you just mean a wall that you want them to path around.

Normaly it referes to the unpathable blocks also known as "cheese". It ia not a wall, just blocks they don't cross if they can walk around.

 

[Riamus]

Normaly it referes to the unpathable blocks also known as "cheese". It ia not a wall, just blocks they don't cross if they can walk around.

Ah.  Well, not something I would do then.  But my comment would apply regardless of cheesing the game or using an actual wall.  They just won't have a chance to break through that "cheese" but would just pile up on the other side.

 

[Javabean867]

If there isn't a viable path they will just cross your force field blocks.  They might have difficulty doing so, but yeah they will cross them and eat your face.

If this is for a hoard base you just want to use the force fields in areas that you want to protect.  Just make sure there is a path to get to you.

If this is for your home base I recommend setting up a mini hoard fighting position, that way the zambs go to a place where you can fight them easily.

 

[Dark Wun]

Normaly it referes to the unpathable blocks also known as "cheese". It ia not a wall, just blocks they don't cross if they can walk around.

I recently learned this from watching recent YT videos on horde bases. Some content creators are uploading tutorials centreed around the use of 'forcefields'. I call them programming glitch exploitations. Not sure why people invest hours in a strategy that can be totally nullified if the devs catch wind and decide to patch it up in a quick patch release.... but to each their own.

 

[Riamus]

I recently learned this from watching recent YT videos on horde bases. Some content creators are uploading tutorials centreed around the use of 'forcefields'. I call them programming glitch exploitations. Not sure why people invest hours in a strategy that can be totally nullified if the devs catch wind and decide to patch it up in a quick patch release.... but to each their own.

Yeah, it isn't how I would want to play.  I'd rather design something that works based on what makes sense rather than based on cheesing the game.  But some people just find joy in finding ways to get around various game mechanics.

 

[Dead Smarty]

I recently learned this from watching recent YT videos on horde bases. Some content creators are uploading tutorials centreed around the use of 'forcefields'. I call them programming glitch exploitations. Not sure why people invest hours in a strategy that can be totally nullified if the devs catch wind and decide to patch it up in a quick patch release.... but to each their own.

Haven't used them yet but if you consider them wildrosters it is just a mechanic and not a glitch.

 

[WarMongerian]

I don't skimp on the walls.  I just wanted to keep the zombies from doing damage all the way round my base, and the YT videos seemed to offer a way to force the zombies to leave my walls alone, and just come from a single direction on Horde night, rather than all the points of the compass.  

I got my base paved and 'forced fielded', and the darn zombies just keep getting stuck outside the walls, forcing me to go outside the walls to kill them. 

Before I had the base paved, and without the force fields, Horde night was fun and entertaining, but also aggravating when the zombies were always able to get closer to me than I liked.

I don't want to let the zombies keep coming at me from opposite directions, nor from all four points of the compass, but I'm stumped with keeping off the walls, and trying to get to me in the center of the land claim.

Maybe I need force fields inside the walls (and thus a much smaller area/pathing choice), to let them spawn anywhere, but then funnel them all to the east side of the base?

 

[theFlu]

Maybe I need force fields inside the walls (and thus a much smaller area/pathing choice), to let them spawn anywhere, but then funnel them all to the east side of the base?

Something along those lines will work. Now that you have the force fields, just give a path over them on each side and continue a "proper path" from there. The force field should seem like a ditch for the zeds, so they "should" take a flat path across if one exists. And you might be tempted to use a drawbridge, but that was rather bugged for pathing the last I saw it - zeds think it's always open, and run into the pit..  

 

[Riamus]

I would just point out that you can easily control the zombie pathing without cheesing the game by using these so-called forcefields.  As long as your horde base is not huge and you have a path that can reach where you are located, they will follow the path you choose for them, regardless which side they come from.  Now, if your path isn't good or if there are multiple paths that can reach you with around the same difficulty, then they may try to reach you from multiple directions.  For example, if you have a ladder to the ground inside your base and you're on the second floor with a steel vault door blocking the path to where you are and your walls are concrete, they'll just go through your walls because breaking through them is easier than breaking through the vault door and you have a ladder they can use to reach you if they do break through the walls.  But if you have a path that has less resistance than your walls, they should follow that path as long as it's not too long of a distance.  You should have no trouble with sizes of around 25x25 and perhaps somewhat larger for a horde base.  Also remember that if a wall is damaged already, they may choose to attack that location as it may be less resistance than another path since it's already damaged.

Note that zombies can switch to destruction mode, where they will attack anything around them even if there is a better path to reach you.  You can easily "disable" this by shooting them and you'll either kill them or they'll turn away from their destruction mode and follow the path.

If you have trouble getting a normal horde base to work, you can always show some screenshots of your base from each direction and the path you have set up and someone could tell you what you need to do to fix it without any need for these "forcefields."  Of course, it's up to you how you play the game, and if you like using those, that's your choice.  But if you'd like to learn how to set up a horde base without needing to cheese the game, it is definitely possible.

 

[Dead Smarty]

I've seen a YT video by Cautious Pancake where he stated the maximum path lenght is 2048. He build a up/down going block stair base within 35x55 (estimated, not counted blocks) to slow them down as much as possible. Seems the 33 distance falls in these dimensions if he's not completely on the edge and if that 33 is grid size and not as radius.
Seems to me that the maximum usable forcefield would be 32 from your position facing the bottleneck entrance and 32 to eithe side, so withing a 33x65 rectangle. Since I'm not in the mood for building a big boring square with a trench around I leave it to someone else to test this, sorry.

 

[pApA^LeGBa]

There is a limit to the distance they are willing to go around when confronted with a force field block that they would usually avoid. Jawoodle also made a video on this, i haven´t tried it, so you will have to look that up yourself how much that exactly is.

 

[WarMongerian]

As long as your horde base is not huge and you have a path that can reach where you are located, they will follow the path you choose for them, regardless which side they come from. 

Well, what is a huge base?  My land claim (which is 71 x 71) is huge, but it contains 4 buildings, the zombie fighting parts of which are small, but now that I walled off all but the east, the lazy zombies that don't spawn on the east side, are just walking up to my fortress walls, and doing damage that I then have to repair after horde night, and even worse, I have to go to them, rather than them coming to me.  So, it looks like, due to lazy pathing/short range pathing, I have to dig out holes in my outer walls, and then, once the zombies are given a free ride to the near center of my base, only then can I try to impose pathing choices.

EDIT:  I have come to the conclusion, Force Fields may be interesting and useful, but only in a small installation.  My current base, in it's current configuration, is just broken.

This is what I intend to rebuild my bse as.

 

[Riamus]

I am not certain what all the colors represent in that, but if that entire green/gray square area is enclosed, then you would definitely see problems.  As I had mentioned, around 25x25 area works, but much more than that can start having trouble (I don't know the exact size where problems start).  If those gray areas are the bases and the green are open areas, then you should have no problem, no matter which of those you are in.

 

[WarMongerian]

Going by the image;

The land claim is in dark brown, with the 8 blocks in light brown represent my 3x3 central torch tower.

Next, the 4 dark green lines with red blocks at either end represent the 4 causeways, which are a solid 5 blocks high, no gaps, and provide the backbone for my archer platforms, which are depicted as pink, with the red blocks being the iron hatches/iron doors into the base/crafting sections, or guarding the ladders.  The archer platforms are 1 block thick, but at the 5th block above the ground, supported by a pair of dark grey structural support pillars on either side of the walkways.

On day 7, I'll typically have just the central torch tower and the four pink archer platforms built and ready for first horde night.  Those 5 items really make up all of the tactical base, and everything else is just non-combat structure..

Because of my health/eyesight, I don't even try to use guns, as not being able to perform precision hand eye coordination, and being unable to hold my mouse steady to be able to draw a bead on a distant zombie (if I can even see it in the first place), isn't a thing for me.

So, how do I fight?  Gathering tools, bow class and knife class weapons.  No traps, no guns, no explosives.

Too be able to see the zombies on horde night, I use many torches initially, but once I can dig up a significant part of the land claim, I put down building blocks to prevent zombies spawning there, and to have a light background, which they show up against well, even with my eyesight.

As far as tactics, I climb  up, whittle down the dogs/dire wolves (usually just see them on 1st horde night), and drop down to ground level if there are more than a few zombies on the ladder, and, without guns, just line them up and kill them with my 'mighty' shovel.  I repeat the process as often as needed, and don't try to 'hold' any ladder/hatch, rather, just let the zombies mass, killing as many as possible, before just jumping down, climbing the next ladder, and just rinse and repeat.

Does this help any...?

 

[Dead Smarty]

To me 71x71 is huge. Just had my 12th horde and still perfectly happy with my combined workshop/melee service desk base, fitting easy in the standard 41x41. Only just starting to add turrets but still way too busy with exploring to have a lot of time building.
I would say: Don't punch above your weight. If you can't maintain the turrets needed to defend a base like that you probably don't need it.