Player Choice Is the Heart of a Sandbox Game

Kalnazzar

Kalnazzar

Refugee
First off, I want to say thank you to The Fun Pimps for the Town Hall livestream. That event was one of your best community moments. You’ve posted responses before, but seeing you face-to-face and hearing your thoughts directly was far more impactful. It really means a lot—thank you again for taking the time.​



🌾 Farming – Let Both Systems Exist​


Farming was simplified for players who prefer low-maintenance AFK gameplay, and that’s totally fine. But the older, hands-on farming system (tilling, fertilizing, watering) gave players like me more involvement and immersion. Why not offer both as valid paths?


Ideas to expand hands-on farming:


  • Bring back hoeing and fertilizing for improved yields.
  • Rain or irrigation could supply water, using dew collectors + pipes, buckets, or sprinkler systems.
  • Let us build underground farms using UV lights powered by electricity.

The current system is great for convenience. But player agency means offering multiple gameplay paths—not removing one to simplify another. A sandbox thrives on choice.



💧 Water & Jars – Simplified Too Far​


The Dew Collector feels like a stamina timer from a mobile game: passive, slow, and unrewarding. Glass jars added immersion—gathering, purifying, and managing risk.


Instead of replacing jars, why not let both exist?


Balance suggestion:
  • Jars can break (crit hits, falls, etc.), adding risk.
  • Water collection can be harder with toxicity/radiation, requiring purification.
  • Dew Collectors remain for players who prefer hands-off collection.

Survival Station Idea:
A Multi-Stage Water Purification Station, with crafted tool components that degrade based on how toxic the source is. More polluted = more stages used. Tools like:
  1. Sediment Filters – Gravel, sand, mesh
  2. Charcoal Layer – Removes chemicals
  3. Distillation Chamber – Removes salts and microbes
  4. Ion Resin/Ceramic – Removes radiation traces
  5. UV Light (optional) – Kills final pathogens

Water source + survival depth = immersive and rewarding gameplay loop.



🔧 Learn by Doing – A Hybrid System Would Shine​


Removing Learn by Doing lost something special. Magazine progression is solid for unlocking things, but skill growth should still come from actual gameplay.

Why not a hybrid system?
  • 📘 Magazines unlock tools, weapons, food, etc.
  • 🛠️ Usage = skill growth. The more you use a weapon, the better you are with it.
  • ⚔️ Combat use improves passive stats (speed, stamina, knockback, etc.)
  • 🧠 Unlock Techniques with mastery—like a rifle knockback skill when enemies get close.


🔫 Gunsmithing & Crafting Mastery​


Bring depth to weapon crafting. A Gunsmithing Workbench and a separate Bullet Press Station would be amazing additions.
  • Crafting parts improves Gunsmithing skill.
  • Better skill = higher quality components.
  • Magazines unlock part types, but your output quality comes from practice.
  • Legendary weapons are earned, not just found.


🔁 Final Thoughts​


This isn’t about reverting everything—it’s about offering paths. Old and new systems can coexist. Farming, water, and crafting can all offer depth without alienating new players. What’s made 7DTD last for years isn’t just the survival—it’s the freedom to survive in your own way. Keep that spirit alive, and we’ll keep playing.

​
 

Attachments

  • Aquaforge MK.png
    Aquaforge MK.png
    1.9 MB · Views: 1
Kalnazzar said:
First off, I want to say thank you to The Fun Pimps for the Town Hall livestream. That event was one of your best community moments. You’ve posted responses before, but seeing you face-to-face and hearing your thoughts directly was far more impactful. It really means a lot—thank you again for taking the time.​



🌾 Farming – Let Both Systems Exist​


Farming was simplified for players who prefer low-maintenance AFK gameplay, and that’s totally fine. But the older, hands-on farming system (tilling, fertilizing, watering) gave players like me more involvement and immersion. Why not offer both as valid paths?


Ideas to expand hands-on farming:


  • Bring back hoeing and fertilizing for improved yields.
  • Rain or irrigation could supply water, using dew collectors + pipes, buckets, or sprinkler systems.
  • Let us build underground farms using UV lights powered by electricity.

The current system is great for convenience. But player agency means offering multiple gameplay paths—not removing one to simplify another. A sandbox thrives on choice.



💧 Water & Jars – Simplified Too Far​


The Dew Collector feels like a stamina timer from a mobile game: passive, slow, and unrewarding. Glass jars added immersion—gathering, purifying, and managing risk.


Instead of replacing jars, why not let both exist?


Balance suggestion:
  • Jars can break (crit hits, falls, etc.), adding risk.
  • Water collection can be harder with toxicity/radiation, requiring purification.
  • Dew Collectors remain for players who prefer hands-off collection.

Survival Station Idea:
A Multi-Stage Water Purification Station, with crafted tool components that degrade based on how toxic the source is. More polluted = more stages used. Tools like:
  1. Sediment Filters – Gravel, sand, mesh
  2. Charcoal Layer – Removes chemicals
  3. Distillation Chamber – Removes salts and microbes
  4. Ion Resin/Ceramic – Removes radiation traces
  5. UV Light (optional) – Kills final pathogens

Water source + survival depth = immersive and rewarding gameplay loop.



🔧 Learn by Doing – A Hybrid System Would Shine​


Removing Learn by Doing lost something special. Magazine progression is solid for unlocking things, but skill growth should still come from actual gameplay.

Why not a hybrid system?
  • 📘 Magazines unlock tools, weapons, food, etc.
  • 🛠️ Usage = skill growth. The more you use a weapon, the better you are with it.
  • ⚔️ Combat use improves passive stats (speed, stamina, knockback, etc.)
  • 🧠 Unlock Techniques with mastery—like a rifle knockback skill when enemies get close.


🔫 Gunsmithing & Crafting Mastery​


Bring depth to weapon crafting. A Gunsmithing Workbench and a separate Bullet Press Station would be amazing additions.
  • Crafting parts improves Gunsmithing skill.
  • Better skill = higher quality components.
  • Magazines unlock part types, but your output quality comes from practice.
  • Legendary weapons are earned, not just found.


🔁 Final Thoughts​


This isn’t about reverting everything—it’s about offering paths. Old and new systems can coexist. Farming, water, and crafting can all offer depth without alienating new players. What’s made 7DTD last for years isn’t just the survival—it’s the freedom to survive in your own way. Keep that spirit alive, and we’ll keep playing.

​
Click to expand...
Good ideas, farming in the style of the old versions was better in my opinion, I like the idea of irrigation and sprinklers, you could use the existing pipes and valves in the game, and uv lights and indoor crops I like, you could use the hydroponic growing racks, which can be seen in some poi.



The water purification station is something that other games have, it would be nice and could work with wood, and another more advanced and expensive for the late game with electricity, but this gives you purified water like the ones in the bottles.
 
Alas, "letting both systems exist" is probably not an option at this point. The game started out as a basic, somewhat unique survival game and has morphed into a generic looter shooter, likely in pursuit of a larger playerbase. Probably the only "modes" possible at this point are story and survival/sandbox.

I personally take the attitude that there's no use crying over spilled milk.
 
I totally agree that freedom of choice is what this game needs and what its currently lacking. What are they even trying to do? Every time you switch one mechanic for another, you befriend one community and alienate another. Let players choose, everyone will be happy.
 
MaxTunnerX said:
I totally agree that freedom of choice is what this game needs and what its currently lacking. What are they even trying to do? Every time you switch one mechanic for another, you befriend one community and alienate another. Let players choose, everyone will be happy.
Click to expand...

Exactly! That’s the heart of it—let players choose. A sandbox thrives when there are multiple valid paths to play, not when one is replaced by another. Every time they remove a system instead of evolving or offering it as an option, they cut off a portion of the player base. If both systems could coexist—old and new—everyone wins, and the game becomes even more replayable.
 
InfiniteWarrior said:
Alas, "letting both systems exist" is probably not an option at this point. The game started out as a basic, somewhat unique survival game and has morphed into a generic looter shooter, likely in pursuit of a larger playerbase. Probably the only "modes" possible at this point are story and survival/sandbox.

I personally take the attitude that there's no use crying over spilled milk.
Click to expand...

Get where you're coming from—and honestly, if the devs had scrapped everything old completely, I’d agree with you. But I think the recent Town Hall was The Fun Pimps’ way of acknowledging that something wasn’t working, and that’s a huge first step. They’re already reverting some changes and tweaking others, and a lot of the older systems weren’t entirely lost—they still have access to previous builds and code. It’s not too late if players keep showing interest, like we saw with the badge system feedback. When the community speaks up respectfully and clearly, things do shift.
 
Kalnazzar said:
Get where you're coming from—and honestly, if the devs had scrapped everything old completely, I’d agree with you. But I think the recent Town Hall was The Fun Pimps’ way of acknowledging that something wasn’t working, and that’s a huge first step. They’re already reverting some changes and tweaking others, and a lot of the older systems weren’t entirely lost—they still have access to previous builds and code. It’s not too late if players keep showing interest, like we saw with the badge system feedback. When the community speaks up respectfully and clearly, things do shift.
Click to expand...
I've personally no interest in joining the cause of bringing back systems that aren't coming back. Realistically and feasibly, that's just not going to happen this late in development. I feel for you guys who've been with it from the beginning and honestly think you can change that reality somehow, but look at the evidence. It's a different game now and TFP is in the home stretch. Do you honestly think there is either time or budget to revert the entire game into something resembling what it once was? Do you honestly think they'll want to after spending years purposefully turning it into a generic looter shooter?

They're performing a face-lift on the 2.0 update that blew up in their face. The best you can expect is separate story and sandbox modes...and of course, for Rick to remind you to get your Mo Power t-shirt today.
 
I'm a bit surprised that there is no mention of things like Vultures turning into homing missiles at blood night for when you are inside a vehicle, or vehicles not working at blood night, I can't remember what it is today but that is one of those things that take away the sandbox experience in a very in your face way. The choice on how players deal with zombies at that night should be entirely up to the player no matter how "cheesy" it is.
 
ZehMatt said:
I'm a bit surprised that there is no mention of things like Vultures turning into homing missiles at blood night for when you are inside a vehicle, or vehicles not working at blood night, I can't remember what it is today but that is one of those things that take away the sandbox experience in a very in your face way. The choice on how players deal with zombies at that night should be entirely up to the player no matter how "cheesy" it is.
Click to expand...
They didn't want people avoiding hordes on horde night on servers that have horde night turned on. No idea why.

What makes less sense to me is turning vultures into homing missiles capable of overtaking vehicles at all other times with this latest update. Of course, they would always attack you if you weren't at full health, but they had to catch up with you if you were using a vehicle. Now, they sit atop your head until you swat them off, vehicle or no. Heavens forbid anything should make sense in this game.
 
InfiniteWarrior said:
They didn't want people avoiding hordes on horde night on servers that have horde night turned on. No idea why.

What makes less sense to me is turning vultures into homing missiles capable of overtaking vehicles at all other times with this latest update. Of course, they would always attack you if you weren't at full health, but they had to catch up with you if you were using a vehicle. Now, they sit atop your head until you swat them off, vehicle or no. Heavens forbid anything should make sense in this game.
Click to expand...

I haven't noticed vultures being faster during the week in my game. Did you see this only when on a vehicle or at all times?
 
ZehMatt said:
I'm a bit surprised that there is no mention of things like Vultures turning into homing missiles at blood night for when you are inside a vehicle, or vehicles not working at blood night, I can't remember what it is today but that is one of those things that take away the sandbox experience in a very in your face way. The choice on how players deal with zombies at that night should be entirely up to the player no matter how "cheesy" it is.
Click to expand...

I totally get where you're coming from—and I agree. There are a lot of things I didn’t mention in my original post, not because I don’t care about them, but because I’ve learned from experience that long posts tend to get overlooked. Just take a look at these two I made:

🔗 Comprehensive Gameplay & World Enhancement Suggestions for 7 Days to Die Part [1]
🔗 Comprehensive Gameplay & World Enhancement Suggestions for 7 Days to Die Part [2]

I poured a lot into those, but shorter, more focused posts tend to get better engagement. As for your point—I completely agree. Whether it's driving to avoid the horde, burning fuel to keep moving, or using a vehicle to kite zombies, that's a strategy. Just like setting up traps, stealthing past enemies, or building an AFK-style robotic defense base where clever block placement confuses pathing. These are all valid tactics in a sandbox game. Players being creative is not cheesing—it’s survival ingenuity. And the beauty of sandbox games is that you should be rewarded for creative problem-solving, not punished. Honestly, even if someone plays the same strategy 20 times, that’s fine—because it means they’re still playing the game, enjoying it, and choosing it over thousands of other games out there. That’s a win, in my opinion.

Now—there are a few caveats for me personally. I don’t support:
  • Exploiting clipping bugs (e.g., phasing into solid blocks—humans can’t do that).
  • Floating bases with no structural support—there’s just no realistic way to justify that.
  • Gold/dupe exploits for infinite money or resources.
Those break immersion and stretch beyond the logic of the world. But clever, strategic survival? That’s what the game’s all about, and we need more support for that kind of playstyle—not less.
 
7DaysToDieEnjoyer said:
I only dream of a hybrid skill system with the upcoming changes, I’ll be satisfied.
Click to expand...

Same here. A hybrid system would strike the perfect balance—magazines for unlocking, and actual gameplay to improve skill through use. It keeps both learning and mastery feeling meaningful. Fingers crossed the upcoming changes get us closer to that!
 
meganoth said:
I haven't noticed vultures being faster during the week in my game. Did you see this only when on a vehicle or at all times?
Click to expand...
Bicycle. If on foot, I just turn around and dispatch them, so I don't know if they're faster while on foot, but would assume so as feet are a vehicle, too. ^.^ And, nope, not hopping on a vehicle trying to outrun them. Just riding along with nowhere near enough health lost to even think of bothering with a bandage. (That should probably kick in at a reasonable percentage, too, but it doesn't.)
 
Kalnazzar said:
I totally get where you're coming from—and I agree. There are a lot of things I didn’t mention in my original post, not because I don’t care about them, but because I’ve learned from experience that long posts tend to get overlooked. Just take a look at these two I made:

🔗 Comprehensive Gameplay & World Enhancement Suggestions for 7 Days to Die Part [1]
🔗 Comprehensive Gameplay & World Enhancement Suggestions for 7 Days to Die Part [2]

I poured a lot into those, but shorter, more focused posts tend to get better engagement. As for your point—I completely agree. Whether it's driving to avoid the horde, burning fuel to keep moving, or using a vehicle to kite zombies, that's a strategy. Just like setting up traps, stealthing past enemies, or building an AFK-style robotic defense base where clever block placement confuses pathing. These are all valid tactics in a sandbox game. Players being creative is not cheesing—it’s survival ingenuity. And the beauty of sandbox games is that you should be rewarded for creative problem-solving, not punished. Honestly, even if someone plays the same strategy 20 times, that’s fine—because it means they’re still playing the game, enjoying it, and choosing it over thousands of other games out there. That’s a win, in my opinion.

Now—there are a few caveats for me personally. I don’t support:
  • Exploiting clipping bugs (e.g., phasing into solid blocks—humans can’t do that).
  • Floating bases with no structural support—there’s just no realistic way to justify that.
  • Gold/dupe exploits for infinite money or resources.
Those break immersion and stretch beyond the logic of the world. But clever, strategic survival? That’s what the game’s all about, and we need more support for that kind of playstyle—not less.
Click to expand...
Makes sense, as for true exploits I also absolutely agree, I don't think anyone is actually upset about such exploits being removed, well maybe some but they don't count as normal humans.
 
Speaking of exploits, I laughed out loud when I heard TFP say on the recent stream that zombies that didnt dig were an exploit (or "abusing" that they didnt dig). Like seriously? Have you ever seen a zombie dig literally anywhere in pop culture? just the thought of a zombie smelling you half a kilometre away, tracking you down and working night shifts digging straight down with its bare hands through dirt and rock is absolutely absurd. And they call this "working as intended". I mean, as long as the players can choose I dont care, but this is ridiculous.
 
MaxTunnerX said:
Have you ever seen a zombie dig literally anywhere in pop culture?
Click to expand...

An interesting question. I'm not sure what it proves, but...

I recall zombies in The Sims digging in gardens and destroying player plants.
There appears to be a "Digger Zombie" in Plants vs Zombies. (I've not played that. The picture has a zombie with a pick.)
In "Return of the Living Dead" (and other movies and TV shows) zombies dig themselves out of graves.
There are mods in Minecraft to give zombies the ability to dig.
In cultures where a zombie is "controlled" (like voodoo), zombies can be made to dig.

A very hard question to answer that to me seems to be the most relevant, "would any of the pop culture zombies have dug to reach a detected survivor?"
 
MaxTunnerX said:
Speaking of exploits, I laughed out loud when I heard TFP say on the recent stream that zombies that didnt dig were an exploit (or "abusing" that they didnt dig). Like seriously? Have you ever seen a zombie dig literally anywhere in pop culture? just the thought of a zombie smelling you half a kilometre away, tracking you down and working night shifts digging straight down with its bare hands through dirt and rock is absolutely absurd. And they call this "working as intended". I mean, as long as the players can choose I dont care, but this is ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Would you call it an exploit/abuse or problem if they were unable to attack and damage concrete blocks before them? Horde nights would be drop-dead boring if that were the case.

But if you look at pop culture? Ever see zombies go through concrete? Nope. Pop culture has no say about what is exploity in this game. Though I would not say it is an exploit as it is a balance problem.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top