BFT2020
Hunter
You never ran outside during the storm to do something? I did it multiple times to loot or harvest some things outside the POI while I was waiting for it to complete.
PC V2.0 Storms Brewing Dev Diary
- Thread starter Crater Creator
- Start date
You never ran outside during the storm to do something? I did it multiple times to loot or harvest some things outside the POI while I was waiting for it to complete.
Riamus
Hunter
Not for very long. Health drops too quickly. And I don't particularly want to spend baggages or med kits in order to do something outside during a storm.
But my main thought was that, by design, you are intended to avoid the storm and that means you don't enjoy the effects.
Also, consider what the few comments from devs, and the comments from the mods here are regarding it. They don't say go out and do something and enjoy the storm we made look interesting. Instead, it is go inside and clear a POI or go underground and mine. They are telling you to avoid the storm, which is a missed opportunity to make an interesting storm working you actually see. Yes, you can go out and take the damage, but their view is to stay inside.
Roland
Community Moderator
If they make the storms debuff us in any other way we will still get complaints and still get plenty of people staying inside AFK. Many of the complaints also include something to the effect of, "The storm is just a way to slow us down and stop us from progressing too quickly".
This tells me that at least these people are primarily complaining about storms because it interferes with their efficiency runs. These people would not look kindly on ANY debuff and would stay inside or in a hole waiting for the storm to finish because playing at less than peak performance would bother them too much. I've read posts where they talk about "being forced" to go AFK for hours when they have a broken leg or a broken arm because they would rather let the timer run out while they do something else rather than play the actual game in a diminished capacity.
My point is that changing the storms to giving some sort of debuff isn't going to please everyone and least of all the loudest complainers of the current penalty. TFP should keep the physical damage but add in wearable mods, consumable items, or whatever to allow us to diminish the damage to a level where we can be outside for the entire storm and perhaps lose at most half of our health. Before we have those things it's good that the storms kill us pretty rapidly. But after we acquire/craft/buy those things then we survive outside even though we still take some damage.
That would be more fun to me than getting more hungry, or my stamina depleted, or slowed down. I like the storms fine as they are. I've never once had to go AFK. I've always had something I could do while they rage. It's not always the thing I was PLANNING to do but there is lots to do while you wait and that is by far more engaging to me than simply digging a hole and going AFK. I would rather die pushing for the border or a POI on my last medkit while trying to wrangle my bike than just jump in a hole and play Clash of Clans for 5 minutes. Others are different, sure.
lol...they even reduced the particles when inside with this latest patch so you see even less of it.
This tells me that at least these people are primarily complaining about storms because it interferes with their efficiency runs. These people would not look kindly on ANY debuff and would stay inside or in a hole waiting for the storm to finish because playing at less than peak performance would bother them too much. I've read posts where they talk about "being forced" to go AFK for hours when they have a broken leg or a broken arm because they would rather let the timer run out while they do something else rather than play the actual game in a diminished capacity.
My point is that changing the storms to giving some sort of debuff isn't going to please everyone and least of all the loudest complainers of the current penalty. TFP should keep the physical damage but add in wearable mods, consumable items, or whatever to allow us to diminish the damage to a level where we can be outside for the entire storm and perhaps lose at most half of our health. Before we have those things it's good that the storms kill us pretty rapidly. But after we acquire/craft/buy those things then we survive outside even though we still take some damage.
That would be more fun to me than getting more hungry, or my stamina depleted, or slowed down. I like the storms fine as they are. I've never once had to go AFK. I've always had something I could do while they rage. It's not always the thing I was PLANNING to do but there is lots to do while you wait and that is by far more engaging to me than simply digging a hole and going AFK. I would rather die pushing for the border or a POI on my last medkit while trying to wrangle my bike than just jump in a hole and play Clash of Clans for 5 minutes. Others are different, sure.
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lol...they even reduced the particles when inside with this latest patch so you see even less of it.
Riamus
Hunter
I think that's up for debate.
I don't appreciate being "slowed down" by storms. Not because I play efficiently, but because I want to play the game and sitting there doing nothing isn't playing the game, or I have something I wanted to do, such as getting a badge and instead have to wait. Certainly some people are as you describe, but I have a feeling many who don't like this are like me. And if storms didn't cost me a lot of health to be out in them, I'd do so. I didn't say I had to go AFK because of storms... I was saying that you hide from storms (whether that's in a mine or in a POI) instead of enjoying them. Why make them look interesting if most players will hide somewhere (again, that doesn't mean AFK) instead of enjoying the view?
There are obviously exceptions, of course. If the debuff as severe as being killed by damage, then it's not any better. But there could be any number of other options that wouldn't keep me locked inside. Regarding broken legs, there is a good reason for going AFK for a lot of people. It's less about it not being efficient to play when you have a broken leg and more because almost anything you do will increase that timer and it'll just never end. Sure, you can be very careful and it'll go away, but it's very hard to do that if you want to clear a POI, or something. It's easier to let it end as soon as possible than to keep increasing the timer and making it last for hours instead of 20 minutes. For me, I'll still finish whatever I'm doing if I happen to break a leg, but afterwards, I'll go unload just because to use up the timer. I don't normally go AFK, though I have done that in the past if I was far from my base and didn't want to go back to it.
In any case, I never said a change would please everyone. No change will please everyone, so I'd never suggest such a thing. My comment was about the storms basically being missed by a lot of players (most, perhaps, though I have no idea) because devs and mods and other players and the game itself with "seek shelter NOW" are all suggesting going inside or underground to avoid the storm entirely. I feel it's a missed opportunity for showing of the storms to people. As was pointed out by someone above, you could stand on a porch, assuming the game didn't decide to damage you there, and watch. Or you could run out and do something quickly and run back in (I went out to unload into my motorcycle). But you're basically stuck in one location unless you have other POI close enough to get to before dying. And in most cases, if you're stuck somewhere, you aren't watching the storm.
I'd rather have a storm that makes visibility very low and then have zombie spawns increased and have them coming to attack out of that, where I can't see them until they are really close. I'm not talking about horde numbers, but something you can reasonably fight on foot while still being a challenge. I'd be out in that storm all the time with something like that. And that's just one option.
LittleNightma
Scavenger
Storms makes sense, however they can be very frustrating to deal with. Looting POIs would be an end-all-be-all solution if it wasn't for the fact that not everyone will be around a POI, and if they are there is no gaurentee that they will be able to loot it. If it's high tier and the player is underpowered they will either die by the zombies or die by the storm. It's a no win situation.
Don't get me wrong, I like storms. I keep them enabled on my worlds, but I can absolutely understand when people say they would rather play with them off.
Don't get me wrong, I like storms. I keep them enabled on my worlds, but I can absolutely understand when people say they would rather play with them off.
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Did you know zombies weren't even added to the game until the day of launch and it originally was supposed to be just a farming simulator. Just pulling your legIIRC storms were only added in basically last minute during feature creep period. So it felt a little strange, like if they were making 3.0 the bandit update, and towards the end of the development cycle they brainstormed the idea of adding bandits.
Dark Sun
Scavenger
Mmhmm. I personally have them turned off for the same reasons I disable the fog event in Project Zomboid. I personally don't find any scenario that tells you to take a time out in the corner for a while to be a very riveting experience. Maybe I'm just fussy and I'm a girl with a plan, and I don't like it being interrupted. It's one reason I don't like screamers.
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Did you know zombies weren't even added to the game until the day of launch and it originally was supposed to be just a farming simulator. Just pulling your leg
What are you talking about? 7D2D is obviously a post apocalyptic Fedex / errand monkey simulator.
(again like you, just fooling around / teasing hehe)
4sheetzngeegles
Hunter
"Girl Interrupted", 7DTD2 coming soon to a theatre near you.
That's what you made me think of.
Dark Sun
Scavenger
Starring "Some Girl Building", and exclusive bonus behind the scenes footage coming to DVD 15 years ago.
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4sheetzngeegles
Hunter
There is one other option, but I doubt if most would do it because it is still slow, and lasts the duration of the
storm. Break the weakest point, usually a door, creep just inside, place a wooden door, and place wooden blocks
over openings like windows or broken blocks, that are near. If you are lucky enough for the poi to have an overhanging
don't go in, just build walls on the porch. But it will still be a waiting game.
beerfly
Colony Rounder
Sometimes I put some tripwire and electric fence posts around 4x4 cube, in which is the ladder leading down the shaft of the mine (if i find a good one with lead, nitrate and iron as the latest one for example) and connect the trip wire to some light bulbs down under, to indicate some activity up there.
Helps when playing alone or buddies on the server are away.
So far for storms, we were safe, but because we do some structures with doors I guess.
Grandpa Minion
Scavenger
Hello, I would like to propose a suggestion regarding the Physician 5 perk and its capability to cause instant death with a baton.
A) Ever since this feature was introduced, it has become challenging for modders to create anti-cheat measures concerning damage values.
B) It has never made sense to alot of people why this perk was included within the Physician skill tree.
C) There should be a limit on the damage inflicted by the death strike, as it currently deals significantly more damage than the admin gun.
I would like to suggest that, at the very least, it be modified to restore a player's health to full with a 10% chance of doing so instead of its current baton perk and would fit better in the hp physician tree line.
This adjustment would align better with the skill tree and address the damage detection issues it creates for anticheat.
A) Ever since this feature was introduced, it has become challenging for modders to create anti-cheat measures concerning damage values.
B) It has never made sense to alot of people why this perk was included within the Physician skill tree.
C) There should be a limit on the damage inflicted by the death strike, as it currently deals significantly more damage than the admin gun.
I would like to suggest that, at the very least, it be modified to restore a player's health to full with a 10% chance of doing so instead of its current baton perk and would fit better in the hp physician tree line.
This adjustment would align better with the skill tree and address the damage detection issues it creates for anticheat.
Old Crow
Hunter
Agreed, the storms just aren't engaging. The biome hazards and challenges associated with them aren't, either. Not currently. They could be a lot better, but currently they're really sloppy.I think that's up for debate.
I don't appreciate being "slowed down" by storms. Not because I play efficiently, but because I want to play the game and sitting there doing nothing isn't playing the game, or I have something I wanted to do, such as getting a badge and instead have to wait. Certainly some people are as you describe, but I have a feeling many who don't like this are like me. And if storms didn't cost me a lot of health to be out in them, I'd do so. I didn't say I had to go AFK because of storms... I was saying that you hide from storms (whether that's in a mine or in a POI) instead of enjoying them. Why make them look interesting if most players will hide somewhere (again, that doesn't mean AFK) instead of enjoying the view?
There are obviously exceptions, of course. If the debuff as severe as being killed by damage, then it's not any better. But there could be any number of other options that wouldn't keep me locked inside. Regarding broken legs, there is a good reason for going AFK for a lot of people. It's less about it not being efficient to play when you have a broken leg and more because almost anything you do will increase that timer and it'll just never end. Sure, you can be very careful and it'll go away, but it's very hard to do that if you want to clear a POI, or something. It's easier to let it end as soon as possible than to keep increasing the timer and making it last for hours instead of 20 minutes. For me, I'll still finish whatever I'm doing if I happen to break a leg, but afterwards, I'll go unload just because to use up the timer. I don't normally go AFK, though I have done that in the past if I was far from my base and didn't want to go back to it.
In any case, I never said a change would please everyone. No change will please everyone, so I'd never suggest such a thing. My comment was about the storms basically being missed by a lot of players (most, perhaps, though I have no idea) because devs and mods and other players and the game itself with "seek shelter NOW" are all suggesting going inside or underground to avoid the storm entirely. I feel it's a missed opportunity for showing of the storms to people. As was pointed out by someone above, you could stand on a porch, assuming the game didn't decide to damage you there, and watch. Or you could run out and do something quickly and run back in (I went out to unload into my motorcycle). But you're basically stuck in one location unless you have other POI close enough to get to before dying. And in most cases, if you're stuck somewhere, you aren't watching the storm.
I'd rather have a storm that makes visibility very low and then have zombie spawns increased and have them coming to attack out of that, where I can't see them until they are really close. I'm not talking about horde numbers, but something you can reasonably fight on foot while still being a challenge. I'd be out in that storm all the time with something like that. And that's just one option.
Sadly I don't see things changing much if at all for either - the devs seem to enjoy things aren't engaging.
Lockpicking? Not engaging as it is.
Magazine system? Not engaging. I can't say everyone hates it, but many folks don't.
I understand everyone has different ideas of fun, but holy crap. These aren't fun.
EvilPolygons
Survivor
Riamus
Hunter
Very carefully.
Please don't suggest an annoying lockpick minigame. That might be somewhat okay in a game where you're not picking locks very often, but in a game like this, where you pick locks in almost every POI, and sometimes many locks in a single POI, it just wouldn't be any fun at all. If it's optional, that would be fine, but I doubt they'd do that if they did add it. So we'd be stuck with either never doing lockpicking and just breaking everything open or else modding it.
Blake_
Captain Obvious
I like storms, the give out a nice cozy feeling and add some flavour to gameplay, alone or in multiplayer.
But! The problem is as you say and more: they limit efficiency , which is a perfectly valid form of gameplay, also , they limit "shooters" because they have nothing to shoot if they get stuck in
a) inside a surface player-made base with nothing to mine
b)inside an already looted POI with nothing to scavenge,
c) in a terrain feature,
d)in whatever the heck they are that they don't want to and do not find it fun because it already happened 467584747 times.
Also, they limit "looters" if they want to loot at their leisure, and they limit farmers for obvious reasons, and bartering players in their money runs, and "thrill-seeking mustards" that seek thrill...or mustard. Also, they limit my murderous grandma with her happy-trigger instinct because she is a bit more idle than usual. They also limit my cat, who is a builder, and builders shall not build on storm days mind you. Also, they limit poopers, because they can't go to the outhouse to make do because of the friggin' blazing embers, or because they get their arses frozen or radiated or whatever.
..... And an endless list of roleplaying roles that have an easy fix: make storms trivial in late game with some equipment/perk/item or whatever and give the player the chance to eliminate the chore of all those limitations in order to enjoy the eventual story, the world, the landscape, the sheer horror of survival or the diverse roleplays, plus bandits, other npcs, fluff, lore, etc. Storms feel very early in development. Storm's brewing seems fitting: it's still cooking.
Dark Sun
Scavenger
Very carefully.
Please don't suggest an annoying lockpick minigame. That might be somewhat okay in a game where you're not picking locks very often, but in a game like this, where you pick locks in almost every POI, and sometimes many locks in a single POI, it just wouldn't be any fun at all. If it's optional, that would be fine, but I doubt they'd do that if they did add it. So we'd be stuck with either never doing lockpicking and just breaking everything open or else modding it.
Not disagreeing with you, but there has to be a more interesting solution than just pressing E and waiting for a timer to tick down (and maybe break 20 lockpicks in the process). At the very least, the final 3-4 seconds of the process needs to be improved. There's nothing more frustrating than wasting half your lockpicks because they break instantly or near-instantly. (Yes, I know Jailbreakers and other buffs exist, but I digress.)
It would be nice if the Lockpicking perk made it feel like it was achieving results. Rank 1 could be to break into small safes faster, rank 2 for gun safes, police cars, and T3 chests, and rank 3 for T4 and T5 locked crates.
Riamus
Hunter
Oh, I don't disagree with you about that. I just don't want a minigame, and that's usually what people suggest if they are suggesting anything about lockpicking.
If it just always started from where it left off and didn't keep redoing the last few seconds if it fails, it wouldn't be so bad. The way it is now, you are right that you can lose 20+ lockpicks on a single lock, which is pretty bad.
And yeah, the lockpicking perk always feels pointless to me. It often feels like you break more lockpicks if you perk into it. Of course, I haven't put points in it in a really long time and maybe it's better, though probably not. I even saw someone recently comment on lockpicks seeming to break more often when perked into lockpicking, so it's likely the same as the last time I tried it.
So, yeah... it could definitely use improvements both for the lockpicking itself and for the perk.
Dark Sun
Scavenger
That's perfectly fair. Honestly, the main reason I don't use lockpicks is, a) other methods exist (including smashing into the containers with brute force), and b) the final 3-4 seconds account for ~95% of the breaks. It's frustrating to deal with, so they're an afterthought to me. If I see lockpicks, I either store them to sell, or I scrap them on the spot since they're taking up valuable inventory room during a raid. If this final stretch was improved, maybe, just maybe...
I've heard that as well. I've experimented a couple of times with the perk, and personally speaking, occasionally I saw some improvement (getting into my third police car in a row without a single break), and then right after, I'd waste 26 lockpicks on a gun safe. If it does provide benefit, but it's inconsistent, then that's still a problem.
Also, the trouble with jailbreakers is they're like eye kandy - you're not going to use it only on a single safe or police car, it's pretty much a waste.
Blake_
Captain Obvious
That is my general feeling too. The timer is bad, a minigame sux a bit... then the other option is to add an animation of "lockpicking" and allow the player to open it with 100% success "expending" lockpicks, so a tiny safe would use 1 and a big one 2-5 and a huge one 10 or more AND make it so the act of lockpicking can make noise and attract threats like the police car. That would be a nice way to die. Stuck in a basement while a radiated cop chomps on your toenails.