PC Why are Tier 6 items "drop only" and not crafted??
- Thread starter Palad1n
- Start date
watzlp
New member
Honestly, I always felt t6 items should be craftable but at lv10 intellect as a PERK allowing you to craft any of your other lv5 items up 1 teir, you already get punished for crafting non iron tools by having to find and scrap steel parts off rng based tools as is. On top of that since now each tool has its own rng stats on it.. you can make a lv6 tool that would have worse in every way other than durability than a lv5 tool. So why not?
Last edited by a moderator:
Palad1n
New member
How are T6 items "special or unique" when they drop fairly frequently once you cross the lvl 40+ range?
The only way to make them truly unique and special is to make them very rare, and add in another function into generating maps that lets you fine tune the drop rate % for each tier.
Sure, you could lower the general loot drop rate from 100% down to 25% which would effect everything, but you shouldn't have to do this. From experience so far, Tier 6 items simply get added to the leveled loot lists and standard drops once you cross a certain threshold, which is again, very lazy design.
TFP could and should have set each tier as progressively more rare as you increased in level, which would give players incentive to actually craft instead of the same ole we have been given year after year after year. They talk about some sort of leveled loot balance, but I have yet to see any actual balance based on what I have seen so far in a19 on a vanilla server with loot set at the default 100%.
I have found and sold many T6 guns (AK;s, Assault rifles, zap sticks, ratchets, etc) as though they are common loot, and shouldn't be.
There are still perks that govern what level items you can craft, even if they do other things as well; do I really have to spell out the minutia of it to you?
I'm obviously not going to put points into sledgehammers since I only ever used them to smash things open and, while I can craft a 5 shotgun I can't craft a 2 sledgehammer.
I hated this mechanic in Fallout and Oblivion and I would hate it here. If it ever comes in an update, I will not play until I get it modded out.
RipClaw
Well-known member
Q6 offers one modslot more. This can be used for example for more protection or to be quieter.
For example my Q5 steel boots. Currently they contain a Triple Pocket Mod for more inventory space, a Banded Armor Plating Mod for more protection and a Customized Fittings Mod for more mobility. In the additional modslot I could add an Impact Bracing Mod for reduced fall damage or Advanced Muffled Connectors to reduce the noise of the armor
I admit that these are just bonuses and that the armor also works with Q5 just fine but it gives you a bit more.
Where Q6 has a big impact are tools and weapons as each mod increases the damage. If I mine ore with a Q5 steel pickaxe and after 2 shots there is only a little HP left, but with the Q6 steel pickaxe 2 shots per block of ore is enough, it saves a lot of time. A Q6 Auger is also slightly faster than a Q5 Auger. It can also hold a mod for a larger tank so I don't have to interrupt so often.
PoloPoPo
New member
On the assumption that this happens, the discussion would be shifted from "Why are Tier 6 items "drop only" and not crafted??" to "Why are legendary items "drop only" and not crafted??".
If you cannot craft a certain item you rely on a bit of luck to find it in a random loot container, making that item more special. I have never found a quality 6 auger in A18 for example. Should this happen one day in A19 it will give me a few seconds of excitement for sure. Also it adds to the incentive to leave your base and continue looting even in the late game where not much goals are left. Replacing every tool / weapon / clothing with a quality 6 one could be a remaining long term goal for some players, just like some players try to read every book / schematic until they end their savegame. If you could simply craft all of that by yourself that option dropped out.
Q5 or Q6 does not affect a player too much anyway but I, personally, like the idea of "more unique" items, no matter whether they are called Q5 / T6 or legendary
Marinxar
New member
Don't have enough information to say that yet. It all depends on how TFP plan on deploying the Legenadry weapons. If it will be in the common loot table, then yeah, but if they are only found on specific boss types, that's a different story. We will have to wait and see. No point in debating the unknown.On the assumption that this happens, the discussion would be shifted from "Why are Tier 6 items "drop only" and not crafted??" to "Why are legendary items "drop only" and not crafted??".
If you cannot craft a certain item you rely on a bit of luck to find it in a random loot container, making that item more special. I have never found a quality 6 auger in A18 for example. Should this happen one day in A19 it will give me a few seconds of excitement for sure. Also it adds to the incentive to leave your base and continue looting even in the late game where not much goals are left. Replacing every tool / weapon / clothing with a quality 6 one could be a remaining long term goal for some players, just like some players try to read every book / schematic until they end their savegame. If you could simply craft all of that by yourself that option dropped out.
Q5 or Q6 does not affect a player too much anyway but I, personally, like the idea of "more unique" items, no matter whether they are called Q5 / T6 or legendary
RipClaw
Well-known member
I doubt it. For a very long time, you could make Q6 items. That's why players complain about it. Something was removed that had been there for a long time.
When new items are implemented, it's a different situation. Nothing is taken away, something is added.
That same argument can go both ways. If after 2 shots the HP left are not minimal the damage increase of your Q6 steel pickaxe just fizzles out. No difference whatsover.
Since variable damage values have a bigger influence on damage than the additional slot it also follows that the best of the 4 Q5 pickaxes you built or found has a higher chance of two-shotting blocks than the one Q6 pickaxe you got.
Boidster
New member
We are on the same side, you and I, though your position is more extreme. You take the vanguard; perhaps we can negotiate with them and get to "Tier 6 can only be crafted". Plenty of loot for looters that way, plenty of incentive for crafters that way. It's what the kids call "win-win".
Kalen
New member
I have to say, my opinion on this is changing. I was a firm believer in having the ability to craft tier 6 items.... but I've played a couple of games since. One was unmodded, the other was modded to be able to craft tier 6. I feel like the unmodded game was more fun. What would make it better, IMO, is if tier 6 items were far more rare that way it would feel even more rewarding when I find one.
I'm going to keep playing both games, but so far thats my take.
I'm going to keep playing both games, but so far thats my take.
BeatKitano
New member
I love the game. But no random stats on loot is stupid, it was stupid to have higher quality items have worse stats than lower ones but it was nothing a good loot table could fix, and it gave an incentive to go loot no matter what.
They could have kept the old system (a16) and gone the tiered items route all the same. Even create a "legendary" tier to spice things further.
Loot is A HUGE component of the game, it's what keeps most players active... yet they butchered it over the last 3 alphas, I don't get it. It's sad, it's such a simple thing to fix, an easy way to get player engaged (old and new) and yet...
Don't get me wrong I love the new progression on loot, but random stats is what keeps people playing a game for years (see diablo 2 !)
They could have kept the old system (a16) and gone the tiered items route all the same. Even create a "legendary" tier to spice things further.
Loot is A HUGE component of the game, it's what keeps most players active... yet they butchered it over the last 3 alphas, I don't get it. It's sad, it's such a simple thing to fix, an easy way to get player engaged (old and new) and yet...
Don't get me wrong I love the new progression on loot, but random stats is what keeps people playing a game for years (see diablo 2 !)
Last edited by a moderator:
JCrook1028
New member
BeatKitano
New member
Then someone messed up.
Let me explain: you get acquainted with the game, the loot progressions forces you to look at 6 quality level of stone age tools before getting tier 2 items, for these 3-5 first hours the game subconsciously teaches you: at the same quality level, stats are the same.
I'll tell you this: I scraped ton of tier 2 tools and more without even looking. Whose fault is that ? Mine ? Put that in a loading screen maybe ? Or just make it consistent ?
Last edited by a moderator:
JaxTeller718
New member
I like your idea of finding special items to make the gear, we had that but people cried over that too. We used to need to find a schematic used in the recipe itself.
The problem is they are trying to please everyone but by doing so please only a few. I can see why tier 6 is find only. Once you get a tier 6 you never have a reason to find another. Thats flawed game design,
They need actual tool and weapon degradation. Its so boring to loot and craft because once you do it you never need to do it again, just keep repairing your 6's infinitely.
If they solved the issue of degrading items then crafting them would be viable because you would only use it for so long before needing to make another 6.
BeatKitano
New member
ARPG (masters of loot games) don't have any degradation, they just keep on offering incredibly varied items with effects and stats, you don't keep your items forever because they don't break: you replace them for better ones.
The current loot system doesn't scale with the player (well it kind of does now and I guess that's TFP trying to fix the issue slowly). That's the issue. Maybe they can somehow "tackle" that with special zombies requiring special weapons (rad remover kind ?) or the bandits having resistance to weapon x or y.
But tool/weapon degradation is bad. It was bad in A16 and I'm glad they removed it.
The current loot system doesn't scale with the player (well it kind of does now and I guess that's TFP trying to fix the issue slowly). That's the issue. Maybe they can somehow "tackle" that with special zombies requiring special weapons (rad remover kind ?) or the bandits having resistance to weapon x or y.
But tool/weapon degradation is bad. It was bad in A16 and I'm glad they removed it.
Last edited by a moderator: