PC You cant balance Sp and Mp in the same game

Bear in mind, there already is a difference in MP and SP with levelling - the XP points are much less per person in a party, so 2 or 3 people will get their next level slower if they're killing at the same rate 1 person would kill at in SP.

 
I hope you know the backstory of that picture?If you don't: Romeo, the wolf who loved too much
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What a beautiful story.

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Bear in mind, there already is a difference in MP and SP with levelling - the XP points are much less per person in a party, so 2 or 3 people will get their next level slower if they're killing at the same rate 1 person would kill at in SP.
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Is this confirmed?

There are also more (and tougher) zombies with more players.

 
Is this confirmed?There are also more (and tougher) zombies with more players.
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Yeah have you not tried it? Instead of 550 xp for a normal zombie kill, you'd get much less for that kill, spread out between all the players (when they're in a party together). Not sure what the actual ratio is, but it's definitely less.

 
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Yeah have you not tried it? Instead of 550 xp for a normal zombie kill, you'd get much less for that kill, spread out between all the players (when they're in a party together). Not sure what the actual ratio is, but it's definitely less.
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Thats pretty unfortunate to be honest, multiplayer having inherently slower progression XP wise makes playing in a group not very appealing. (If they want us to specialize so much then it actualy makes *more* sense if only 1 or 2 people fight most of the zombies while others build ect)

 
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Thats pretty unfortunate to be honest, multiplayer having inherently slower progression XP wise makes playing in a group not very appealing.
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Disagree.

Not only does it make sense, more people, less xp, it makes the fun experience last a little longer.

MP games can be a ton of fun and building up when you're laughing with your friends makes the game go by quickly.

I like this idea! I think it's great.

Well.... unless [cough] ..... you don't have any friends.

 
Disagree.
Not only does it make sense, more people, less xp, it makes the fun experience last a little longer.

MP games can be a ton of fun and building up when you're laughing with your friends makes the game go by quickly.

I like this idea! I think it's great.

Well.... unless [cough] ..... you don't have any friends.
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Tomato, tomato.

Makes the fun last a little longer, added grind.

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So let me put forth a scenario, i play with 1 buddy who really likes looting and fighting zombies, he does loot runs while i build up a solid base.

In this scenario making both players level slower simply because they are playing together is... ehh? So should he leave the party before going out so he can actually level up?

 
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What if you don’t agree with the premise that you can’t balance for SP and MP PVE. The history of Kage’s posts on A17 strongly suggests he finds it too grindy and/or too hard for SP. Personally I don’t agree that it is too grindy or too hard. More importantly I don’t think what Kage is displeased about has a whole lot to do with balancing MP PVE and SP. Is MVP PVE easier? Sure. But I think this is best handled by adjusting the difficulty level, not by changing skill points for SP.
Now if this thread was about the impossibility of balancing for SP, MP PVE, and PVP, I would agree 100%. More often than not balancing for PVP mucks up SP/PVE and balancing for SP/PVE mucks up PVP.
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So you decided to answer this post based on your opinion of Kage's previous post history? That's even worse than answering in a sarcastic manner.

I'm sure that people here have played Ark and are familiar with the UI and settings available in that game. That is what I want in 7D2D; sliders and buttons so that anyone, server owners or single player peeps, are able to adjust the difficulty, harvest, experience gain etc, settings to suit their game style.

And yes, I am aware that the game is in alpha, that is why I am making this suggestion.

 
Originally posted by Scyris: "I agree, I don't know what they did but v231 seems like a huge step backwards, they nerfed block damage when I feel it finally was done well, stam regen also seems slower somewhat, clothes seem to have 1 mod slot now but I can't seem to find anything that goes in them yet, I figured something like cooling mesh would go into it... nope. Water use seems to be at double or triple the rate b221 is, and I never had the perk for slower food/water degreadation.

 


I am also have an issue with 100% gpu use on a gtx 1070, never seen that happen before in any version of 7 days to die so far till b231, and I can't figure out why as I don't notice anything looking much better.

 


The game needs a +stamina per second perk like a16 had."

I started a new game last night and am feeling exactly the same, thought it must be me lol.

 
I have stated several times on the forums here that I would like to see different progressions for SP vs MP. I am not a PvP player but perfer the cooperative version of MP, so in my opinion long term specialization is fine there. For SP, a character needs to be able to master many different areas to really be able to end game.

 
Yeah have you not tried it? Instead of 550 xp for a normal zombie kill, you'd get much less for that kill, spread out between all the players (when they're in a party together). Not sure what the actual ratio is, but it's definitely less.
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That's true and untrue at the same time. Instead of a SP player getting 550 for a zombie kill in MP 3 players each get 440 (it drops 10% per additional player iirc)...... So that same zombie gives 1320 xp instead of the base 550. That is what makes MP so easy. Nearly triple the xp to be shared among the specializations of the team. Perhaps the answer to balance is to force the 3 player to split the 550 xp? That gets rid of the accidental "kill steal" xp issue and also ensures all team members get rewarded for their efforts in a group activity.

 
Well...
... I reject your interpretation of someone else's interpretation of someone else's thoughts expressed as words reflecting their perceived experience of an event and/or idea and substitute it with my own.

CLEARLY the post was about how Pizza is INDEED the best food on the planet.

At this point I'm not sure how you could have possibly missed something so obvious.

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I'm sorry my friend. I didn't mean to offend.

 
Bear in mind, there already is a difference in MP and SP with levelling - the XP points are much less per person in a party, so 2 or 3 people will get their next level slower if they're killing at the same rate 1 person would kill at in SP.
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Its only 10% less, but you have 3 people killing things, its actually much faster than solo for leveling.

 
As someone that has played 90% SP I see zero issue with the new system. It makes SP even easier. Before it was honestly WAY harder. I've been playing since A6 and have put in at least 10 hours on every build since then. The current system is the best SP balance I have seen thus far. The reason I don't play MP is due to the majority of the servers I have played on, kill on sight was the norm and that just annoys the piss out of me.

 
Didnt read all the posts here, but as a mainly solo player on MP PVP servers for the majority of my playtime (6000+ hours) I have a creeping feeling that my favorite playstyle is forever lost lol. I would have to be a serious masochist to attempt such feats ever again, going solo against teams used to be my favorite vice in this game. Enjoying messing around with SP games for experimental this time but I think my glory days on 7d's are fading to black now.

Seems that PVP is basically screwed now anyway. Not that I am complaining. I know its not their focus at all and that I am not the majority by far.

I do feel that SP alone is fine tho. You still arent forced to specialize. There is no need for alot of the perks, some are fluff and/or just not needed and can be supplemented through playstyle.

 
I hope you know the backstory of that picture?If you don't: Romeo, the wolf who loved too much
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Yes. yes I do. I keep that picture on my computer. I thought of putting it as my screen saver. Just too sad...

The left side of the picture is accurate for a SP: Smart, fun, but has to get serious when in the wild.

The right side, MP: Friendly, easy-going, fights well if pushed in a corner.

 
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I wouldn't mind specialization in combat style. I'd love to pick between several comparable playstyles to boost my preferred one with benefits.
melee builds getting faster swings and damage resistance, further specialization into a type of melee weapon

ranged builds getting more accuracy and reload, further specialization into types of ranged weapon

just like the current perception and strength tree now...at least the combat portions.

Heck you could even make an explosives expert, with bigger blast radius and reduced crafting materials for explosives, and eventually explosion resistance (hitting yourself is inevitable).

The problem is that everyone runs, everyone carries stuff, everyone loots, everyone buys from the trader, everyone (HAS TO) craft (certain) stuff. And those are tied into the specializations.

Having to deal with the encumbrance penalties because i chose to play a ranged character is incredibly frustrating. I don't mind spending the points to reduce encumbrance, but now I have to invest a LOT of points to do it. Oh, to add to the ranged conundrum, I also end up with sub-par resource harvesting, so gunpowder will be super tight.

If i go melee, I miss out on the ranged benefits...thats fine with me, thats the choice i made, but my looting also suffers. Additionally, assuming SP playthroughs are likely to be melee (strength, endurance, intelligence) or ranged (perception, agility, intelligence), the melee build will suffer from reduced stamina, and if they do put points into agility, the combat benefits of it are significantly worse for melee than ranged (sneak bonuses).

picking a combat style for SP is fine, locking players out of core gameplay elements is much much less fine. It's looking like MP players will get to specialize, but SP will be...not FORCED, but strongly strongly encouraged to avoid the top levels of most attributes, which means those nifty top level perks will be locked to those players until absolute extreme levels.

I'm a big fan of level 100+ characters not being godlike at everything anymore, but not being godlike at the core gameplay elements (looting, crafting, carrying, running & jumping, self-heal-over-time, resource gathering) just feels frustrating. I'm hoping the attribute system gets refined later to perhaps disassociate THAT kind of perk from the attribute and be able to be boosted independently.
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I agree wholeheartedly with the points being brought up here - however, for me, it's more an issue that the gating is occuring too early in the core gameplay elements rather than it occuring at all. I don't need to be godlike in all core elements - however, I expect to be able to achieve reasonable competence in the core elements of looting, crafting, carrying, fighting, trading, running, and harvesting by the early 20's. If *after* that point, significant gating kicks in to where I have to pick and choose a subset of which of those activities I become godlike in, I wouldn't particularly mind. At present, it looks like I wouldn't achieve that reasonable well-rounded core competence until the late 30's, at which point I'd be quite behind the curve in any sort of specialization. I'm finding that very frustrating in this build, and significantly less fun than the level gating in the previous alpha.

 
if you don't like how things are for singleplayer you can always edit the .xml files or just us the debug menu to give yourself exp to get points with. Or just spawn in a motorcycle to use. The base settings are not the end all be all of everything.
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This is a good point. But im not about modding the game. I want to being this kinda stuff up to TFP so they can balance it and make a better game, for sp and mp alike. If you disagree with my points that's cool, but I think i have a good idea here.

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Bear in mind, there already is a difference in MP and SP with levelling - the XP points are much less per person in a party, so 2 or 3 people will get their next level slower if they're killing at the same rate 1 person would kill at in SP.
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Good point. The meta thats developing in mp is facanating. Your group actually gets way more xp, and faster, than a sp but you level slower because its spread out among other players.

But those 3 players get 3x the skill points of a sp. That's the issue.

 
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