Well, the jars do get a comeback it seems.

[Mister Forgash]

I think it'll be fine to move dew collectors up the workstation tech tree, maybe raise the cost and make the tarp/gather mods craftable.
My biggest concern with jars is that they'll make it very easy to have an overabundance of water in the early game where a lot of the fun is struggling to have enough of anything to really feel secure.

I just hope if returning jars makes water as easy as I expect it to, TFP are willing to look at drop rates/cook times/recipe costs/etc. (Water purifying!?) to slow progression and keep water enough of a concern that it feels like we have to grow out of it over a couple weeks rather than have it pretty much solved by day 2-3.
Like others have said, trying not to have strong feelings when I haven't seen the implementation yet, just putting my concerns out there.

 

[pApA^LeGBa]

@Mister Forgash As said before, they plan on locking them behind the crucible. They wont really effect early game. But dew collectors are easy too. It´s absolutly no problem to have 4 of them really fast, like day 2. It´s as easy as it was with the jars before the dew collector came. Just a bit more tedious.

 

[Jost Amman]

@Mister Forgash As said before, they plan on locking them behind the crucible. They wont really effect early game. But dew collectors are easy too. It´s absolutly no problem to have 4 of them really fast, like day 2. It´s as easy as it was with the jars before the dew collector came. Just a bit more tedious.

It's AS easy for a min-maxer or power-player, not for someone who plays normally just enjoying the adventure.
Everyone thinks by using his/her own parameters of course, but there's a pletora of gameplay styles out there that are different from yours.

 

[Mister Forgash]

@pApA^LeGBa I saw that jaw crafting will be gated behind crucible, that's great- But depending on how common they are in loot, if we get them back when drinking and so on, we may not even feel a need to be crafting jars until mass production becomes necessary.
I know dew collectors aren't great either, but at least the pipes and tape they need are high value items in the early game I find myself having to choose if I want more dew collectors, a better pipe weapon, or an early forge(This one. This is the winner) because my experience you don't really get to have all 3, at least not in those first few days.

I don't want water to go from too easy to even more easy, I'm going to advocate that I believe there should be another step in there. Maybe it doesn't have to be long, or expensive, or even gated particularly deep, but I firmly believe there should be something more.

 

[meganoth]

The reason there is little reaction for it is because this is only a small part of the overall ■■■■ up that they now decided to address. But they do things in a lazy way usually with no actual improvement to the gameplay. So this is just damage control without any further thought or water survival improvement.

Strong words when the actual changes aren't even released yet.

 

[Roland]

The reason there is little reaction for it is because this is only a small part of the overall ■■■■ up that they now decided to address. But they do things in a lazy way usually with no actual improvement to the gameplay. So this is just damage control without any further thought or water survival improvement.

The real reason, of course, is that people don't come to post things they are happy about nearly as often as they come to post things they are unhappy about. Silence is about as good a mark of approval as we can expect. A few will gush praise but most will just go back to playing happy now that one of the things that made them unhappy has been fixed.

What we can expect is a new group of unhappy people posting about some aspect of the return of empty jars and changes to water survival that THEY now dislike. If they are unhappy enough they will post and repost and repost until they believe they are representative of the entire community...

 

[InfiniteWarrior]

I was hoping for actual water survival where we really struggle with water. Wich the dew collectors didn´t give us either even though Madmoles reason for them was exactly that.

Who's to say it wouldn't be like that? TFP haven't offered any plans for it, yet most everyone is assuming it must and would be "back" in its original form. Worth repeating:

Nothing to even comment yet, nor rejoice over.

I just hope TFP have realized not everything has to be an either/or proposition. The game could do with some both-and, imo, though it's probably way too late in development to introduce much of that.

 

[InfiniteWarrior]

[The crucible] only shows up for purchase once a certain trader level is achieved.

Not my experience. I've seen it for sale immediately after starting at one vendor or another and thought to myself, "That's just mean." It's actually conceivable to get one very early on though I personally wouldn't go out of my way. I'll let ya'll debate on whether or not that should or shouldn't be the case. I don't particularly care myself. My motto is: let players do what they will.

Post automatically merged: Monday at 10:27 AM

Very possible they will be locked behind the crucible. Wonder how many people are still going to be excited for the return of jars then.

Craftable containers of whatever kind should be locked behind something. What would be tricky is to balance organic vs. manufactured water collection methods. I shudder to think.

 

[pApA^LeGBa]

It's AS easy for a min-maxer or power-player, not for someone who plays normally just enjoying the adventure.
Everyone thinks by using his/her own parameters of course, but there's a pletora of gameplay styles out there that are different from yours.

That is also true for how glass jars used to work. That´s why the the dew collector didn´t change anything in terms of being easy. Doesn´t matter how you play, it is a fact that the dew collector didn´t add any challenge at all compared to glass jars other than being more tedious.

 

[Laz Man]

I playtested the current iteration of jars this past weekend and it felt pretty good to me. It was nice to actually have to run over to a body of water to scoop up water again to boil. From a gameplay perspective, I think its a good thing to have the players interact with the environment more. Especially if that environment has zombies hiding in them ready to pounce on you if you are not paying attention (looking at you crawler steve hiding in a ditch )

 

[BFT2020]

I hope the dew collector stays in the game. I have enjoyed using it.

 

[Jost Amman]

Doesn´t matter how you play, it is a fact that the dew collector didn´t add any challenge at all compared to glass jars other than being more tedious.

Well... I wouldn't go that far.

That's your opinion, but has not been my experience.
Others have also posted something along my lines.

Post automatically merged: Monday at 11:22 AM

I playtested the current iteration of jars this past weekend and it felt pretty good to me. It was nice to actually have to run over to a body of water to scoop up water again to boil. From a gameplay perspective, I think its a good thing to have the players interact with the environment more. Especially if that environment has zombies hiding in them ready to pounce on you if you are not paying attention (looking at you crawler steve hiding in a ditch )

So, are you confirming that we're going back to the original implementation?
Are we going to be able to find empty jars on Day 1 and be able to scoop and boil water from lakes and rivers?

 

[RipClaw]

Especially if that environment has zombies hiding in them ready to pounce on you if you are not paying attention (looking at you crawler steve hiding in a ditch )

Crawlers are annoying, but getting hit on the head by a rock is even worse.

Post automatically merged: Monday at 11:34 AM

Doesn´t matter how you play, it is a fact that the dew collector didn´t add any challenge at all compared to glass jars other than being more tedious.

What kind of challenge are you looking for? As someone who primarily uses melee attacks, I don't want to be constantly thirsty because it decreases my stamina regeneration.

 

[RipClaw]

It´s absolutly no problem to have 4 of them really fast, like day 2

I doubt that. 4 dew collectors cost about 400 polymers.

 

[Riamus]

I playtested the current iteration of jars this past weekend and it felt pretty good to me. It was nice to actually have to run over to a body of water to scoop up water again to boil. From a gameplay perspective, I think its a good thing to have the players interact with the environment more. Especially if that environment has zombies hiding in them ready to pounce on you if you are not paying attention (looking at you crawler steve hiding in a ditch )

Can you give any details at all about how they'll be implemented? Not necessarily all the details, but maybe some of these:

• Will they be found in loot?
• Are they definitely crafted with a crucible?
• How easy is it to end up with stacks and stacks of empty jars that you don't need or want?
• What is the stack size?
• How long does it take to fill them?
• Can we please have a game option to disable them?

 

[grz__]

I hope the dew collector stays in the game. I have enjoyed using it.

In my opinion, I think they can complement each other. There is no reason to eliminate the dew collector. They could make it so that you need empty jars to put in it, instead of them magically appearing inside.

 

[Syphon583]

In my opinion, I think they can complement each other. There is no reason to eliminate the dew collector. They could make it so that you need empty jars to put in it, instead of them magically appearing inside.

At the very least, I would think the player would need to "load" the collector with jars. However, the model for the dew collector has a barrel. To me, the water should collect and appear in the UI as the number of jars it would fill. The player would then use jars to extract the water.

It will be really interesting to see what they do with the collector. Obviously time will tell if it still has a usefulness when jars are reintroduced. IMO, I also like the dew collector and hope they've found some way to keep it in the game.

 

[Riamus]

I know dew collectors aren't great either, but at least the pipes and tape they need are high value items in the early game I find myself having to choose if I want more dew collectors, a better pipe weapon, or an early forge

Pipes are easy to get. There are pipes all over the place you can scrap to get a lot of them and you can often find them in trash and other easy to loot locations. I've never been short on pipes for anything, even on day 1. Duct tape is a little more of a problem, but still isn't too bad. I'll usually have a forge and 2 dew collectors set up very quickly. I play 2 hour days and am not sure at what time during the day I'll have them built, so I can't say if it's one or two days with default settings, but it's still easy. Of course, I never waste resources on pipe weapons.

I doubt that. 4 dew collectors cost about 400 polymers.

It really isn't hard to get a lot of plastic if you really want it. It can be scrapped or looted pretty much anywhere you go. I'm not going to worry about crafting 4 dew collectors on day 1 or 2 because I don't need that many, but if I wanted to focus on doing it, I probably could. It's a matter of priorities, though. I hate walking everywhere, so I'll always focus time on finishing tier 1 quests as soon as possible so I have a bike. That's far more important to me than having extra dew collectors. But I'll still have time to make 2 of them very quickly without any direct attempt to get the required resources.

Anyhow, I like the dew collectors even if they aren't necessarily the best solution. Anything to not have to deal with jars.

 

[Laz Man]

Can you give any details at all about how they'll be implemented? Not necessarily all the details, but maybe some of these:

• Will they be found in loot?
• Are they definitely crafted with a crucible?
• How easy is it to end up with stacks and stacks of empty jars that you don't need or want?
• What is the stack size?
• How long does it take to fill them?
• Can we please have a game option to disable them?

Alot of details are still a WIP, hopefully we can share more soon. As far as the dew collector is concerned, it is not being removed.

Edit: It goes without saying that we intend not to trivialize water survival with the reintroduction of empty jars.

 

[Riamus]

They could make it so that you need empty jars to put in it, instead of them magically appearing inside.

At the very least, I would think the player would need to "load" the collector with jars.

I really hope that isn't what they do. I don't want to use jars at all. If they make it so that you have no choice but to use jars even if you're using a dew collector, then I'm stuck having to mod out the jars. I don't want jars in loot and I want to be able to use the dew collectors without needing jars so that I can entirely ignore that jars are back in the game. Any other option will require me to use a mod to remove jars entirely.