PC we need a primitive source of light in the early game.

[gurutar]

Not so much immersion breaking as mounting a torch on something is believable but rather gameplay breaking.

Being able to mount a torch on anything pretty much allows players to easily circumvent the trade off with holding a torch in your hand as a light source instead of a true weapon.

Considering torches and flash lights can be used as weapons suggests at least some type of situational decision making opportunity.

For example, do I use this torch/flashlight for increased visibility at the expense at having less damage and being detected more easily?

This decision is made less impactful since torches can be mounted / picked up with relatively low cost.

are you saying you'd rather do away with the ability to mount torches anywhere you want? it becomes a moot point as soon as you acquire the book that allows you to craft helmet light mods, the schematic or a mod itself, and that could easily be very early. to me, needing to make that decision of whether to carry light in exchange for using a mediocre weapon isn't worth much, and i don't find whacking zombies for an unreasonable amount of time to be fun, which is why i never play on anything above Warrior.

 

[BarryTGash]

So you don't want the "speed limit" lowered but yet you want an easy mode Day 1 light source added?

Argumentative. I never said that. Day 1, torches are fine. I made a suggestion earlier in this thread for another tier of light source between torch and helmet light mod:

Having a more tiered progression would be something: torch -> flashlight + duct tape mod* -> uber solar-powered helmet light mod.

The 'uber solar-powered helmet light mod' is what we have now. In my head canon it explains why it doesn't need batteries - it must charge during the day.

As for the flashlight + duct tape mod it should be terrible:

so goddamned awful (dim/low range, flickering + the need for batteries and perhaps even have it flicker and shut off every couple of minutes at random so you've got to turn it on again for some real potential horror moments)

 

[ktr]

I'd be happier with AGI builds getting a semi-night vision boost.  Would make the line WAY more valuable to go out early game at night when other lines want to stay inside. Especially since our most power tool is render near useless on horde nights.

 

[Laz Man]

are you saying you'd rather do away with the ability to mount torches anywhere you want? it becomes a moot point as soon as you acquire the book that allows you to craft helmet light mods, the schematic or a mod itself, and that could easily be very early. to me, needing to make that decision of whether to carry light in exchange for using a mediocre weapon isn't worth much, and i don't find whacking zombies for an unreasonable amount of time to be fun, which is why i never play on anything above Warrior.

Yes and no.  I think placing lights is important for base building but feel it minimizes the value of handheld and helmet lights.

It seems like there is room to improve the current implementation of lights more then just adding another primitive one that would just further trivialize their use.

 

[gurutar]

Yes and no.  I think placing lights is important for base building but feel it minimizes the value of handheld and helmet lights.

It seems like there is room to improve the current implementation of lights more then just adding another primitive one that would just further trivialize their use.

i'm with you that handheld torches/flashlights are valuable to the game and are underutilized, especially the flashlight which can't be placed, but i think having your character have a decent weapon in one hand and a torch in the other is the best of both worlds. this is possible in all sorts of games, STALKER comes to mind, where you have an offhand accessory slot controlled by its own button. if you don't use it, your character uses both hands to use a pistol. put a flashlight in that slot and press its button, he will one-hand the pistol and bring out the flashlight with the other. this is a very common tactic used by police and military units.

you wouldn't even need to add a primitive light source to the game at all in that case, everything is already there.

 

[PoloPoPo]

I have never carried 15 torches with me ever. Always one only.

Comparing torches in 7D2D with other games, the first thing that comes to my mind is that torches here should not burn forever. One should be able to ignite them at campfires or burning barrels, otherwise they need gasoline to "craft" a burning torch from a burnt down one. If you put your torch back into your tool belt or inventory it should go off.

 

[BarryTGash]

gasoline

I'd probably go with fat, as is, and oil - just to add to the cost (and add more use to oil). I think gasoline would be trivial very quickly - it doesn't take long to stockpile stacks. Granted, oil also builds up but only in stacks of 50.

Ah, to hell with it; fat, gasoline and oil.