Ok, but this depends a lot on zombie AI how likely a zombie will dig down. Make zombies less likely to dig --> less swiss cheese. Make only some zombies dig --> less swiss cheese.
PC Underground bases - what's the status of making them vulnerable to zombies?
- Thread starter badger2013
- Start date
The similarities between you and a cruise ship entertainer are striking: Trying to get the tourists to engage in meaningless activities while waiting for the ship to reach the next port. :smile-new:
canadianbluebeer
New member
I still think having them attack the hatches/doors is the best way.
Drawbridge that drops to a ramp: ok, bash under the bridge. You did put defenses there, did you not?
Hatches: a door that fell over.
Drawbridge on the ground leading to ramp: it's a door.
This would mean you would have to have secondary doors, hatches inside, you'd have to beef up the wall or they would start digging horizontally like they already do.
Not to mention have to put defenses inside the base.
No swiss cheese effect beyond what we already get if a zombie falls in a hole/pit.
Not to mention, probably the easiest to code.
Oh, make it a specific zombie to beat up on hatches. Spiders climb, Mole/Badger looks for hatches.
smiple.
(yes, you could also just put a hatch over a pit and have them fall to their doom, but hey, serves'em right.
Of course, you'd have to dig a deep pit, and put things that go zap/boom etc at the bottom, or they're gonna trash yer stuff)
Drawbridge that drops to a ramp: ok, bash under the bridge. You did put defenses there, did you not?
Hatches: a door that fell over.
Drawbridge on the ground leading to ramp: it's a door.
This would mean you would have to have secondary doors, hatches inside, you'd have to beef up the wall or they would start digging horizontally like they already do.
Not to mention have to put defenses inside the base.
No swiss cheese effect beyond what we already get if a zombie falls in a hole/pit.
Not to mention, probably the easiest to code.
Oh, make it a specific zombie to beat up on hatches. Spiders climb, Mole/Badger looks for hatches.
smiple.
(yes, you could also just put a hatch over a pit and have them fall to their doom, but hey, serves'em right.
Of course, you'd have to dig a deep pit, and put things that go zap/boom etc at the bottom, or they're gonna trash yer stuff)
Crater Creator
Community Moderator
No poll yet. But thinking about a poll did force me to read the entirety of this thread looking for ideas. I've compiled and categorized every on-topic thought people have offered on the subject.
Ideas for underground threats can be broken into two categories: entity-based threats and environment-based threats. Then there are underground ideas beyond added threats; and lastly the thoughts, opinions, and assertions that come up every time we discuss this that are focused on things other than improving gameplay.
A: Entity-based threats
- Digger Z: Zombies that dig, perhaps with a maximum depth they’ll dig, or weaknesses outside of digging
- Digger Non-Z: Non-zombies that dig, like bandits, animals, or earthquakes
- Filler: Zombies or other entities that fill in tunnels, potentially burying the player
- Sleeper: Dens/buried graves of sleeper zombies/animals/monsters
- Sentry: Zombies that wait at the surface until you come out, without despawning
- Gate Crasher: Zombies that target & attack hatches like they already target doors
- Worms: Small critters that squeeze in through blocks without destroying them
- Bread crumbs: The player leaves a ‘scent trail’ for zombies to follow
B: Environment-based threats
- Ventilation: Oxygen is limited, with some mechanism(s) to combat this
- Flooding: Cavities sometimes fill with water
- Localized hazards: Players get hurt if they get too close to poison gas, explosive gas, lava, or a pit
- Cumulative hazards: Radiation, dust, temperature, lack of sunlight, or ‘insanity’ builds up for the player while underground
- Barren: Farming is inhibited, so players have to leave the base more often
C: Other, Non-Threat-Based Underground Ideas
- Bedrock: Terrain is literally indestructible and there is no underground.
- Content: More complex caves and/or underground POIs are added.
- Buyout: Players can pay a trader/settlement for safety.
- Undetected: Stealth perks/skills allow the player to stay undetected, even on horde night.
- Suppression: A mechanism prevents certain zombies from spawning in the first place.
- Foundation: The player can automatically detect or fill holes under a base, and/or prevent digging there.
D: Other Thoughts That May or May Not Be Correct, But People Are Very Vocal About
Originally, I was thinking if we did do a poll, this would be the list of off-topic things that would be culled to a separate thread.
- There are other ways to avoid zombies for little effort.
- The player will always find a way to circumvent intended gameplay.
- Underground gameplay is fine and no changes are needed.
- Mods should provide underground gameplay for those that want it.
- The player can’t defend against digger zombies as they’re coming.
- In addition to avoiding threats, players underground avoid benefits like XP.
- The zombies don’t ‘play fair,’ either.
- Anything should be optional.
- Anecdotally, zombies have already gotten into underground bases.
- Players can choose to avoid the underground, or anything else they don’t like.
- Sometimes a player wants a break from the zombies.
- Changes could affect the playstyle of some players.
So is this useful? Is there a poll to be had out of this? I don't know at this point. But now we can at least save a lot of time by just shouting "A6!" "D8!" "C3!" "D7!" at each other, since we pretty much make the same points every time. :fencing:
RestInPieces
New member
It is useful, save from D. I think it would be more useful to create a poll focusing on hypothetical optional underground solutions, rather than another wasteful discussion about if underground needs a solution or not, because the developers are already planning it afaik and it can always be optional, like pretty much everything else.
canadianbluebeer
New member
Well, unless they can go through bedrock, then it comes down to, have an open area around your underground base (top to bedrock).
Zombies dig, they come out in the empty area.
Where the player and defenses just smash them.
More work for the player, but really, negates diggers completely.
I'm currently clearing a HUGE area around my base (soo many goodies to mine it's just insane)
If I go 40 blocks out all the way around, let'em come. They''ll die.
Now, early on, they will be an issue. Putting the forges way out somewhere underground, will only work if they are under a drop pit.
(which, thinking about it, is what I should have done).
They find the heat, come look, fall in, and the turrets/traps etc take care of them.
So in future, it'll be base down to bedrock (with topside fortress), find good pit location at least 2 chunks away, dig pit to bedrock, put forges etc on bedrock, but above that, is the bait of open hole. Plop, zap, bam, loot.
So unless they start digging from far away, non-issue.
As someone else said though, how do you defend against them?
Open area before they get to the vitals.
Outer wall can just be wood. Cheap, easy to repair. Not as if they will really keep them out.
I do want the basher one though, that type should already be in the game. That at least makes sense.
just my 2 coppers, again.
Zombies dig, they come out in the empty area.
Where the player and defenses just smash them.
More work for the player, but really, negates diggers completely.
I'm currently clearing a HUGE area around my base (soo many goodies to mine it's just insane)
If I go 40 blocks out all the way around, let'em come. They''ll die.
Now, early on, they will be an issue. Putting the forges way out somewhere underground, will only work if they are under a drop pit.
(which, thinking about it, is what I should have done).
They find the heat, come look, fall in, and the turrets/traps etc take care of them.
So in future, it'll be base down to bedrock (with topside fortress), find good pit location at least 2 chunks away, dig pit to bedrock, put forges etc on bedrock, but above that, is the bait of open hole. Plop, zap, bam, loot.
So unless they start digging from far away, non-issue.
As someone else said though, how do you defend against them?
Open area before they get to the vitals.
Outer wall can just be wood. Cheap, easy to repair. Not as if they will really keep them out.
I do want the basher one though, that type should already be in the game. That at least makes sense.
just my 2 coppers, again.
Aerial
New member
There will always be a way to build protection from zombies and there should be. What you describe above is a pretty large undertaking and all that work ought to result in near-immunity from the zombie horde so long as you maintain your infrastructure.Well, unless they can go through bedrock, then it comes down to, have an open area around your underground base (top to bedrock).Zombies dig, they come out in the empty area.
Where the player and defenses just smash them.
More work for the player, but really, negates diggers completely.
I'm currently clearing a HUGE area around my base (soo many goodies to mine it's just insane)
If I go 40 blocks out all the way around, let'em come. They''ll die.
Now, early on, they will be an issue. Putting the forges way out somewhere underground, will only work if they are under a drop pit.
(which, thinking about it, is what I should have done).
They find the heat, come look, fall in, and the turrets/traps etc take care of them.
So in future, it'll be base down to bedrock (with topside fortress), find good pit location at least 2 chunks away, dig pit to bedrock, put forges etc on bedrock, but above that, is the bait of open hole. Plop, zap, bam, loot.
So unless they start digging from far away, non-issue.
As someone else said though, how do you defend against them?
Open area before they get to the vitals.
Outer wall can just be wood. Cheap, easy to repair. Not as if they will really keep them out.
I do want the basher one though, that type should already be in the game. That at least makes sense.
just my 2 coppers, again.
But if all you have to do to be safe is dig a 3x5 hole in the dirt and put a hatch over it, that's not good game mechanics. So the digger's role should be to make it necessary to build defenses underground just like they're necessary above ground.
a simple wall is a protection, traps are protection. More effort should give you more protection. Make a fortress and you are protected from any threats. Sure there should always be a way to build protection.
However, since you began to discuss about what "should be", then digging a 3 meters hole and filling it by blocks over your head shouldn't protect you from zombies very well. In 7DTD zombies smash steel walls and feel you through them, so digging you up from the hole in a dirt shouldn't be a problem for them at all.
canadianbluebeer
New member
I agree that only being a few blocks down isn't much, but it would be good for short time hiding.
I mean, that's all you're doing is hiding and maybe it'll work, or maybe they'll dig you out.
I don't mind the idea of a digger that goes after a few blocks down (only dig through dirt, gravel, possibly clay),
however, the problem then is, they make a hole that regular zombies fall into, who then start going horizontally, thus swiss cheese.
I would say "ok, make it so that zombies cannot damage regular rock". Now someone is gonna find a big boulder, and build up from one of those. um...
so pros and cons.
I mean, that's all you're doing is hiding and maybe it'll work, or maybe they'll dig you out.
I don't mind the idea of a digger that goes after a few blocks down (only dig through dirt, gravel, possibly clay),
however, the problem then is, they make a hole that regular zombies fall into, who then start going horizontally, thus swiss cheese.
I would say "ok, make it so that zombies cannot damage regular rock". Now someone is gonna find a big boulder, and build up from one of those. um...
so pros and cons.
Luzifer
New member
With Dogs being the Going-to-be Diggers i welcome the idea of Molehunters, cuz playing on a server with about 26 People and more or less never Meeting someone aboveground even in the Communityhub is pretty dank boring.
I might as well go offline if i wanted to play alone(!)
Also with the more structured Ai, Horizontal Basebuilding (like having only 2 Stories not a whole Eifeltower) aboveground will result in Bigger Bases, with many actively defended Layers and retreatgateways and and and i really cant wait for it. My imagination is a Vulcano right now bursting with a flood of different basedesigns.
I might as well go offline if i wanted to play alone(!)
Also with the more structured Ai, Horizontal Basebuilding (like having only 2 Stories not a whole Eifeltower) aboveground will result in Bigger Bases, with many actively defended Layers and retreatgateways and and and i really cant wait for it. My imagination is a Vulcano right now bursting with a flood of different basedesigns.
Crater Creator
Community Moderator
It would be nice if non-digging zombies did not consider paths that required them to dig down. Then they would avoid falling into the holes, unless the digger had finished digging through.