YourMirror
Survivor
I do play the game since alpha 14, so get get of your high horse pretending your opinion is the only one that matters.
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The LBD theyre introducing isnt what I wanted or had in mind.
- Thread starter jadMurray
- Start date
Scyris
Survivor
When did I say mine is the only one that matters? don't put words in my mouth that I didn't say. I'm not on a high horse, I just want the game to become good again. Instead of continuing on this downward spiral its been on since alpha 17. I am going to be honest if this game wasn't modable I'd have given up on it back in a17, as the game hasn't really gone anywhere since a17, they remove then put back, or redo old features instead of ever adding something actually new that wasn't just taken from a mod.
This is such a weird take. A lot of people who played multiple versions have bought the game multiple times. I personally have bought Console Legacy for my family and friends, bought myself and them the updated version, and bought myself the Steam version. No I do not believe I personally get any more claim to how the game goes than anyone else. But if the dev team and community managers are going to ignore a part of their community, whether its a big larger or a bit smaller, thats ridiculous. If I wanted that treatment I'd go back to playing Ark Survival Ascended and accept that they're going to use AI art.
Jost Amman
Hunter
There's a BIG difference between IGNORING a customer (what you're implying) and simply listening to him/her as just ONE opinion like the rest.
See, this is the kind of attitude I hate about some people on this forum. Some random (and always HUGE of course) group either gets "special" attention from the devs, or they accuse them of being ignored and treated like second-class customers.
That's called a passive-aggressive tactic.
Thats not what I'm going for. This thread is meant to be a discussion about how I feel about what they've shared about the LBD system.
Also I know I'm not the only one who feels this way. I don't know how many people specifically on this forum agree with me, but there's quite a few people. People like IzPrebuilt who've been fighting and requesting a return to form. My whole goal is, Madmole said why LBD can't return. I've made multiple threads and arguments offering compromises because I enjoyed what was originally in the game and I personally am not happy with the current point buy system.
What madmole said in the previous thread about LBD returning was correct that some skills were annoying to level up. When I typed this thread up originally, I was pretty frustrated. I was too negative becauss what the devs are adding is a fun system. My issue is I don't want half of the pie, I want the whole thing.
Also I don't think the devs are specifically focusing one group, I was just responding to what that specific person posted because that was a...not great sounding statement. One which is being shared by Just Rob and doesn't look great for the devs or the community manager if thats what their view on the people who've played the game in previous alphas.
There is no community manager, or at most @Crater Creator could be one as well as being "super moderator", I don't know. Moderators are volunteer forum users who make sure the forum rules are followed, apart from that they are normal players and their utterings are normal opinions of normal players.
PS: Crater explained it much better here
pApA^LeGBa
Hunter
The spike in player numbers for V1 is also from people thinking he game is now finished. There is always a lot of people who refuse to play early access games. That´s not acutally of a sign that LBD from A16 is worse than what have now.
Still hoping Khaine will someday relase a stand alone mod of the DF system.
Still hoping Khaine will someday relase a stand alone mod of the DF system.
Roland
Community Moderator
And this is the root of the problem with your faction. You aren't wrong that there are a lot of people who believe as you do and that is a real problem when there are that many people unwilling to compromise or acknowledge that their desires aren't representative of everyone. Compromise is the only way forward and you and the rest who are like you won't have it. It's gotta be your whole pie or the game is garbage, the devs are idiots, and all the rest of the stuff you guys like to repeat over and over again on Prebuilt's channel.
You're never going to get the whole pie and neither am I. Nobody is. And that is because the only reality that can exist in a project like this with thousands of different expectations, desires, and goals is one in which the devs and the player base compromise. The devs make some changes they weren't originally planning based on player feedback and the player base adapts to changes they weren't always expecting.
Life isn't about getting the whole pie. People who get past about the age of 11 without realizing that have serious problems with life. Its about give and take and understanding that there are different perspectives out there and so being satisfied with part of the pie so that others can have part of the pie too.
The devs have come to that conclusion, obviously, and are compromising. I never would have believed six months ago that any form of LBD might be returning and yet, here we are.
Jost Amman
Hunter
theFlu
Hunter
I had the desire to go for a "bet we're gonna get X next." Oddly enough, I think we're all out of X's at this point ..
The D&D-esque attributes of the current skill point system are the biggest hamper to build creativity, IMO. But they're also tied to dismember chance and head shot damage, both of which are significant contributors to damage output and therefore survival. Much as I'd love to see them gone so you could level up whatever skill you preferred, a LBD system for many of those skills could solve it, but that's outside the scope of what Joel mentioned the other day.
I am all for a system where the game feels less like 7 Days of Checking the Mail, so I'm excited for that, but I also see why some folks are frustrated. It's also why I remain in wait and see mode. Granted, I had that approach with 2.0 despite my suspicions, but I kept mouth shut as to not poison the well (the well being my friends opinions based on their experiences with 2.0). Now here we are with 2.5.
I am all for a system where the game feels less like 7 Days of Checking the Mail, so I'm excited for that, but I also see why some folks are frustrated. It's also why I remain in wait and see mode. Granted, I had that approach with 2.0 despite my suspicions, but I kept mouth shut as to not poison the well (the well being my friends opinions based on their experiences with 2.0). Now here we are with 2.5.
Scyris
Survivor
Yeah 7dtd is still in a alpha state, you can tell it is, as alot of the changes going on are what usually happens in a alpha build of a game. Alpha has massive gameplay changes often and such, beta is when game is basically feature complete for release and just needs some testing, 7dtd is still far away from a beta state. The version naming was done to get around some red tape to get the game on consoles. If we were to name it by alpha we'd be on alpha 23 or 24 right now.
Scyris
Survivor
That is easy to fix, Have the action skill add the headshot damage and dismember chance every 10 skill level, 10-80 is 10% per 10 skill, 90-100 is 15% per 10 skill for headshot damage, this will match what u get for 10 in a stat. This is how Darkness Falls puts in the dismember chance and headshot damage, its part of the action skill itself. I would love this game so much more if the weapons, harvesting and salvage tools were decoupled from stats along with their respective perks, and the action skill level determines what level of say Pummel Pete, and its attack speed perk can be learned.
Or if they wanna keep the stats they seem so hell bent on, Lower it to 3 stats: Combat which has all the weapons both melee and gun, and the base stats of Combat effects headshot/dismember bonuses for every weapon. Survival which would be stuff like cooking, mining, salvaging, and such, then Defense, which has stuff like the armor skills, Pain tolerance, Parkour etc. My ONLY issue with the stats system is JUST The fact that weapons and tools are locked to the stats, if they can solve that problem i'd be fine with the current stat system.
As the current stat system is much to restrictive especially when some weapons are just above and beyond better than others. IMO the best guns in the game are shotguns once you get pump shotguns, they hit like a truck, force zombies to walk speed for 4-8s after being hit, and has a insanely high dismember chance. The downside/balance factor to the shotguns is the short range.
9mm Pistols and the revolver are basically useless later game, desert eagle is decent though as is the Smg as the Smg has insane DPS but it is a ammo hog.
Rifles are mostly useless other than horde night, they are very unweildly to use inside of a poi, as even a shotgun has way better hipfire accuarcy which is silly.
Int weapons, sledge turret/robot turret are useless, the turret that shoots does such low damage that it tickles ferals and is basically useless on anything higher. DF fixed this by allowing it to fire iron spikes, like the Spike traps do, which up its damage to 60-70 a shot on a max tier one with mods. Sledge turret is only good for knockback, it does pathethic damage, and is slow. Stun baton is nice, but your mostly 100% depending on that 10% chance to insta kill chance to have any sort of real kill speed later on, but at least, the enemies are going to be basically perma stunned so while they take forever for a stun baton user to kill, at least they cannot harm you either.
Machine guns are the other useful weapon, hit fairly hard, have long range, have high dps as well. Downside is expensive ammo due to the gunpowder cost, and the fact alot of the fort perks in the tree are pretty worthless imo other than pain tolerance and the machine gun perk itself.
zztong
Hunter
I saw something like this suggested from another person, and I wonder if this is a possible area of compromise or an area for an alternative system.
7DaysToDieEnjoyer
Refugee
Small magazines, low damage. On top of that, they trigger Demolisher bombs, which is ridiculous.
Riamus
Hunter
And yet many people love the turret and stun baton combo and consider it OP. The game doesn't have to make every weapon equal or make every weapon work in every situation. Games that do that make weapons nothing more than cosmetic skins. With this game, the weapons are actually different and you can choose a weapon that works with how you enjoy playing the game. That is a good thing. I use spears, with a sniper rifle for horde night. I have a handgun for a backup if I get into trouble, but I rarely use it. Just because that is what I want to use for weapons doesn't mean that things like clubs or sledgehammers or knives are bad and useless. I don't like those and won't use them, but other people love them, and that's a good thing.
Jost Amman
Hunter
Most people making comments here about weapon efficacy don't even play near the default difficulty.
As such, their comments are useless from a balancing standpoint.
I know I may sound harsh, but it's not an attack against you guys, it's just the hard truth.
As such, their comments are useless from a balancing standpoint.
I know I may sound harsh, but it's not an attack against you guys, it's just the hard truth.
7DaysToDieEnjoyer
Refugee
Yes, you're right, but it's a bit unfair that you invest in perks, build those turrets, produce ammo, and they trigger the Demolisher's bombs, while the automatic turrets don't.If you want to use them during horde nights, you have to be careful.
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7DaysToDieEnjoyer
Refugee
Ahh, I always forget that there’s such a thing as default difficulty.
Riamus
Hunter
If you're using them during horde night, you don't have to invest into them at all unless you just want to have 2 of them active at once. They aren't really the best option for horde night anyhow. If I use them, I'll put them on the roof to handle vultures so I don't have to bother killing them myself. But if you want turrets for horde night, then the automatic turrets are going to be far better. And they really should be. They are basically an improved version of the junk turrets. You also don't have to invest any points into any perks in order to use the automated turrets. You just have to unlock the crafting of them and unlock crafting power for them, or else buy them. So there isn't any cost beyond buying/crafting them - no "wasted" perk points.
As a side note, you can also place junk turrets in a location that will target the backs of enemies so you don't have to worry about triggering the demolition guys. That may require investing into the perk to increase the distance you can be from them, though.