PC The big crying thread for 17.2 Economy

I use them for Iron/Steel tools and nice early game boosts then that's it. Probably rarely visit them again till late game for bullets ofc. I agree with the above why would you live on anything other than Bacon and Eggs. They are so plentiful. And Red Tea is awesome. Why would you ever drink water? One point in this perk completely removes any need to put points into Slow Metabolism. Now that one is a wasted point.
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Thats about what I use traders for, to try to get early game iron or steel tools even tier 1 i'll buy even moreso if it has a few forged steel/iron so I can repair them. After that other than maybe food and ammo I rarely use them. Early game I might stick near a trader if it happens to have a forge in there.

 
I think the player should absolutely be able to do this. Two words: opportunity cost. If a player wants to waste dukes on food he is missing out on some really great early game boosts that could have been bought instead (cheap mods for example) . It's a hugely inefficient way to feed yourself.


That is absolutely where the game is right now. Buying food is a huge waste. I think I have done it once ever in A17, and that was when I lost my entire food chest through stupidity and was a tiny bit desperate. Never felt the need at any other time. It's emergencies only as far as I am concerned. Far too many important things to buy early game before I'd waste dukes on food.

Don't under-estimate Red Tea from Master Chef 1. It reduces your max stamina loss considerably, so in a round about way you would still profit as you'd need to eat a lot less. You really want to make the switch from Water to Red Tea as early as possible as it will really snowball for you, however you chose to feed yourself.
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I only buy food early when I don't have any healing items like first aid kits or first aid bandages. Eating some 'high end' food can heal up you nicely. I sometimes buy drinks so I can get the glass jar if for some reason I haven't found any. Other than that yes you're right that dukes should be spent on things that are useful to you in the long time. For instance the trader had a burning shaft mod early in the game. I spent all my time scavenging things to sell to buy it. That mod is still in my main melee weapon right now.

Can you explain how the Red Tea reduces max stamina loss works? I have tons of it made but I usually drink yucca juice or the goldenrod.

 
I agree with this guy ^ if you dont like how the trader is just don't use it in a17.1. I do feel they went a little to nuts on the price of things, everything seems worth less than half what it used to be just about.
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People who don't like the traders are free not to use them. However, for the ones that do use traders there needs to be balance so that when you trade you don't get OP too early. Getting OP too early usually results in a boring game.

Yeah one steel armor usually sold for around 5K - 6k. Now one sells for 1k to 1.5k. Definitely > 70% reduction.

 
i think on the long run the changes are good.

All i consider is the question if a startgame on a more contryish Map is fair towards a player.

I dont ask for MORE money for players in general. I ask the question how we can push the options to make some coins the first few days a bit without pushing the long term income greatly.

No idea how you see this but i normally dont focus on trashbags and registers after day 7,14,48+

 
I dont mind the price nerf but i got the problem with attributes balance. Intellect tree is already strong and now barter and cooking have even more value then before. Look at agillity tree and compare it to intellect .. no contest here. I feel we need perk balancing update next.

 
Damn man! Isn't that over 12 hours per day every day? Someone might need a breather :)
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I dont mind the price nerf but i got the problem with attributes balance. Intellect tree is already strong and now barter and cooking have even more value then before. Look at agillity tree and compare it to intellect .. no contest here. I feel we need perk balancing update next.
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Really, for me Barter has far less Value.

25% more Money if you sell is something i am not even sure that it is worth its 5 Skillpoints

In A17.1 the perk was so powerfull that i tried to sell nothing before i had at least level 4 in it.

Now i really dont care.

 
Can you explain how the Red Tea reduces max stamina loss works? I have tons of it made but I usually drink yucca juice or the goldenrod.
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If you exert yourself (say mine all day), you will notice your max stamina drops by quite a lot, and you will need to eat to recover it. Compare this to a day where you do nothing and your max stamina will not drop at all and you will not need to eat at all. Red Tea reduces the amount of max stamina you lose on those busy days (by 15% I think) meaning you need less food to replenish it.

Just for the record, I have never once put a point in Better Barter.

 
I dont mind the price nerf but i got the problem with attributes balance. Intellect tree is already strong and now barter and cooking have even more value then before. Look at agillity tree and compare it to intellect .. no contest here. I feel we need perk balancing update next.
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I agree about the balance, but my take on the Intellect tree is very different. I think of it as the weakest tree. It doesn't help you survive combat, or explore, or travel or loot, or gather. At least early on in the game.

That said, it is unfortunately the must-have tree early on. By level 20, the player will earn 23 points. Of those I feel at least 8 *MUST* go into Intellect (6 to get Int 5, 2 for Forge and Iron Tools, and 1 for Master Chef). If you do not spend those 8 points you are just gimping yourself for the early game, so there's basically no choice. That's 1/3 of your early points gone and you are not any better at actually existing in the world. Not good design.

It's OK in a co-op situation as one player can take on all the crafting and "stay home" (or stay at the back in dangerous situations), but for solo play it is very inflexible and verges on punishing.

 
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Really, for me Barter has far less Value.

25% more Money if you sell is something i am not even sure that it is worth its 5 Skillpoints

In A17.1 the perk was so powerfull that i tried to sell nothing before i had at least level 4 in it.

Now i really dont care.
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It's 25% if you sell and 50% if you buy. Also unlocks stash. Sounds pretty OP to me. I think it might even need a nerf!

 
It's 25% if you sell and 50% if you buy. Also unlocks stash. Sounds pretty OP to me. I think it might even need a nerf!
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Sure, it is allready nerfed into the ground,

(and does that look like i encumber)

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The change was painfull enough and we can discuss if it was too strong (what is not what i say)

Reducing the Perk again would be equal to remove the Traders completely.

(I allready consider if i would again start a vanilla game as trader class)

Thats why i ask only for a small (startgame aimed) moneymaker for people that start on a countryish map

 
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Really, for me Barter has far less Value.

25% more Money if you sell is something i am not even sure that it is worth its 5 Skillpoints

In A17.1 the perk was so powerfull that i tried to sell nothing before i had at least level 4 in it.

Now i really dont care.
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Another perk nerfed into oblivion.

Which perk is next i wonder.

edit: To be fair, it was just fixed to do what the description always said.

But the result is a nerf.

 
edit: To be fair, it was just fixed to do what the description always said.

But the result is a nerf.
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Yep, thats the really problem. so instead of leading a lynch mob all i can do is

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Yep, thats the really problem. so instead of leading a lynch mob all i can do is
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I guess that is why the new RWG is lots of water. All those tears have to end up somewhere.

 
Just finished my short term testplay for A17.2 B20.

I had a really really nice startposition.

In this context the new economy is in my opinion on the point.

I wreched so many cars that i was able to generate arround 100 000 Coins in 10 Hours

Well this was a PERFECT Startspot

AD5C915823603824FD20F6EBD4FE475BEFF80756


2 Trader near, one not far away. Dozends of Pois with nice easy reachable Stashes and Hundrets of cars arround.

So i stay at my meaning that we need a moneymaker for more countryish starts.

I guess that the next thing i test as mod. I change the arround 5 Coins in some Trashbags to 70 and the 40 in Registers to 200

 
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For "countryish" starts couldn't you just use the wsad keys to go somewhere else? tip: hold shift to get there faster
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Lol...Same strategy works for when you start in the snow biome and don’t want to freeze once noob protection wears off.

Royal had a tough time with that too if I remember correctly. :)

 
For "countryish" starts couldn't you just use the wsad keys to go somewhere else? tip: hold shift to get there faster
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I had over the time many starts where a "just move to the next city" dont work.

Did you ever had a map with all trader 3km away from the next town ?

Why the pushback ?

A player that have access to enough cars or stashes will not spend his day by running arround and collection Trashbags, or focus on registers.

 
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