Suggestion: Dew Collectors (and maybe apiaries) should require empty jars as fuel.

[theFlu]

So then are you suggesting it isn't good?

I said so, explicitly in the thread. It'd make the Dew Collector obsolete. Your second quote of me starts with "I agree that messing with the collector / apiary isn't a good solution;". How do read that to mean "as you are assuming it's a positive fix?"

 

[Kyoji]

I said so, explicitly in the thread. It'd make the Dew Collector obsolete. Your second quote of me starts with "I agree that messing with the collector / apiary isn't a good solution;". How do read that to mean "as you are assuming it's a positive fix?"

So then you were just arguing semantics over the low hanging fruit not having to be good then? I will wait for a reply to my actual points.

How is that an improvement? It would introduce an infinite source at the moment where the game is intended to slightly alleviate the burden of gathering and/or enable crafting glue.
The problem isn't "there are no jars", the problem is "there are too many jars"; especially when you aren't eating them. So all that would accomplish is making the jars even More obsolete.

No that would make the dew collector obsolete. A better solution would be simply tweaking the dew collector. Aside from realism I don't see any valid argument to be made from dew collectors needing jars.

I disagree that the other end of the jar-deletion-setting should be automatically causing an overflow. We'd need a setting to reduce sources, or increase sinks ..

That would come with toggle settings the devs mentioned I would wager.

But the real problem is in the way the collector works... it was made to limit the rate of water collection; it sounds logical in that sense. But it breaks as soon as you add an infinite source next to it. Realistically it serves little purpose next to a lake. This can't really be fixed directly, it's a failure in the basic logic. So any attempts to make it make sense as a limiting step are relatively futile...

Not at all. With a distillation function it could provide mineral water which provides better benefits than regular water and like many things could offset or remove the need for water collection for people playing at the natural 0% return. This means you graduate from needing to live by a water source to up in a high POI or self-sustain. Not every item has to be a 200% return on investment. Some things can be good even if it's just 120% return. I don't build every item in ARK so why would I expect to build every item here? At this point it would take more work to remove them then to just let them be.

 

[theFlu]

No that would make the dew collector obsolete.

Yes, also. But the thread OP is "Don't make JARS obsolete", I'm talking of the topic at hand.

With a distillation function it could provide mineral water

So could the lake? You're doing random modifications as a response to me describing the problems of the current situation.

I will wait for a reply to my actual points.

I have no idea what your points Are, we're not talking the same language. You're free to rephrase whatever you want me to reply to, I will if I can understand it.

 

[Kyoji]

I have no idea what your points Are, we're not talking the same language. You're free to rephrase whatever you want me to reply to, I will if I can understand it.

From my understanding and correct me if I am mistaken but you either wish for the removal of the dew collector due to obsolesence or requiring it to use jars to produce water?

My perspective on the matter is that even if it is obsolete it doesn't hurt to leave it in and tweak it a bit to make it better. It's not like it hurts leaving it in for those that enjoy it.

If the only function is to prevent you from finding a lake then that is fine. It's a tech you can build or not build and doesn't damage the game economy in any way IMO. Even just removing the need for you to find a lake would encourage me to build a few in the later stages of the game where I am swimming in resources.

So my point is that either the dew collector is fine as is or just needs a buff to make it more competitive. It does not need jar requirements or removal.

 

[theFlu]

From my understanding and correct me if I am mistaken but you either wish for the removal of the dew collector due to obsolesence or requiring it to use jars to produce water?

I have asked for neither, in fact I have advocated against both, in this very thread. So, I hope you'll understand, arguments from that position feel a little strange to me

For what it's worth (nothing), IMO:

- Optimally, the collector was never implemented in the first place. It was, we have it; game is balanced around it. Sad but true.

- With the return of jars and the non-delete option, I can now freely ignore the Collectors in my games. I'm fine with that. I'm slightly saddened that it will destroy any idea of water balance, but if that's what's on offer, I'll have to live with no balance.

Thus I have asked for some consideration to be given to the water balance with the Non-glass-diet option, but that's it. The only suggestion I remember giving wrt the Collectors themselves, is to maybe give it some options as well (Off/Tier5/Tier2/Something), iirc.

In short, "Leave it alone, but if possible, make sure the game works with the other settings too". Rather close to your position, I guess?