PC Steam reviews - I kinda figured

Crafters path to optimal weapon: hours of leveling before you can even make it, hours (and hours and hours) of looting to find rare items.
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Or digging and crafting stuff that you then sell to the trader (remember Int is good for crafting AND barter). Buy weapon and mods and schematics, some more craft => optimal weapon

 
I find it disappointing that Madmole seems to enthusiastically want to follow Fallout's path to mediocrity. This "give crafter's more exp" thing he keeps touting really feels hollow. It's a lame attempt at a band aid for the real problem. This progression feels hollow, unrewarding and boring.

The solutions you're coming up with don't even make any ■■■■ sense. People liked A16 progression. It had a slew of level gates and only had a little less than 2/3s of the SP required to max everything. And what's more, you really felt like you had choice in that system. People don't like A17 progression. The solutions? Lets make it faster, remove all the level gates and change nothing about the perk pidgeon holing. That'll surely work!

That's before we get into the metric ♥♥♥♥ ton of complexity and strategy that got removed from the game.

Gore blocks. Gone. A nuisance that gave you resources (how's everyone doing on glue btw? amirite?). You needed to plan for getting rid of them so you could lay new defenses/repair your base. A player that didn't like dealing with cleanup could build a compact kill zone so they'd mostly auto despawn. A player that liked the resources you got from them could optimize the other way.

Item Quality. For all intents and purposes, gone. Who cares about more durability and the transparently flawed "DYE = DMAGE!!11" mod system? This sounds like a bad Warhammer 30k joke. I hope we can paint our vehicles red too.

Bio gas. Gone for no apparent reason other than "♥♥♥♥ those guys."

Electric lights. Simple light is all that's left. Are you guys serious?

Recipe manuals. Gone. These things actually got me to go into Crack-a-books. Even more so in A15 and before, when they used to give you skill levels when you already knew the recipe. I can just buy the mods from traders, why bother with crafting them? This Alpha discourages crafting in general so hard I wonder why you even kept "Crafting" in your slogan.

Running. Yeah I don't know why this was touted as buffed. I could run more than a whole ■■■■ kilometer in A16 to get to where I was looting at the start of the day and repeat it on the way home at the end. Smart players made good use of Tea and Yucca for those stamina boosts. In this Alpha you really get the sense we've been mining for 5 years because we've all got the black lung. God help you if you have armor on cuz you'll be running slower too.

Combining items. Gone. This was a pretty neat way to get a leg up on progression if you were prepared to dump resources into it. To add insult to injury, we added a new crafting station that really should have just been the work bench. Also, why are concrete block recipes on the cement mixer and not the work bench? Am I going to shape these blocks with tools or a spinning barrel? hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Progression. Yadda yadda hill to die on. Madmole, what makes sense about clubbing seals in order to learn how to farm or make steel? Other games that use levels to buy perks are all combat games that award exp for combat to buy combat perks. Some of those even force you to buy perks related to the activity you got the exp from (Skyrim). It really seems to me some conscious effort went into how to make this system make as little sense as possible. It's really frustrating when there used to be a very rich system that worked well. You didn't like how quickly people progressed in it.. did ya think maybe you could slow it down rather than scrap it altogether?????????

"This was always our vision." Bull. The amount of stuff added and then removed from this game makes that sound absurd on its face. I'm counting the days until you remove electricity, stamina, steel tools and any food other than gruel just to make a little simpler for what you think is appealing to the masses.

Edit to add: Forgot to mention the AI. It's a dumpster fire. The worst part? It goes into infinite loops just like A16 AI when you're in a party on blood moon.

 
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I am ■■■■ed at A17 and i personally hate what it is but you know what. ♥♥♥♥ this and stop rewritting code all the time. Add content! And release a stable finished version. And let mods fix your messes! Every time you rewrite code, its harder for the mod authors to fix this mess anyway.
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I was standing on top of a barn today trying to shoot a bear, it was spinning around like crazy, I thought how long have we been waiting for a fix on this mechanic? Over four years now? I guess they had more pressing matters like reskinning everything for the 4th time. I know "it's alpha" but I also have to draw the line somewhere and be honest with myself. Yes this is alpha, but a very problematic, disorganized, and confused alpha. This alpha is like a teenager going through its phases of what's cool. Ark was cool so A13 became like Ark. Then FO4 came out so it decided to be like FO4. Then when people expressed disapproval it said "I'm trying to pursue my dream, leave me alone" What's sad is that 7D might never realize is that it had it's own unique thing going, and was always cooler than the false idols it tried to be like.

 
We're looking options like xp slider, zombie block damage, Blood moon frequency: every day, every 3 days every 7 days, every two weeks, every month, random, never. I think never would be good for the adventuring types who like to explore, and good for pvp, and for casuals who just like to build and don't want their stuff getting wrecked.
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In my opinion, the more slides/options that you give gamers, the more versatile your game will be for all the various play styles, it opens up more options for modders, and allows gamers to roleplay. For example, I'd love to pretend I'm a lone survivor in the walking dead universe, so having options to disable zombies to jump, dig and climb ladders would help with that immersion.

 
Idk about the blood moon frequency. Option to disable it for casuals but... kinda kills the 7 days to die theme *shrug* I guess I'd be okay with it lol. I'd prob switch for every night.

 
Idk about the blood moon frequency. Option to disable it for casuals but... kinda kills the 7 days to die theme *shrug* I guess I'd be okay with it lol. I'd prob switch for every night.
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For sure, I wouldn't be turning it off, but if TFP makes it easily moddable, or even, as Madmole is saying, puts a menu slider in for it, it's gotta be a win (assuming it didn't consume too much Dev time) since it makes the game configurable to each individual players preference.

Also, I'd love to try playing a game with a Horde every night!... hehe

 
For sure, I wouldn't be turning it off, but if TFP makes it easily moddable, or even, as Madmole is saying, puts a menu slider in for it, it's gotta be a win (assuming it didn't consume too much Dev time) since it makes the game configurable to each individual players preference.
Also, I'd love to try playing a game with a Horde every night!... hehe
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Day 1 Horde :D this will be fun

 
All A16 perk system needed was a harsh diminishing return on LBD or even a temporary debuff to over learning, plus only enough points to max out a few locked perks, everyone can specialize on what they wanted and play whatever it is they deem fun in the game, and we wouldn't have this constant merry go round in the forums.

Unfortunately of late I'm leaning on the critical side of the community. I'm not one who mind A17 took a year, great new vehicles and weapon mods, new poi's bit repetitive but good addition, but I thought we'd be getting more challenging content, instead we got a huge character nerf that added more grind, please note grind not difficulty (albeit getting used to new mechanics was difficult at first):

+ harsher survival

- unlimited water, food everywhere, +- temp to all clothing is really silly, A16 hot and cold was annoying but wearing/taking off clothing made sense.

+ more challenging hunting where we track animals

- they spawn around us and literally walk into our paths, new doe is practically asking for an arrow in the head.

+ added Nightmare run

- they're slower than A16

+ Quests! Yes pls!!

- fetch, clear poi been doing since day1, buried treasure not bad but gets repetitive and the zombie spawn on locating treasure is just silly.

Fallout/skyrim, good games in their own right, gorgeous worlds, stories and quests, but keeping all the mods upto date and working have become a chore. I only have a couple hundred hours in those compared to thousands in 7D pre A17. Popular as they were they're dated games to follow by.

The sub perks under attribute gates was the last straw for me and made no sense when TFP say we can specialize a whole lot more. It's like losing an old friend seeing it drop down in steam library, yesterday, this week, this month.

 
You know that part where i said you bring it on yourself that people are rude to you ect?This post is exactly the sort of ♥♥♥♥ i mean.
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What goes around, comes around. You act the part. Don't act all victim-y.

 
That's fair, it was always your stated intention, but have you noticed that the more RPG elements you add the less fun the game becomes?
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.. for you.

A17 beats A16 and A15 with regards to 'fun' by an exponential factor.

 
Been here since a9 myself, and a17 is the least fun version of this game to date.
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I've been here since A9 too. And I'm liking A17 the best of all the Alphas. A16 was the worst for me.

 
Or digging and crafting stuff that you then sell to the trader (remember Int is good for crafting AND barter). Buy weapon and mods and schematics, some more craft => optimal weapon
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Id view aquiring things from traders as another seperate thing, just because somewant wants to craft dosent mean they want to use traders, i personally never use them.

The issue raised was crafting an item being heavily gated vs finding it in loot/trader. To which you went 'you dont have to craft it, exploit trader instead'.

Edit:

Maybe the last 2 posters coule give actual reasons why they hated 15/16 and love 17 so much. Iv already explained in depth what i dont like about a17 and its not unreasonable nor am i alone in any of it.

Some people dont like the perk system.

Some dont like the POIs.

Some dont like zombies pathing around spikes.

Some dont like having a game as wide as an ocean but as deep as a puddle.

 
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Id view aquiring things from traders as another seperate thing, just because somewant wants to craft dosent mean they want to use traders, i personally never use them.
The issue raised was crafting an item being heavily gated vs finding it in loot/trader. To which you went 'you dont have to craft it, exploit trader instead'.

Edit:

Maybe the last 2 posters coule give actual reasons why they hated 15/16 and love 17 so much. Iv already explained in depth what i dont like about a17 and its not unreasonable nor am i alone in any of it.

Some people dont like the perk system.

Some dont like the POIs.

Some dont like zombies pathing around spikes.

Some dont like having a game as wide as an ocean but as deep as a puddle.
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I've explained why I didn't like A15/A16 already a couple of times I think on this forum/thread. Let me copy-paste.

For me, LBD, or whatever you want to call it, was way less interesting and immersive than the current system.

You played the game, and you were constantly bombarded by messages saying; you reached level 21 with construction tools, you reached level 11 with shotguns. Bland. Boring. If I wanted to play Skyrim's system, I would go ams play skyrim. Most of the time I didnt even bother checking which level I was, or even spending points. Why not you ask? Because the game was too easy. It was snore-fest to the max.

Now, with the new system, i feel like I'm working towards some goals. And looking through the perks and deciding which one to pick is way, way more interesting and immersive than the previous mechanic.

 
I've explained why I didn't like A15/A16 already a couple of times I think on this forum/thread. Let me copy-paste.
For me, LBD, or whatever you want to call it, was way less interesting and immersive than the current system.

You played the game, and you were constantly bombarded by messages saying; you reached level 21 with construction tools, you reached level 11 with shotguns. Bland. Boring. If I wanted to play Skyrim's system, I would go ams play skyrim. Most of the time I didnt even bother checking which level I was, or even spending points. Why not you ask? Because the game was too easy. It was snore-fest to the max.

Now, with the new system, i feel like I'm working towards some goals. And looking through the perks and deciding which one to pick is way, way more interesting and immersive than the previous mechanic.
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Looking trough perks and choosing what to take WAS the previoud mechanic as well, that didnt really change.

Its flat out not more immmersive eaither, immersive typicaly means it mirrors real life (realism). This new system falls vastly shorter in that regard, we went from actually using a skill to get better at it to just pressing a level up button.

The character went from a bunch of exponential curves representing a number of skills to a single XP curve. This blows, give me the deeper more complex system anyday.

As far as more intresting, its the exact same as a16 but with part of it stripped away (LBD)

Id argue that having less skills and a single player level is a hell of a lot more bland and boring.

Difficulty has nothing to do with the perk system being dumber.

This alpha is the easiest to date.

>can take perks that turn survival aspects of the game trivial (food, tempreture, ilness, auto HP recovery)

This is harder? How?

-

Would it be fair to say you want player level and perks to be the primary gameplay element?

A16 was much more of a supporting system, most recipes were found out in the world as loot with a few also being level gated.

You say 'if i wanted to play skyrims leveling system id go play skrim'

I say 'if i wanted to play fallouts leveling system id go play fallout.

 
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Looking trough perks and choosing what to take WAS the previoud mechanic as well, that didnt really change.
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Yeah like I don't understand that argument at all lol. Looking through skills and deciding which to pick, and working toward goals was IN A16 in addition to LBD. Don't get me wrong, A17 is still fun, I just don't get some of you A17 fanboys...

 
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All A16 perk system needed was a harsh diminishing return on LBD or even a temporary debuff to over learning, plus only enough points to max out a few locked perks, everyone can specialize on what they wanted and play whatever it is they deem fun in the game, and we wouldn't have this constant merry go round in the forums.
Unfortunately of late I'm leaning on the critical side of the community. I'm not one who mind A17 took a year, great new vehicles and weapon mods, new poi's bit repetitive but good addition, but I thought we'd be getting more challenging content, instead we got a huge character nerf that added more grind, please note grind not difficulty (albeit getting used to new mechanics was difficult at first):

+ harsher survival

- unlimited water, food everywhere, +- temp to all clothing is really silly, A16 hot and cold was annoying but wearing/taking off clothing made sense.

+ more challenging hunting where we track animals

- they spawn around us and literally walk into our paths, new doe is practically asking for an arrow in the head.

+ added Nightmare run

- they're slower than A16

+ Quests! Yes pls!!

- fetch, clear poi been doing since day1, buried treasure not bad but gets repetitive and the zombie spawn on locating treasure is just silly.

Fallout/skyrim, good games in their own right, gorgeous worlds, stories and quests, but keeping all the mods upto date and working have become a chore. I only have a couple hundred hours in those compared to thousands in 7D pre A17. Popular as they were they're dated games to follow by.

The sub perks under attribute gates was the last straw for me and made no sense when TFP say we can specialize a whole lot more. It's like losing an old friend seeing it drop down in steam library, yesterday, this week, this month.
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I disagree, game difficulty raised a lot. Not only does Steam launch dedicated server instead of the game itself, the performance got worse so it's difficult to get it going properly.

Now in all seriousness, I don't think copy-pasting the old skills tree and putting that all behind a new set of gates is the way to go. Game didn't change and it takes even longer to get the must-have perks.

 
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