🧙 Sorcery Mod - A21.2 Stable LIVE! (v1.94)

[Devrix]

Nah, i just gotta learn to dodge better until i can craft resists or otherwise get my damage mitigation up without just going old school (i like my full lightning armor set too much).

The main problem really is that - especially while spellcast zooming across the land - that fallen instantly perfect aim casts at you. While that is normally fine, if you zoomed past one too fast for you to notice (or for the game to render), they will already have a fireballs/ice darts/lightnings in the air in your direction even though where you stop (zooming) you don't see or is anywhere near that fallen itself. This particular "feature" has gotten me killed quite a few times.

I do think that upon initial agro, they ought to wait a few seconds, then recheck if range is valid, and if it is, then cast. Currently it seems that their projectiles travel longer (and possibly faster?) than they should in these particular scenarios.

In cases where i do fallen tasks and just fail to dodge properly (or am too slow getting my health back up after handling x familiars), it is entirely my own fault and i just need to GIT GUDDER haha.

Oh, while i am writing again... The Spell Light aura. I LOVE IT. This one will be sorely missed next time i play 7dtd without sorcery hahaha. Very addicting

Fallen are undergoing a balance pass for the next update v1.3 (Vehicles and more end of May). Their damage scaling is being cut back.

The Spell Light Rune was one of the first.

Check out Arcane Vision Scroll and Rune, also. You'll like those too.

 

[OndeTv]

That is probably a good idea. The first 20-30 days i had no issues. It took quite a few hits for them to bring me to critical levels of pain (and then it would be my own fault for messing up).

Now however i am on day 59 though, and a full concrete build and most of the base tech down. And fallen annihilate me if i am not careful. Even an unholy bunny can bring me to half or less if i don't time my swings very well. The summoned dogs even more so. The carrion birds seem fine damage wise, but often do not actually target me (maybe that should be looked at).

Check out Arcane Vision Scroll and Rune, also. You'll like those too

I probably SHOULD check those out, and many other scrolls. I have been hoarding things, but not experimenting enough with them as can be seen here:

https://imgur.com/a/upuRP1A

While i remember, i think you have a small bug with immortal seeds. I have 2 spots in my (concrete barred up) roof garden that i can no longer plant anything in. There used to be a fire and ice immortal bush/tree in those two spots. Now, the block just above the "bugged farm plots" act like they are occupied, although there is nothing there. I have already tested replacing the farm plots, which did not make any difference.

Now, after i noticed that they do not have light requirements, i have started my own bedrock essence farm  

Anyway, if you want to try to reproduce the bug i am having with those 2 plot spots, i suggest trying this:

- set up 7x2 grid of farm plots (that was all the plots i had at the time, hadn't found a nitrate vein yet).

- plant a fire one in spot 6,2

- plant an ice one in spot 3,1

- when grown, attemt to harvest them like you would normal 7dtd crops by hitting them

As i did this long ago, my memory is a little fuzzy on it, but as i remember it i got no or little essence doing this, and i did not get the seeds back either. Instead, i got a bugged spot on the block above each farm plot in those 2 spots.

Here is an image for you, taken at what would be spot 7,2 in the aforementioned bug reproduction grid:

https://imgur.com/a/hBl9eed

I have removed those plots after first getting the bug and not finding a fix for it. However, as you can see here, there is an invisible "block" right above them:

https://imgur.com/a/VJ6PzyI

Edit:
Checked out the Arcane Vision scroll. Yeah, that does certainly make avoiding zooming into/past random fallen a lot easier haha, as well as farming bunnies  (i am still a little on the fence on Wisps, they generally seem more effort than they are worth)

Edit 2:

It is possible that i initially attempted to harvest my immortal bushes when they were in bush form, but before the orbs. I just tested the same (on dirt blocks rather than farm plot underground), and it worked just as expected.

So, my i have 3 theories on how the bug initially occured:

- the area was not 3x3 with the seed in the middle, or

- the bushes were harvested before ready, leaving an invisible seed in the farm plot which never regrew, or

- the bushes and farm plots do not play well together perhaps

Also, regardless of which reason above caused the issue, i am guessing the unplantable block is an invisible immortal bush seed is occupying the space.

Hope that helps.

 

[ScubaSteve3465]

I'm ignorant because I called out the micro transaction in your mod and think it's a bad practice? Well I appreciate what you given to this modding community I just wish you wouldn't force users to pay to skip a huge grind that you added. But this is getting a bit out of hand so let's just drop it and move on. 

 

[OndeTv]

you wouldn't force users to pay

C'mon man, noone is forcing you to do anything...

While there are things i do not agree with in the mod (microtransactions is one), it is not my mod and the author is well within his (or her) rights to do what they please with it. However, i am glad that i can play it in the first place. And honestly, now on day 62, apart from being able to make resistance runes (there might be some in the non supporter runes) i haven't missed anything.

On top of that, i have - personally - had the most enjoyable (albeit at times frustrating since i have died A LOT and i don't usually die at all haha) 7dtd play in years. There really has been no grind for me other than 1) what i accidentally forced upon myself for missing something in the starting quest (which i would classify as a bug and i have already pointed, but the developer disagrees and is within their right to do so), and 2) The usual progression in the base game. In other words, if i had been able to make most everything at the start, i probably wouldn't still be playing.

So, in short, let the decide what to do with the mod. We can only suggest changes and point out what we think is bugs or imbalances, not enforce them. Neither should we.

And if we do not like it, noone is forcing us to deal with it in any way.

Have a nice day

Edit:

Just to clarify, personally i find the best and only good way to implement microtransaction driven business, is the model that PoE (Path of Exile) does it - meaning everything paid for is cosmetic or non essential like storage sorting options. However, they (Grinding Gear Games) also has a HUGE playerbase, so it is much easier for them to both implement and keep their business both afloat and profitable this way.

Small indie developers - both software, game and mod makers - usually do not have these kind of options. So, if they want to invest a lot of time and hope for some recompense, they have to figure out alternative ways to do so. Or just dial down how much passion/work they put into their projects to be able to earn a living on the side.

 

[ScubaSteve3465]

Either pay or deal with a huge grind added on purpose to make you more likely to pay to skip the Hassel... Force seems like the right word, but as I said let's drop the issue. I said before I love the work the dev has done I just don't agree with how he decided to implement donation features in the mod but it's his decision. End of story. 

 

[Devrix]

As stated already, Sorcery is 100% free to play. Support is not required for any aspect of the mod. Nor are you required to use the mod. Just like @%$#s, we all have opinions.

 

[ScubaSteve3465]

Yea I never said the mod wasn't free.... Kinda obvious if you go back and read my posts that it had to do with donation items and premium features. But anyway like I said good mod and good luck with it. 

 

[Canute]

@ScubaSteve3465 i would agree with you if these premium features are premium only.

But they arn't, they are just rare to very rare like it should be for a good progress game.

Would you await that the gyrocopter parts are lootable from day 1 from a lvl 1 player ? Basicly the same thing.

Before you get more upset on these "premium features", you just should play it self and decide self if you need these "premium features".

Or does the the gameplay without these "premium features" isn't the better gameplay maybe.

 

[OndeTv]

you just should play it self and decide self if you need these "premium features".

Or does the the gameplay without these "premium features" isn't the better gameplay maybe.

This exactly.

Like i said i've personally had the most enjoyable play in years with this mod, and i even (unintentionally) set myself back in (mod) progress way more than default intended, missing out on initial stuff.

 

[OndeTv]

Fallen are undergoing a balance pass for the next update v1.3 (Vehicles and more end of May). Their damage scaling is being cut back.

While you are at it with the Fallen balance pass, could you adjust their loot bag duration to match the base game bag duration as well?

Currently, unless i intentionally try to "save" the fallen for half-way to near the end of a horde night (which is troublesome due to their ally auras and current high damage scaling), their loot will despawn while normal zombie bags will not. So yeah, unless you have it like this on purpose, it could use an adjustment

 

[Canute]

While you are at it with the Fallen balance pass, could you adjust their loot bag duration to match the base game bag duration as well?

I second that.

Rabbits and fallen which don't convert to a wisp disappear to fast.

And rabbits corpse could have some more HPs. It happen sometimes at the battle heat that i "harverst" the rabbit accidental before i could loot it.

Compare to OndeTv i don't got problems with the fallen damage. Yes they hurt but not that deadly.

Maybe he play on a higher difficult that it is related more.

 

[OndeTv]

Compare to OndeTv i don't got problems with the fallen damage. Yes they hurt but not that deadly.

I play on normal, so probably not. But the difference is most likely that i missed the basement in the starting quest and failed that, so i didn't start on sorcery skills until day 28 and also had to craft all the workbenches myself. So in other words, i am behind in sorcery skills compared to what i should be, and had to compensate by regular leveling (miner 69, loot talents, living off the land, robotics etc).

Lastly i am on day 64/level 48/gamestage 80/1731 kills now. The Fallens damage were fine the first 30ish days. But as days and gamestage has gone up, so has their damage by a large margin (hence the dev making a scaling adjustment later). Of course i do not know which gamestage/day you are at, so maybe this isn't the reason either

 

[OndeTv]

Oh, @Devrix, i just noticed that the spell turrets interfere with normal robotics turrets. Aka placing a spell turret while having a robotics turret down and not having neither full robotics (2 active) nor full spell turrets (also 2 active), will disable the furthest one.

This should probably be in the descriptions for them. Now i wonder though, if i max robotics AND spell turrets, will they stack? - aka 4 active turrets, or will the bonuses stack? I am guessing they won't as they both say 2 active turrets and currently are governed by robotics internally as far as i can see.

Hmm, however, if that is actually the case, then there probably IS a bug, since each element's max talent specifies the type of turrets. So if you have, say, max fire spell turrets and max lightning spell turrets, you would expect to be able to put down 2 of each which as far as i can tell will not be the case?

In other words, maybe a bug, maybe not. But something that ought to be clearly visible on the spell turret talents.

 

[Canute]

Ahh yeah, each element an active turret.

You will be busy to reload the ammo each turrets when a horde/bloodmoon pass through your doorway !

But no you can only have 1 active turret (maybe 2 with full robotic never testd it). And the bonus from robotic don't stack on elemental turrets, i allready tested that and they don't got increased magazin.

My favoured are the familar's, they don't need ammo, the spawn item slowly degrade, they do good damage and a pack of 2 (level 3) can take down a fallen.

Add some extra rune, and the damage increase, silence or drain health/spirit runes are nice for them too.

 

[OndeTv]

Ahh yeah, each element an active turret.

You will be busy to reload the ammo each turrets when a horde/bloodmoon pass through your doorway !

But no you can only have 1 active turret (maybe 2 with full robotic never testd it). And the bonus from robotic don't stack on elemental turrets, i allready tested that and they don't got increased magazin.

Have you tested full turret points in an element though?

My main reason is that i fell in love with the sledgehammer turrets that was added last alpha or the alpha before that (forgot which one). Just like you love the familiars because they don't use ammo, i love the sledgehammers for the same reason. And i usually make a setup in such a way that if they take any damage at all, it is very little. So, super low maintenance.

I have my first familiar (1 point, lightning), and i like it very much as well. While it doesn't take down a fallen (i don't want it to either - at least yet), it takes agro long enough for me to swoop in and loot the blood. Then back out and kill her with gun headshots. I looted a tier 6 pipe machinegun at somepoint and i am using that along with a x2 scope to mob them up fairly quickly. That is still more efficient than my sorcery. As long as there are only 1 of them that is  The Tier 2 quests (3 at once) still kick my butt haha.

Reminds me i have completely forgotten to check if i have/can craft any runes for my familiar. Good call, i need to check that

Edit:

The Storm Totem (lightning sorcery) ought to do the same job as the familiar does, but the agro is... uncertain at best. Sometimes it works on both fallen, their familiars and zombies, other times only on some of them or nothing at all. So i more or less stopped using that spell completely.

 

[Canute]

No i didn't upgrade any turret to 5, since i rarely use them, except to secure the entrance.

And i notice the sledgehammer degrade with A20 alot faster now, so i stoped using them too.

Yep, the storm totems are nice, but the aggro range is pretty low. Sure it increase when you raise the level and you got AoE damage too. But i prefer the familar's since they can move around.

Ok the totem generate aggro, so Z's won't run past them, but Z's would ignore the familars if they don't get attacked.

Did you invest a point into the lightning spellcast, to activate the warp ability ? If not you should do that ! Better then travel potions.

When you like to be a gunner, you should concentrate more at the sorcery tree. Increase the scroll for longer durations. When you concentrate at the elements you don't need any mundane weapons anymore. Ok i use a crossbow too, for sneak kills and can use the looted spell arrow.

 

[OndeTv]

No i didn't upgrade any turret to 5, since i rarely use them, except to secure the entrance.

And i notice the sledgehammer degrade with A20 alot faster now, so i stoped using them too.

I'll try to test that eventually then, unless Devrix can confirm/deny if the total limit is 2 or not.

Regarding sledgehammers, they feel exactly the same to me. I have only lost one, and that was when i tried kiting a feaster up my gauntlet haha. It must have been able to aoe hit it when it got stuck due to its size. Apart from that, they have survived every horde without a scratch, or maybe a hit or two. No degradation from their own hits unlike f ex electric fence etc

Yep, the storm totems are nice, but the aggro range is pretty low

It is weird though, because i have kited things into the storm totems (familiars, bunnies, fallen, zombies), where they have totally ignored it. On the other hand, sometimes they have worked with quite a decent range. I have a feeling that it has to do with the range exactly when they are placed and what is already spawned rather than what is spawning after. But that is just a guess. Either way, i don't like how it works right now.

Did you invest a point into the lightning spellcast, to activate the warp ability ? If not you should do that ! Better then travel potions.

Yes, i did very early. However, i didn't notice the warp until like day 40 or so haha. That said, i have been (ab)using it CONSTANTLY ever since haha. My 2 favorite things in this mod so far is warp and spell light aura :rofl:

The same with the lightning staff actually. When i noticed the warp ability and read closely on the spellcast, i read closely on the staff too. And then i saw the build charges with left, fire nova with right button. Oh my, that one is powerful and fun too haha

When you like to be a gunner, you should concentrate more at the sorcery tree. Increase the scroll for longer durations. When you concentrate at the elements you don't need any mundane weapons anymore. Ok i use a crossbow too, for sneak kills and can use the looted spell arrow.

That's the thing though, i don't actually like to be a gunner. I normally only play melee - usually sledgehammers. This time around though, i have stuck to clubs because i haven't invested in pummel pete, and clubs work just fine because of their speed with no investment other than a little stamina regen from sexual tyranosaurus which you normally get anyway for mining. And i do a LOT of mining. Every night. Usually i end up with bedrock tunnels from my base and all the way to the traders. Almost have the first trader tunnel done in my current game too haha.

Bow and crossbow i always use for sneak kills as well. Especially early game for meat before i have a vegetable stew farm up. And i never invest points into them, because the random book perks are enough for what i use them for. I do use them during horde nights too, but that's because of my gauntlet builds, so headshots with them are very efficient even without investment.

I used to love pitfall builds, but when TFP nerfed fall damage back in hmm A17 i think? Then I started to favor other build types. Also, a pitfall build would probably be very dangerous with fallen  But yeah, anyway, i am very close to having enough points invested into my base abilities after which i will concentrate everything into sorcery and see what it can really do  Just a few more levels (max robotics) and i'm done.

Weirdly enough, i have scavenged more than i usually do, and also found 2 traders in my RWG map as well. But i have yet to find a crucible, a generator bank or solar cell bank. So no steel or power for me yet in my current game. Edit: I take that back lol, one of the traders had a generator bank, day 70 haha... Quite late, but better late than never  Edit 2: And a battery bank schematic in the POI i did right after hahahahaha... The irony lol.

 

[OndeTv]

Oh yeah, @Devrix, while i remember... Is it intentional that fallen can fire directional spells at you when they are turned the other way?

Apart from it looking extremely silly when lightning/ice shards/fireballs comes out of the back of a Fallen, it also feels weird and limit tactics. At least that is how i feel. As a comparison, i do not remember ever seeing a cop being able to barf in your direction unless he is facing your way.

Edit:

I take that back. I just had a cop barf at me through his back. Must be something new in A20, so TFP's fault 

 

[OndeTv]

Just a little followup to the previous post on zombie cops (and by proxy, Fallen) being able to shoot opposite their facing direction. I made a bug report on the base game for this behaviour, and it has been confirmed:

 

[yurita]

I have a question. Will runes deteriorate and break?