PC Soooo, now that we have power attack....

Would think you'd be out of stamina before then. I guess it is then? Ugh. I still don't know how people play on insane, and then complain it's too easy to boot. Not hating, more envious. OTOH, as I said elsewhere, I find bulletsponges add more tedium than difficulty, and when a game gets tedious my level of give a ♥♥♥♥ drops, and then I am more prone to make mistakes, and that is what gets me killed more often than not - so that being the biggest danger, I would literaly be bored to death on insane.
I went all in melee 1st A17 attempt, looked at all the perks costs though, and decided since I'd rather go gun at higher level anyway (kinda got my fill of melee from DL) to go bow spec. I admit melee is still very viable for me, even with my only relevant leveled perk being strength. Still getting proper A17 timing down with the sledge, but almost there. Bones now too precious a commodity to be wasting my shiv on zeds these days!

Interesting with the aggro. Since I never could manage a sneak melee headshot in A16 I haven't tried it in A17.
Click to expand...
With the right perks stamina isn't a problem even with heavy melee. I'm not particularly fond of bullet sponge but it adds some challenge and without it there would be no need to upgrade to better weapons, day1 wooden bow and club would be enough which would be stupid.

There's not much TFP can do that won't piss ppl off. Bullet sponges have been in video games for as long as i can remember. Not defending bullet sponging. But they add animals, ppl are pissed they die to wolves and dogs. Ppl want more challenge, other ppl are pissed zombies dig. They make their game easily moddable to please everyone, some are disgusted they have to get their hands dirty changing a few lines of code. Coming here can be a vicious cycle, but I want to know the latest news of 7days and I can't help myself and get roped into it, have to give credit to the moderators doing this every day, they're made of stern stuff.

Sneak needs a lot of love, right now it's very unbalanced. U try to walk over a coffee table or sth 1 block high, make that big landing sound and wake a whole load of zombies. It doesn't matter how careful/good u play level gate says no u can't be quiet. NVG isn't working yet so you're left with mining helmet which wakes zombies. The final sneak perk comes way too late, by then you'll be strong enough to face zombies head on. Don't really recommend the sneak build atm, besides whacking zombies with sledge is satisfying, they've really nailed the weight and feel, plus the flying rag doll animations, good times.

 
So I was the one the mentioned light (non-power) attacks cost no stamina. Not that I suggested it to be taken draconian in implementation, but rather to ignite the exploration of other ideas.

Anyways... Basically the combat system can easily flowcharted along with the stamina economy. While the no-cost stamina light attack may seem overpowered, if stamina has a reliable on constant regeneration than it's effectively free anyways. Then it's a balancing of DPS between power attacks and light attacks so that one isn't overall more powerful than the other. One way to look at that is to make sure that power-attacks on the short term do more DPS than light ones, but light attacks still provide near better DPS overall.

An example: Let's say Light Attacks have the following stats (0 stamina cost, 25 damage, 12 RPM/Animation Takes 5secs) so in 1min a player can swing 12 times for a max damage of 300. A power attack could then be (33% Stamina, 100 Damage, 12 RPM/Same Attack Speed) and as long as the stamina refreshes fully after a minute then the balanced in that regards. Keep in mind these are just placeholder numbers, but rather the relationship between the two is what matters. Once the right relationship between the two is established, enemy health is then measured against for the ideal maximum kills/min that developer feels right. In the above example, a normal zombie could have 100 health meaning 3 kills / min using Light or Power attacks, but using power attacks trades short term gain (3 kills/15sec) for a vulnerability of no stamina. Or the player could use a combination of power attacks and light attacks (2 power attacks followed by a series of light ones) to reduce the risk but increase the short term DPS.

Granted this is for only melee combat as ranged combat has an entirely different economy and feel to it. Generally ranged combat doesn't offer a choice of what attack to do but rather a choice where to attack. Additionally the cost of attacks is measured in ammo and not stamina. So a ranged player would have a pool of ammo and a choice of small - highly vulnerable spot (equivalent to a power attack), and non-location dependent attack (light attack). Either the player risks missing shots on the weak spot, or they play safe and attack the larger target. Then the damage numbers get balanced between the two location (the smaller the critical spot is the larger ratio is between the two), followed by making sure the attack speed and DPS is line with the ideal maximum kills / min. and finally a comparison with melee combat to account for the increased risk close combat has over ranged. Of course that increased risk can be mitigated via other ways, to account for varying playstyles (ie. Melee could have AoE effects to support players that rush into the thick of enemies swinging wildly. Or Power attacks could stun allowing for a series of no-risk light attacks). In any case, the system can be easily done... perfecting it harder... but the game industry has been doing conflict resolution systems for close 50 years now, so really Fun Pimps don't need to reinvent the wheel. Just adapt an existing system and work out the kinks.

 
It's funny isn't it? Most streamers (no names, hah ha) of this game actually suck at it big time. Especially in the areas of general combat and progression efficiency. I stopped watching most of them some time ago because I was just ending up shouting "you idiot!" at the screen so often that my children thought I had lost it.
I vividly remember the weekend when streamers got A17 before we all did. I certainly watched a lot of them that weekend as I was dying to play the new build. I came away with the impression that A17 was rock solid HARD. I mean way harder than A16, right?....streamers were like "I am actually dying, and I never die!". I was actually scared going into A17 when I finally got it, even cranked the difficulty way down to 1 to begin with. What a joke. I later realized the streamers just generally sucked at combat.
Click to expand...
Saddest part of it all is Pimps sometime LISTEN to those streamers as if they are providing actual feedback as it pertains to the overall game and not as it applies to their action oriented play style.

 
Once a stable version comes out I'm modding in a whole set of tools/weapons that ignore power attack.

They are all going to resemble what was in A16.

It's not that I want more resources, I want the perception that I'm doing something.

Hitting once per two seconds is boring.

Hitting every second, even if it gives the same resources, is more fun.

I feel like I'm making progress.

 
Saddest part of it all is Pimps sometime LISTEN to those streamers as if they are providing actual feedback as it pertains to the overall game and not as it applies to their action oriented play style.
Click to expand...
Oh C'mon Jax. Surely you don't think such a wide blanket statement like that is at all valid right? So all streamers have this "action oriented play style" and none of their feedback is valid? Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed RH for a long time but methinks you're head is growing a bit too large here.

 
Saddest part of it all is Pimps sometime LISTEN to those streamers as if they are providing actual feedback as it pertains to the overall game and not as it applies to their action oriented play style.
Click to expand...
I should think TFP would want to take input from as many sources as they can.

Just about all would have some value, whether big or small.

Even yours.

 
Basically, TFP just added a weaker attack to the game that is useless. All the perks boost heavy attack anyway.

And the best melee weapon is an iron pick. Fastest power attack and decent damage.

The regular attack is good for harvesting :D

 
Is power attack actually power attack if you take away light attack? Doesn't it just become the new light attack?

 
I'll try the speedhammer by skilling into the flurry and swinging dat sledge like a Flash Runs: way too fast

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top