PC So this is where roland said to go to gripe about a17 and the early release...

Sadly, once we have bought a game we are no longer considered customers. Many of the game developers, and specifically the larger companies sees people that have already bought the game as trash (again i am aiming more at activision, ea, ubisoft than TFF here). The only thing that matters is new customers, sales. I don`t think 7dtd will loose many players because alpha 17 looks so good, but i don`t think they will get many sales from the stream event either. They will get a increase in sales because that always happens when a game has a big update + the game is on sale now, and will most likely have a steam sale next week. The problem is TFP will contribute the increase in sales to the stream event and not the natural flow of: Big game update-more interest-more sales
According to Steam spy the twitch numbers from least weekend was at the highest 4592 and this weekends highest was 7235. So the stream event has not been very successfull
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Not quite sure why you would bring up your perception of other companies if you were not directing them at TFPs.....

 
Not quite sure why you would bring up your perception of other companies if you were not directing them at TFPs.....
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It is just the way gaming industry is going. I am not mainly making the point at TFP, but stream team aiming for new customers is steps in that direction. It is also commenting on other comments about TFP caring more about new customers than exisisting players

 
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I'm really sorry all. I'm new to the forum. Just trying to find out when the A17 official release date is.

Note: I don't care how they market the game. I hope everyone and their mom gives funpimps their money. They seem like a good team of people and I want to support them. I've already bought 5 copies of this game for me and my crew to enjoy. Thought it was amazing when Neebs gaming started streaming it.

Also, I noticed some mod creators in here. Seriously, hats off to you all! I poked around to try and make adjustments and what a tedious nightmare it is.

 
So how did it play out, who was the streamer to reign king?

vSvSpUl.jpg


How did that 5000 min subs work out?

 
I am retiring from throwing wood into the fire as i have been pleased with the answers to my questions. Going to watch games4kicks before bedtime and prepare for tomorrows release. A patch before release tomorrow and the game will be pretty smooth for experimental. Happy zombie bashing to everyone.

 
Bonsoir à tous,
Alors je tiens à faire part de mon avis ( Partager par beaucoup de monde ) depuis vendredi des "Streameur" on droit de jouer à l'alpha 17, au départ il y avait 3 français, ce que je vois maintenant sait qu'eux ont donné l'astuce ou la cle ou je ne sais pas quoi, mais du coup tous les amis, familles, ...( et je sais en plus qu'il donne aux gens qui font des dons assez conséquents en leur demandant de ne pas jouer en ligne !) y joue et NOUS ? oui on doit attendre lundi, ... POURQUOI ? pour des streameur avec 20 VU ! qui sait à peine de quoi y parle, qui sont hypocrites et qui ne répondent qu'aux personnes qui sont abonne à leur chaine !

Cher Monsieur les développeurs, ça n'est pas la bonne façon de faire ! vous avez juste réussi à perdre pas mal de joueurs qui du coup on décide d'acheter un autre jeu étant très déçu du comportement des devs! moi et mes amis allons faire de même !

Vraiment déçu !

Good evening to all,

Then I am anxious to announce my opinion(notice) ("Streameur" one straight ahead Share by a lot of people) since Friday to play the alpha 17, at first there was 3 French, what I see now knows that they gave the trick(cleverness) or the key or I do not know what, but of the blow all the friends, the families, (and I know in more that he(it) gives to people who make rather consequent gifts(donations) by asking them not to play on-line!) plays it and WE? Yes we have to wait on Monday... WHY? For streameur with 20 SEEN! Which(who) knows hardly about what speak there, which(who) are hypocritical and who answer only the people who are subscribe to their chain(channel)!

Dear Sir developers, that is not the right way to make! You just managed to lose quite a lot of players who of the blow we decide to buy another game(set,play) being very disappointed by the behavior of devs! I and my friends are going to do the same!

Really disappointed!
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So basically there is a French streamer who is selling the beta access code, nice.

I'm to repeat what I posted in another thread.

Stream event was/is too long, should give it to them 24hrs before public release.

3 days is too long a tease, twitch viewers dropped off hard after the first 12/24 hrs.

And also seeing all their friends playing multiplayer that didn't qualify as per the criteria, and other streamers streaming it that were not on the list, and many putting clickbait 'a17 hype' etc in their titles whilst streaming a16.4 was/is very irking.

 
Haha nailed it! That's the tone of this whole event, just like the blizzcon announcement.
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It's nothing like Blizzcon.

Terrible comparison.

The Streaming idea was to give us a glance at A17.

That's what people wanted. A sneak peak.

Well we go it.... and the impatient are .... being impatient. [surprise,surprise]

I think the Streaming event was a success.

It did what it was intended to do:

- Showcase A17

- Give players some answers and new questions

- Heighten anticipation and excitement

- Get people talking about 7DTD

Maybe the numbers on that graph don't look like what some people expected but it doesn't really take into account all the posts on social media.

I'm glad they did it personally because it's given me a chance to formulate plans on how to deal with the new AI.

Glad I don't have to go into it "cold".

 
I just hope that the streamers and youtube guys that did pathetic jobs of streaming or miniscule amounts over the weekend, or like some that I could mention, did absolutely jack all, lose any future right to get and kind of early access...
If they decide to do this early access streaming in the future, which imho I don't think they should, then the least they could do is give it to people who have a vested interest in, and play the game rather than a financial one, that are actually gonna make good use of this priviledge.

There are a lot of people out there playing A17 already that arent streaming it purely on the basis that they got a code from a streamer friend with over 5k viewers, that to me is the real injustice here.
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It is indeed. Khaine is my friend so I hold no ill will to him, but its an absolute mockery of any argument posted here that its "for the streamers" when I am told "well he had a streamer friend who gave him access sorry man".

F That. It is 100 percent unfair to all of us. If you DIDNT stream you should NOT have access, bottom line. This means my goal for next year is to find a streamer with the sole purpose of getting an early copy because I have NO expectations to have to be a streamer to get one.

What about modders who do not use a streamer for access? Or what about normal players who don't even have access to communicate with a big streamer? To heck with them? That's a great message to send.

I was totally ok with all this streamer stuff, I even embraced it after initially being against it.

Am I salty? G-Damn right I am. I busted my A$# promoting this game through keeping interest in a full year of drought in content. Not only myself but all the other smaller modders too. They have 100 percent right to be salty as well. And our thanks for that is getting to come here and read about other modders getting to test and edit their mods on it because they know somebody?

The PUBLIC has every right to be salty. This wasn't a streamer exclusive event. This was a "It pays to know people in high places" event.

And before I get the whole "you will get it on Monday it's only 3 days" line well if it truly WAS only about it being three days then you shouldn't have a problem giving more people access, since they got it ANYWAY.

 
I really don't give a rats arse about losing a few days to pre-release streamers (or even friends of friends), but my recommendation for TFP is to suspend this approach entirely with future alphas or completely revamp how they handle things (presumably a much more closed circle is in order), since it seems to have generated a great deal of animosity. Needless drama, TBH.

 
It's nothing like Blizzcon.Terrible comparison.

The Streaming idea was to give us a glance at A17.

That's what people wanted. A sneak peak.

Well we go it.... and the impatient are .... being impatient. [surprise,surprise]
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And i was 100 percent behind that theory until apparently the weekend was a free for all for anyone smart enough to buddy up to a streamer. And NOT even be required to stream with them. I'm totally cool with preview weekends but the rule for it have to be fair to EVERYONE not just the select few.

 
I really don't give a rats arse about losing a few days to pre-release streamers (or even friends of friends), but my recommendation for TFP is to suspend this approach entirely with future alphas or completely revamp how they handle things (presumably a much more closed circle is in order), since it seems to have generated a great deal of animosity. Needless drama, TBH.
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I agree with your sentiment. I didnt care either. But when you are 100 percent on the outside looking in it begins to matter. Allowing modders access was an argument that was shot down because we were told we would get it like everyone else would when it was released. Which I was cool with.

Until it was obvious you didn't even HAVE to be a streamer to get it. Not only does this insult other modders, it insults all the streamers who applied and were turned down because of low viewership. Streamers who stream 7 days every single day and got completely ignored due to viewer count. The message here is clear. Befriend a streamer with high view counts. Screw the kickstarters, screw the people who LOSE viewers because they ONLY play 7 Days when content takes a year plus. But reward people with high numbers, some of whom have NO idea how to pay your game and their ONLY interest is in getting a sneak peek under their belts for viewers.

 
As somebody who really like the stream-weekend-event and totally understand for what it stands for hope that TFP are doing different when it comes to another stream event.

But you only can do something better when you see what went wrong and it will be not the same next time what I think.

Hopefully.

 
And i was 100 percent behind that theory until apparently the weekend was a free for all for anyone smart enough to buddy up to a streamer. And NOT even be required to stream with them. I'm totally cool with preview weekends but the rule for it have to be fair to EVERYONE not just the select few.
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Yeah this is the REAL problem here.

A handful of Streamers getting the game early?

Yup that's fine.

Those Streamers giving it to their friends?

Absolutely not.

That's what's got me upset now.

That's elitism and I CAN'T STAND elitism.

It's unjust.

So now I'm on the other side of the fence.

Streamers should have had to sign some kind of agreement before hand.

I'd like to see some kind of apology at this point from TFP for this oversight.

It's not the Streamers' fault. OF COURSE they are going to share with friends.

What about those who didn't get "in" with TFP but are trying to promote their own channel?

They lost revenue/subscribers/publicity in a sense didn't they?

Yet some folks who just happen to know a Streamer get the advantage?

COME ON!

 
I agree with what you are saying Jax.

But they had a list of over 100 streamers, who could give the code to their buddies to play with them, so now you have at least 500 unvetted people, I suspected this would happen, did the pimps know this would happen, I think so.

Could they do anything to prevent it? Probably not.

Could they mitigate the effect? Most certainly, keeping the streaming period relatively short would reduce the problem.

Give it to the streamers Sunday morning, release to public Monday afternoon.

 
Yeah this is the REAL problem here.

What about those who didn't get "in" with TFP but are trying to promote their own channel?

They lost revenue/subscribers/publicity in a sense didn't they?

Yet some folks who just happen to know a Streamer get the advantage?

COME ON!
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Exactly this. I can name 4 people right now, Streamers who the majority of their content IS 7 Days on a daily basis. They play Vanilla, they play mods. They LOVE the game. And all 4 were told no. Yet Joe Blow who plays Fortnite with Streamer A gets to play it off stream.

Some streamers also spent their time being very negative about the update. Not a lot but 2 that I checked out had nothing good to say about the changes. THAT is the kind of publicity you bought. Meanwhile other streamers out there are praising it and what they have seen and these people were told they were not popular enough.

This affects more than modders. Sure a lot of people don't care. That's fine, but there are some who do and they shouldn't be waved off to silence because it doesn't fit the company line.

You cant say "sorry guys but this is what we are doing and only these people can have it" and then have it turn out that there was no REAL selective process and a bunch of people got it. It is one or the other. Either ONLY allow the actual streamer to get it "like last year" or just give it to everyone. Because at this point modders, non modders, wives, cousins etc are all have access while the gatekeepers are still trying to tell us to move along, nothing to see here.

 
I also agree with your issues Jax.

I completely support the idea behind the streamer event. But perhaps it should be for the streamers only and not also opened up to their friends.

With the a16 stream team, the number of streamers was very small and therefore much less likely to be abused.

Opening up the event like they did this time seems both reasonable and smart. However, with that many streamers, maintaining control of how they use their access once you also allow them to give "friends" access to play with them is impossible.

While I am sure TFP neither anticipated nor agreed with streamers selling early access or giving access to people they are not actually playing with on stream during the event, in hindsight it is not surprising.

While clearly some streamers abused their access, I still think targeting variety streamers who rarely or never stream 7DTD is a smart move. I just feel that in future events, access to the streamers only would be a better move.

 
I agree with your sentiment. I didnt care either. But when you are 100 percent on the outside looking in it begins to matter. Allowing modders access was an argument that was shot down because we were told we would get it like everyone else would when it was released. Which I was cool with.
Until it was obvious you didn't even HAVE to be a streamer to get it. Not only does this insult other modders, it insults all the streamers who applied and were turned down because of low viewership. Streamers who stream 7 days every single day and got completely ignored due to viewer count. The message here is clear. Befriend a streamer with high view counts. Screw the kickstarters, screw the people who LOSE viewers because they ONLY play 7 Days when content takes a year plus. But reward people with high numbers, some of whom have NO idea how to pay your game and their ONLY interest is in getting a sneak peek under their belts for viewers.
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I'm not a modder, but I play 7DTD mods extensively. I'm a bit uneasy about how some of the leadership occasionally appears to take modders for granted. While it's probably a lesser issue at the moment, the long-term health of survival and RPG games is heavily dependent upon the existence of a happy, healthy modding community. Games like Skyrim, FONV, and of course, Minecraft, would have only seen a fraction of their success without the existence of mods that tailor the experience of the games to varying player interests and permit significant replayability beyond that of the base game.

 
It's nothing like Blizzcon.Terrible comparison.
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Nope, it's almost dead-on. Lemme remind you. Blizzard made the announcement to a roomful of fanboys about the game they loved, with the smug expectation that everyone would be happy to hear that the game wasn't actually for them, they'd have to wait much longer for Diablo 4 on PC, but in the meantime they should be really happy to play a cheap knockoff on their phones.

"Is this an off-season April fool's joke?" One fan asked, to great applause, because he was speaking for the vast majority in the room. The developer seemed genuinely surprised at the perfectly normal reaction from the audience, and so he asked, mockingly, 'Don't you all have phones?".... seeming much like a very old and similarly tone-deaf quote about why don't poor people just eat cake when they're hungry and there's no bread?

So we should all be happy some 'special' people get to play before us, and we should even go watch them and be grateful. But no, instead we got 19 pages of people expressing their dissatisfaction. That's what really happens. And someone made a great point about how even the people who do see it on a stream and want to buy it, can't, at least not the game they saw on stream. Not yet. That's why it should have been made available to everyone at once, and then everyone would be happy, with zero ill-will generated among the fans. I hope they learn from this and don't repeat this fiasco on the next release some years from now.

 
Nope, it's almost dead-on. Lemme remind you. Blizzard made the announcement to a roomful of fanboys about the game they loved, with the smug expectation that everyone would be happy to hear that the game wasn't actually for them, they'd have to wait much longer for Diablo 4 on PC, but in the meantime they should be really happy to play a cheap knockoff on their phones."Is this an off-season April fool's joke?" One fan asked, to great applause, because he was speaking for the vast majority in the room. The developer seemed genuinely surprised at the perfectly normal reaction from the audience, and so he asked, mockingly, 'Don't you all have phones?".... seeming much like a very old and similarly tone-deaf quote about why don't poor people just eat cake when they're hungry and there's no bread?

So we should all be happy some 'special' people get to play before us, and we should even go watch them and be grateful. But no, instead we got 19 pages of people expressing their dissatisfaction. That's what really happens. And someone made a great point about how even the people who do see it on a stream and want to buy it, can't, at least not the game they saw on stream. Not yet. That's why it should have been made available to everyone at once, and then everyone would be happy, with zero ill-will generated among the fans. I hope they learn from this and don't repeat this fiasco on the next release some years from now.
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While I may not completely agree with you....

..I'll concede you make a very strong argument.

[with regard to when it should have been released, that is]

Not sure I want to debate the whole Blizzcon thing here and hijack a thread but I'd be open to discussing it in another thread.

Sounds like you got a good head on your shoulders.

 
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