So far 2.0 is bad

What do you mean? Sure, the game is very easy even at its highest difficulty, but zombies still eat bullets.
Exactly that. The higher difficulties, the zeds just eat more bullets. Which makes the challenge about obtaining said bullets; if the game just gives them for free, did anything actually change?

It's not a great change, but it's the only one offered by that difficulty slider.
 
Exactly that. The higher difficulties, the zeds just eat more bullets. Which makes the challenge about obtaining said bullets; if the game just gives them for free, did anything actually change?

It's not a great change, but it's the only one offered by that difficulty slider.
I think the bullet rewards are good,crafting more ammo is still a challenge because you can never have enough,I keep having to break doors and radiators to craft more despite the rewards,yesterday I had to kill an entire neighborhood in the snowy biome just to loot a crack a book,it was fun.
 
Exactly that. The higher difficulties, the zeds just eat more bullets. Which makes the challenge about obtaining said bullets; if the game just gives them for free, did anything actually change?

It's not a great change, but it's the only one offered by that difficulty slider.

People wanting more of a challenge can always play with the headshots-only mod. 🤷‍♂️ It's a not a perfect solution, but it definitely gives you more of a Romero-type experience.

I kinda wish TFP would borrow some ideas from other games in the genre. Take the Smoker from L4D, for example. Doesn't have a lot of hitpoints and doesn't directly do a huge amount of damage, but its tongue attack makes it a lot easier for other zombies to ruin your day.

Like, it is possible to make combat challenging without turning everything into bullet sponges.

On the subject of Infestation rewards, it would be nice if POI designers could flag rewards (extra chests and such) as Infested-only spawns, just like the Infested lootbox.
 
Like, it is possible to make combat challenging without turning everything into bullet sponges.
It is, absolutely; but with the engine having been what it has been, I'm not surprised this is what we have. And I don't really blame TFP for it, it was a novel challenge, the type of world they went for; getting it to work flawlessly for entertainingly difficult combat is Hard.
 
Like, it is possible to make combat challenging without turning everything into bullet sponges.
New attacks/patterns but that would require time and based on how long it took us to get storms, smoothies and color swapped zombies I don't think it's in the cards.
 
People wanting more of a challenge can always play with the headshots-only mod. 🤷‍♂️ It's a not a perfect solution, but it definitely gives you more of a Romero-type experience.

I kinda wish TFP would borrow some ideas from other games in the genre. Take the Smoker from L4D, for example. Doesn't have a lot of hitpoints and doesn't directly do a huge amount of damage, but its tongue attack makes it a lot easier for other zombies to ruin your day.

Like, it is possible to make combat challenging without turning everything into bullet sponges.

On the subject of Infestation rewards, it would be nice if POI designers could flag rewards (extra chests and such) as Infested-only spawns, just like the Infested lootbox.
I would prefer more zombies but less bullet sponges,but here comes into play the problem of performance,the new zombies although I am not a big fan of the yeti modeling add something new and different,they are not hard to kill but they are dangerous.
 
I still don´t understand why the sledgehammer needed a book. It was already the strongest melee weapon. Who the F buffs the strongest weapon in a game? And yes i know it eats a lot of stamina very early in game.

But look at the baton during very early game. It sucks, it doesn´t take as much stamina but the damage is very low you actually need more stamina to kill a Z than with a stone sledge on day one i guess. It will get a lot better once you get turrets than it´s acutally OP af. But the sledge is also OP later in game not as much as a good INT build, but still enough that it doesn´t need a book series.

The pipe baton is so bad that even if i aim for an INT build i use the wooden club without skillins early game because it´s better than a pipe baton with 1 skill point spent.
Why you complaining that it got a perk book series? It was the only weapon that never got one. AND you’re seriously joshing me that you think it was the best especially before the update. The sledgehammer finally feels like it’s one equal footing at least with the other melees. I maintain the spear is stupid as long you have a singular wall next to you and when are you ever not going to? Literally line them up and get the slow down and you can take your time with all the zombies.
 
AND you’re seriously joshing me that you think it was the best especially before the update.
That's a question of playstyle. Insane/nightmare players seem to prefer Sledges for their massive single hit damage. Highest decap chance, and if you use the 5-sec pain mechanic, improved attack speed doesn't help, so the slower the better.

It absolute Was the best tool for that, obviously. Now it's just better all around.
 
That's a question of playstyle. Insane/nightmare players seem to prefer Sledges for their massive single hit damage. Highest decap chance, and if you use the 5-sec pain mechanic, improved attack speed doesn't help, so the slower the better.

It absolute Was the best tool for that, obviously. Now it's just better all around.
No it really wasn’t at least before the update and you are deluding yourself to an absurd degree if you think that. I love the sledge but you, you’ve some kind of hate ■■■■■ for it? What’s wrong with something being good? It’s not like it invalidates the other melees so what’s the problem? I maintain that the sledge is finally on par with the other melees and also you know for a fact that it has the highest decap chance? Higher than the machete? Can you cite where in the xml’s it specifically says this?
 
I maintain that the sledge is finally on par with the other melees and also you know for a fact that it has the highest decap chance? Higher than the machete? Can you cite where in the xml’s it specifically says this?

  • machete - 1 (item passive) + 0.45 (maxed chance from agility attribute) = 1.45
  • Steel sledgehammer - 0.1 (item passive) + 0.3 (item power attack) + 0.45 (maxed chance from strength attribute) + 0.5 (strength mastery) = 1.35

Machete is still higher than the sledgehammer, but not by much anymore. Though machete is still higher on all body parts other than the head compared to the sledgehammer (strength mastery only applies to head area so 1.45 vs 0.85)
 
I love the sledge but you, you’ve some kind of hate ■■■■■ for it?
What? It was the best _per swing damage_ before and after. If you play around the "5 sec rule", that's all you'll care about.

What's the problem in making the best weapon in game even better in comparison? I never claimed there was a problem, I told you the specific setting where it already was the best, still is. The highest difficulty, when aiming for not getting hit.

Machete is still higher than the sledgehammer, but not by much anymore.
Does that take into account damage per swing as a factor?
 
Does that take into account damage per swing as a factor?

That is per swing for dismemberment chance. Calculating the damage per swing would take a lot more time and patience on my part to pull the vanilla numbers and get them in the right order.
 
What? It was the best _per swing damage_ before and after. If you play around the "5 sec rule", that's all you'll care about.

What's the problem in making the best weapon in game even better in comparison? I never claimed there was a problem, I told you the specific setting where it already was the best, still is. The highest difficulty, when aiming for not getting hit.


Does that take into account damage per swing as a factor?
Oh my god just because it had the best damage per one swing didn’t even make it get close to having the best dps of any melee weapon. And it lacked sustainability on account of the stamina. And I did test this multiple times on a zombie bear, something that couldn’t be dismembered and the steel club and steel spear both out classed the sledge in dps. They had a way lower time to kill that bear and yes I tried to equalize the health values.

This much has not changed in 2.0 because the sledge didn’t get damage buffs, just dismemberment and better crowd control and finally a way to refill stamina.

But no it was not the best before. Literally it could not compete because the stamina back from kills did not make up for the stamina expended for the absurd amount of swings it would take to kill.

You’re ranking based on purely damage alone which is just such a basic way to evaluate things and even now after the update I find your “analysis” to be basic.

It’s the equivalent of saying “GANONDORF is the best character in any smash game because he has the highest damage for so many of his moves” which is an objectively wrong take
 
  • machete - 1 (item passive) + 0.45 (maxed chance from agility attribute) = 1.45
  • Steel sledgehammer - 0.1 (item passive) + 0.3 (item power attack) + 0.45 (maxed chance from strength attribute) + 0.5 (strength mastery) = 1.35

Machete is still higher than the sledgehammer, but not by much anymore. Though machete is still higher on all body parts other than the head compared to the sledgehammer (strength mastery only applies to head area so 1.45 vs 0.85)
Thank you I was just about to go into the xml’s and check for myself ☺️
 
Could you read what I said, and argue something related to that?
I literally did, what you on about? It was not the best, and saying that it was the best based on the damage of a single swing holds no weight here because they didn’t buff the damage in 2.0. And again you keep trying to tell me it was the best on insane/ nightmare when it also wasn’t because it lacked sustainability. You would be wailing on a rad biker forever and gas yourself.

I thought it was obvious to everyone what the best melee weapon was but no you gotta make me say it I guess. The best melee weapon in the game hands down was the stun baton.

Because it exceeds at being a generalist weapon, it can do everything and anything in more situations that the sledge could pre-2.0 and even now with intellect mastery and nerd tats it’s gotten even more obscene.

But it had crowd control, a 10 percent chance to kill anything and you didn’t even have to aim with it because it could proc this off glancing blows. It takes little stamina to swing, it has its own candy that makes it shock an entire crowd, you can hit right click with absolute certainty that everyone would get off you. So it had the kill power, the crowd control, the sustainability, ease of use. You want to know what people call that? When something is really strong and stupid easy? It’s called broken.

But no one complains about the stun baton, no no player like you just want to harp on the sledgehammer based on one factor.

It’s still not the best, it’s better yes but no it still goes to the stun baton, again you don’t even have to aim with it at all and the instant death chance doesn’t give one ■■■■ about the strength of the zombie or the difficulty with the former actually affecting decap chance
 
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