PC So eager for A18e! No more juice for A17, knowing what's coming.

And I see that as the exact problem.
There is so much random experimentation, random out of nowhere redoing of the stuff that doesn't really need to be redone yet that there is no foreseeable future for beta or day I say it, release. Unfocused development with no keystone goals leads to endless development, which then leads to complete burnout of playerbase, which is currently a problem for the game in my eyes and I don't think I'm the only one, I'm simply agitated enough by that, that I've decided to be more and more vocal about it.

I'm up to date with what Madmole says, but Madmole says and Madmole does are 2 completely different things, like the "no longer 1 year long wait for new alpha" which seems less and less likely as we're on a standard schedule of releasing one alpha, then patching it for half a year and then taking another half a year for development of new one. Its been 7 years now, how many more will take to finally settle on BASIC systems that'll allow them to do implement anything into the game in a time frame that isn't being counted by the candles on the birthday cake? Come on!

Addressing previous post, I sure do not regret playing the game previously and starting over when it felt like a new game every single time, but that feeling is gone now, after 7 years, I simply want something persistent, I don't want to nuke my world every single time Madmole decides that glass pane should have horizontal crack instead of vertical, because that REALLY do sucks soul out of me and my friends I play with. After all, the game is NOT rogue-like and starting over and over without being able to literally built something meaningful is now dishearting, when me and my friends no longer have the time to play as we used to in the past.

Having to start over after every singular even smallest update is my biggest and pretty much only gripe.

And that comes from a massive, but bitter fan. I love the game, I really do, but its going nowhere. Once the kickstarter roadmap was pretty much filled, the development literally jumped on a horse and YEE-HAAA'd to the wild wild west in search of mystical El-Dorado.
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If u just want something persistent, stay on your favorite version, no one is force feeding u a new alpha.

 
Yep having a break too. Playing the new Ark map atm and loving it lol.

I had a nice play through in exp, 17.2 and i had another long game in 17.4 where i tried out the farming mod which was fun.

Been checking back every now and again. But yeah am done with 17

 
I think it completely normal to fall away from an Alpha when the next one is getting close.

I'm eagerly awaiting Alpha 18. :-)

 
I spit out my A17 juice as soon as I tasted it. Kept trying each new flavor(17.1,17.2 so on). Finally, with WotW mod, I'm kinda enjoying it.

 
I have enjoyed Roland's Oxp mod the most so far. I miss LBD (insert beating dead horse gif) and do not like the RPG on rails system they have implemented. I may just go back to 12.5 where I started and raid the hub. Right now setting up shop in the middle of the biggest city you can find on day 1 doesn't feel all that immersive.

 
And I see that as the exact problem.
There is so much random experimentation, random out of nowhere redoing of the stuff that doesn't really need to be redone yet that there is no foreseeable future for beta or day I say it, release. Unfocused development with no keystone goals leads to endless development, which then leads to complete burnout of playerbase, which is currently a problem for the game in my eyes and I don't think I'm the only one, I'm simply agitated enough by that, that I've decided to be more and more vocal about it.

I'm up to date with what Madmole says, but Madmole says and Madmole does are 2 completely different things, like the "no longer 1 year long wait for new alpha" which seems less and less likely as we're on a standard schedule of releasing one alpha, then patching it for half a year and then taking another half a year for development of new one. Its been 7 years now, how many more will take to finally settle on BASIC systems that'll allow them to do implement anything into the game in a time frame that isn't being counted by the candles on the birthday cake? Come on!

Addressing previous post, I sure do not regret playing the game previously and starting over when it felt like a new game every single time, but that feeling is gone now, after 7 years, I simply want something persistent, I don't want to nuke my world every single time Madmole decides that glass pane should have horizontal crack instead of vertical, because that REALLY do sucks soul out of me and my friends I play with. After all, the game is NOT rogue-like and starting over and over without being able to literally built something meaningful is now dishearting, when me and my friends no longer have the time to play as we used to in the past.

Having to start over after every singular even smallest update is my biggest and pretty much only gripe.

And that comes from a massive, but bitter fan. I love the game, I really do, but its going nowhere. Once the kickstarter roadmap was pretty much filled, the development literally jumped on a horse and YEE-HAAA'd to the wild wild west in search of mystical El-Dorado.
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Man, you make no sense. On the one hand you complain about every update taking a year, on the other hand you complain about having to start over after every single small update ? How does that even make sense ? I'm not even getting into the "just play version X 'til you sore" because updates are an option not an obligation, but well...

And what great do you actually think the beta or the release will bring you ? I mean, all I see when I think about release is "it's done, game's not evolving any further". You'll probably be the first to bail once the game is officialy out, because "hey nothing new, it's getting stale".

Unless i'm missing something I just can't understand people pushing for the gold release. What's the big prize you can't wait to win ?

 
Man, you make no sense. On the one hand you complain about every update taking a year, on the other hand you complain about having to start over after every single small update ? How does that even make sense ?
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I guess he wants the new content stuff of the new versions without the lets rework what was working well part.

IMO he is only right regarding a17 tho. I didnt like all the changes of previous alphas, but as a whole, every one of them made the game more fun. a17 has very good things, but as a whole makes the game more boring.

 
Well, you have got it wrong then. I quite literally explained what the problems are and what's holding back me and the game.And I honestly don't know how to write it any plainer and simpler.

You seem to be under a weird impression that its impossible to add new content to a game once it releases, which most certainly is not the case.

Flipping everything made so far upside down with every single update instead of actually having a clue on what you want your game to look like and pursuing that direction WITH A PLAN instead of impulsive random experimentation that extends development to infinity and forces restarts on a game meant to play persistently is the problem.
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I'll admit I do skim your posts. I do this because with the exception of this you you take too many words to get your point across. That's why I asked what exactly you want out of the game.

I'm actually curious. Can you explain to me in 1 short paragraph what you want TFP to do?

Sorry if I'm missing it.

 
I swear it’s like there’s a fire somewhere and people can hear the smoke and hear sirens and then one guy says, “I bet it was Al-Qaeda!” And someone else says, “Yep, I’ve seen what they can do. It probably is Al-Qaeda!!”
Then, an eye-witness arrives and after listening to all the speculation says, “It wasn’t Al-Qaeda. Some kids were smoking in the basement and caused the fire”

To which one of the speculators says, “Its definitely Al-Qaeda!”

As an eye-witness I can tell you there is a plan and they have not reworked everything. The game is generally the same it has always been. It may seem more dramatic if the feature is your personal favorite one but that doesn’t mean there is no plan nor that that feature was a core feature of the whole game.
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I personally hear ya Roland. But perception is stronger than fact sometimes.

Most people that own the game will never read your words or know what's going on. And from a gamer point of view the past 2 updates are giving the perception TFP are trying out game progression mechanics, not liking then, and redoing them. Reworking mechanics and such. That's just how it looks.

Now your here to clue us in and that's great. Some will be educated but others wont trust that's the case. Not saying anyone here dosent believe you, I have no idea. I know I believe you but that's all I can say.

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You keep saying this and it isn’t true. That standard of wiping is only reserved for those who wish to report bugs.
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Hes right. I havent wiped in 8 months. And last update it was 14 months.

 
At A15 they decided that they didn’t want LBD. Their first move was to remove it from crafting. Then they removed it from skills. A17 was the first version since A11 without any LBD components and now A18 will continue that but with a reorginization if the perks.
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Interesting to know. From the player's point of view one had the impression in A16 that the developers had put the LBD aspect even more into focus than in A15 and not less. That's why it was so surprising that LBD in A17 was completely removed.

Books have also gone through several iterations. When first implemented they were considered a placeholder for perks. They were never meant to remain. In A17 they were almost completely phased out and the devs realized that they had been mistaken to consider them simply placeholders for perks. So A18 will bring them back as officially a full feature in the game to complement perks.
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To consider something as a placeholder for which the designers have designed whole buildings is somewhat paradoxical. What would the Crack a Book be without the books in the game? Only a source for paper ?

 
I personally hear ya Roland. But perception is stronger than fact sometimes.
Most people that own the game will never read your words or know what's going on. And from a gamer point of view the past 2 updates are giving the perception TFP are trying out game progression mechanics, not liking then, and redoing them. Reworking mechanics and such. That's just how it looks.

Now your here to clue us in and that's great. Some will be educated but others wont trust that's the case. Not saying anyone here dosent believe you, I have no idea. I know I believe you but that's all I can say.
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Yes, and I can forgive the uninformed masses who see 7 Days to Die as just another title in their library and who are not following the development for feeling like there is no plan.

I was specifically talking about people here who are following and who hold onto their worst case scenario speculations even though there is testimony to the contrary from people who aren’t speculating.

I can totally see how TFP gives the impression at first glance of being rudderless.

 
Interesting to know. From the player's point of view one had the impression in A16 that the developers had put the LBD aspect even more into focus than in A15 and not less. That's why it was so surprising that LBD in A17 was completely removed.
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That is mainly the fault of them taking so long to develop and release A17. We had A16 for so long it became The Game instead of being the next iteration of the game.

To consider something as a placeholder for which the designers have designed whole buildings is somewhat paradoxical. What would the Crack a Book be without the books in the game? Only a source for paper ?
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They are not just designing this game. They are designing modular systems that they plan to use for future projects. They spent a lot of time developing the book system because they knew that even if they ultimately rejected it for this game they very well might want it for the next one. They are building an arsenal of systems and mechanics that will be able to be combined for any game they wish to make in the future. It does seem counter-intuitive that they spend so much time developing things that end up getting cut but just think of them as investments.

 
I havent wiped in 8 months.
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image-52.jpg


-Morloc

 
I only just started playing with alpha 17 recently. I can't believe I wasn't aware of this game until now, this kind of thing is right up my alley. I fully expect to waste hundreds if not thousands of hours of my life playing this game.

That said, seeing all the great refinements, refactors, and additions coming in alpha 18 has got me champing at the bit to play it. I particularly can't for quality-derived item stats. Right now getting a level 6 gun doesn't feel too important.

I also really like the changes to the perk system. I don't like feeling like I have to jump around between the different trees to make a decent character, I'd rather be able to home in on a few aspects of gameplay and really specialize. It should add a lot of replay value, too.

The perk books also seem pretty cool!

I feel like it was a mistake for me to read up on Alpha 18, because now I'm having a hard time summoning the will to play Alpha 17, even though I was enjoying myself before that. Now I just hit F5 on here, TFP's youtube, and Joel's twitter hoping for news when I should be playing the game!

Oh well, at least A18 should theoretically be here within the next few weeks. If I'm not mistaken they said "before school starts" in the recent livestream, so hopefully sooner than later, though I know not to get my hopes up TOO much!

Excellent game, looking forward to more excellence!

 
I got tired of a17 once I started playing mods, now vanilla is so boring to me I can't even bother with it anymore, I'll play a18 vanilla probally till the mods I like get ported to it, then drop vanilla real quick. My issue with a17 is by day 7, you can be very well off and have virtually no reason to explore anymore. You'll craft way better than you'll find usually. I really have no idea how people can go till day 50+ in vanilla a17 and not be bored out of their skul.

 
That is mainly the fault of them taking so long to develop and release A17. We had A16 for so long it became The Game instead of being the next iteration of the game.
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Thankfully A18 is developed much faster..? ;)

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I got tired of a17 once I started playing mods, now vanilla is so boring to me I can't even bother with it anymore, I'll play a18 vanilla probally till the mods I like get ported to it, then drop vanilla real quick. My issue with a17 is by day 7, you can be very well off and have virtually no reason to explore anymore. You'll craft way better than you'll find usually. I really have no idea how people can go till day 50+ in vanilla a17 and not be bored out of their skul.
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What I did is to put loot abundance on 25%. That changed the game dramatically for me.

 
I really have no idea how people can go till day 50+ in vanilla a17 and not be bored out of their skul.
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It's simple. Other people have different interests in the game. Killing zombies and looting is the boring part for me. Building new bases and collecting raw materials is fun for me.

 
Depending on how "explosive" the demolition zombie is and how abundant ammo will be late game, players might need to rethink any major above-ground horde defense.

If you can loot/forage/craft in one day, enough Dukes to stay safe at a trader during a late-game BM, I would say that is a good strategy.

There could be a migration to the various super long underground tunnel defenses, but I want to see for myself how feasible above ground defense will be.

Looking forward to my first death in the brave new world of A18! :D

 
I wonder if there're any plans to divide combat and working melee tools into separate classes so we could finally have normal hitboxes in melee combat, without having to aim with pinpoint accuracy(it just looks silly when you miss a hit with a giant sledgehammer standing right in front of a zombie): working tools wouldn't be able to damage zombies and melee weapons wouldn't damage blocks. Multipurpose weapons like axes, pickaxes or hammers could have additional grip (just like in a popular medieval slasher), for example by pressing R you could switch between building and combat modes, possibly add different animations or just simply make the outline of the slot in the toolbelt switch colors, for example red - combat, green outline - building mode. Other tools dont even need adjustments, no one breaks doors with a hunting knife or hunts zombies with a wrench, right?

 
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I wonder if there're any plans to divide combat and working melee tools into separate classes so we could finally have normal hitboxes in melee combat, without having to aim with pinpoint accuracy(it just looks silly when you miss a hit with a giant sledgehammer standing right in front of a zombie): working tools wouldn't be able to damage zombies and melee weapons wouldn't damage blocks. Multipurpose weapons like axes, pickaxes or hammers could have additional grip (just like in a popular medieval slasher), for example by pressing R you could switch between building and combat modes, possibly add different animations or just simply make the outline of the slot in the toolbelt switch colors, for example red - combat, green outline - building mode. Other tools dont even need adjustments, no one breaks doors with a hunting knife or hunts zombies with a wrench, right?
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In my opinion, the damage dealt to blocks in general (apart from tools) is considerably high. Even Zs pound on them like they're paper... IRL you would have a hard time destroying a wooden door (not to mention metal) even with high end tools so easily as you can here. And yes, i know it's a video game and it shouldn't be so realistic for the gameplay purpose, but still...

On the other hand, tools not being good enough to smack zombies? You can kill Zs with a wooden club, which is simply put a little refurbished log. Why wouldn't you be able to do similar (or higher) damage with a hoe, a wrench, a hammer or a rock? BTW, i would love throwing rocks to have some damage, IRL you can kill with those, but not here? Perhaps add some more throwing weapons to the mix... Back to topic, history knows murder cases done with various tools, performed as well as with weapons (knives, pistols, bows, swords, spears, etc.). These deaths were sometimes even more gruesome than with implements meant to kill.

Add to that the complexity of having a mechanic for differentiating your hits between "building" and "killing". Even showing different animations (swings) for using a tool in either way would not be as immersive as it is now simply smacking down on either block or enemy.

Apart from that, A18 will introduce improved attack swings, where if you don't exactly point towards the enemy, it will still get hit. So yeah, something like that will come to the game :)

 
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