PC Small perk suggestion - Archery and Ranged class

[Verne]

Perception tree seems to be very bland early in the game, especially compared to strenght tree in terms of power and utility.

If we want to make a melee build we get plenty of options how to increase power of our attacks (attack speed, stamina reduction, dmg, easy way to stun zombies and even more damage plus perks that let us carry more, harvest more and loot faster - higher dmg to blocks).

But what if we want to focus on range type of class? First of all there is not even a single reason to go for gun perks before lvl 60 when you can craft steel bulets. We are literally left with extra dmg to the head and whatever archery skill that is the only specialized weapon skill that gives you nothing extra (every gun perk gives something nice at higher lvl like stamina regen, higher dmg for one shooting zombies, stun chance etc. while melee gets bleed + aoe bleed and knock down + aoe knock down)

Archery gets literally nothing but faster aiming and reload.

What is more while melee type of class can totally ignore perception tree without any penalties, archery must invest in both (maybe even also in agility tree if we want ok dmg).

This is what i suggest:

1) Give archery something nice but not op. I suggest higher chance for an arrow/bolt to not be destroyed at early lvls and maybe ability to craft 2 arrows/bolts instead of one at perk lvl 4 or 5.

2) Move stealth perks from agility to perception tree

3) Give "lucky looter" boost to finding feathers at early perk lvls and maybe higher chance to find more ammo at lvl 5 (it's kinda strange for me that it is super easy use melee weapons non stop from day 0 while specializing in archery is never ending gathering of resources till you can one shot zombies with high enough sneak dmg bonus)

4) Move "pack mule" (preferably all construction perks) to fortitude or agility tree so it will not feel like melee get's all this bonuses for free while ranged type of build is penalized to spend perks on strenght just to grab backpack space and better harvest of resources that are needed to craft ammo.

 

[Snowydeath]

Perception tree seems to be very bland early in the game, especially compared to strenght tree in terms of power and utility. If we want to make a melee build we get plenty of options how to increase power of our attacks (attack speed, stamina reduction, dmg, easy way to stun zombies and even more damage plus perks that let us carry more, harvest more and loot faster - higher dmg to blocks).

But what if we want to focus on range type of class? First of all there is not even a single reason to go for gun perks before lvl 60 when you can craft steel bulets. We are literally left with extra dmg to the head and whatever archery skill that is the only specialized weapon skill that gives you nothing extra (every gun perk gives something nice at higher lvl like stamina regen, higher dmg for one shooting zombies, stun chance etc. while melee gets bleed + aoe bleed and knock down + aoe knock down)

Archery gets literally nothing but faster aiming and reload.

What is more while melee type of class can totally ignore perception tree without any penalties, archery must invest in both (maybe even also in agility tree if we want ok dmg).

This is what i suggest:

1) Give archery something nice but not op. I suggest higher chance for an arrow/bolt to not be destroyed at early lvls and maybe ability to craft 2 arrows/bolts instead of one at perk lvl 4 or 5.

2) Move stealth perks from agility to perception tree

3) Give "lucky looter" boost to finding feathers at early perk lvls and maybe higher chance to find more ammo at lvl 5 (it's kinda strange for me that it is super easy use melee weapons non stop from day 0 while specializing in archery is never ending gathering of resources till you can one shot zombies with high enough sneak dmg bonus)

4) Move "pack mule" (preferably all construction perks) to fortitude or agility tree so it will not feel like melee get's all this bonuses for free while ranged type of build is penalized to spend perks on strenght just to grab backpack space and better harvest of resources that are needed to craft ammo.

I was thinking that having a lower chance of arrows breaking would be cool (though I'm not sure how high it should go if it existed)

 

[Zephanyah]

I was thinking that having a lower chance of arrows breaking would be cool (though I'm not sure how high it should go if it existed)

Yes. It makes sense that you could fire arrows in a way that they don't break that much.

When the stealth is finally at a stage where it is real stealth, Bow and Arrow should be as much rewarding as the other ranged weapons because the make almost no sound compared to the others.

I have many other suggestion which don't really make sense to put into the skill. But that is only because a bleeding or a cripple chance should be added to all kinds of projectiles. That could be an extra perk of course. Shooting certain points makes the chance of those cases higher. May be that is worth skilling.

Sorry Verne, but your points 2 - 4 make no sense to me.

Stealthy movement is agility of course. Perception could give you a certain bonus because you are more aware of your surroundings, but even if you are able to spot every loud underground, if your to clumsy to walk around it, it doesn't do you any good.

Lucky looting is a perk that makes no sense to me either. It is bad enough that there is such a skill. Please don't make them do another. You really can't train your luck in any way. For that you have to bargain with the universe.

And the stronger you are the less you mind packing more stuff. So pack mule should be with strength.

But there are many other things to consider to make this new system lovable I think. It's a very good start, but they also let very good features go like farming zombie bodies and learning by doing.

 

[Limdood]

You complain strength builds can ignore perception and be great...

I've tried both builds...the only thing i miss when i go strength is lucky looter.

The only thing i miss when i go perception is pack mule.

The gathering perks are really pyrrhic. Sure, i break rocks faster with miner69er, but i also get less resources per rock by power attacking at ridiculous block damage. Compared to most other perks which give ONLY benefits, boosting ONLY my power attack damage to blocks is a tradeoff. Similarly, both the perception wrench perk and the strength motherlode perk are really lackluster on their own. If they were combined, I'd take them for sure, but i pretty much never find myself considering taking either. the meat gathering perk in the endurance tree is just as bad.

I really don't get the complaints....I feel you can EITHER go agility(sneak)/perception/intelligence and sprinkle in some strength for pack mule and play a ranged focus, OR you can go Strength/intelligence and sprinkle in some agility/endurance for survival and stamina management.

The first option can't quite carry as much and loses survivability if they get surprised, while the second option has worse looting and suffers at range (and even with endurance, the fact that swings target a pinpoint crosshair instead of a melee arc swing means a couple twitchy zombie dodges can leave you in rough shape anyways).

Of the two of them, the strength build is considerably more effective and resilient levelling up and getting loot in the early game up to around level 30 or so, but the ranged build skyrockets ahead on horde nights, and when you start being able to sneak 1-shot most sleepers at range without waking others.