PC Really? Why not just remove the food system entirely?

Scyris

Scyris

Survivor
From b169 notes:

"All small game (rabbits and chickens) and large game (boars, and deer) spawn every day or night at any time. Small game has a high chance to spawn, large game has a low chance to spawn. "

If your going to go this far, you might as well just remove the food/water system entirely, its already way to easy in a19 as it is. It got a bit harder on day 1 in a 19 but still by day 2, you should have a stockpile unless your doing something horribly wrong. Stop gimping the game for crappy/lazy players, and force people to actually learn how to play the game. Food/water is not hard to manage at all. You have: animals in the wild, crops, vending machines, traders, the canned food, water is as simple as a empty jar or can and a pool of water which is never hard to find I notice, never mind the fact that cupboards in poi's is full of it. You can even make a infinite soruce of water all you need is a iron bucket and a water source to get the first block of water. I mean it was bad enough when the game was trivilized by the loot rooms at the end of almost every poi, making getting gear a joke. Could be fixed, by making the major loot chest (the metal one) have a less than 10% chance to spawn in a poi, with higher tier poi's having a higher chance (thou not by much, maybe 25% chance in a tier 5).

Seriously, i've not once starved or dehdrated in this game even when I was a complete noob going in blind. I do not even know HOW people can manage to do this. I've been around since a9 or 10. Food was harder back then, I actually find I have more meat by day 7 in a19 than I did back in a16 and below.

TL DR: Stop making the game easier for poor/lazy players, the game was never hard even when I was a complete new player, and I am tired of seeing it ruined to cater to these people. Also fix the chance of quality 4-6 dropping back to a18 levels making them very rare no matter what GS. k.thanks cuz the guarnteed qual 5-6 stuff out of every chest ruins the game.

 
They are trying to balance hunting for both SP and MP with a one size fits all system. They have to know it's a fool's errand but they just keep trying.

 
Ranzera said:
They are trying to balance hunting for both SP and MP with a one size fits all system. They have to know it's a fool's errand but they just keep trying.
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I'd have just left it as it was, a 8k map is pretty huge, lots to explore, if you explore you will find animals, I doubt there is any server where the map has been 100% hunted out for a week. Though I do apprecate the lowering of wolfs/bears cuz in b163 it was silly seeing more of those on the street than zombies. Thats why I said lazy players, when I wanna get meat? I go out and explore parts of the map I haven't been in before, so its a fresh chunk, even on a established server there should be tons of these left. Its like irl kinda, if you wanna get some meat you can't just sit in your house and wait for a deer to walk right up and knock on your door, you get up, go out and find one to hunt. Again though, every poi is pretty much loaded with food, even the smallest house, you can even eat animal fat if your desperate enough.

The balance is the problem, they need to decide if they wanna balance the game for MP, or for single player, trying to do both sort of gets them no where, as in SP there is more than enough food to go around, in MP there is too, but you have to work a bit harder for it since your competing with others. Problem is humans are lazy and always wanna take the easiest path they can. Time to generate a new world with the vanilla rwg, here is hoping it doesn't take 30 mins for a 8k world again. No idea why its so slow, when nitrogen can do it (and make it far better looking) in 3 minutes. I  just prefer to stay vanilla if I can is why I put up with it.

 
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Hmmmmmm.

yeah, i currently have like 8 stacks of raw meat. I have more meat then i know what to do with. 

I am also building a super farm, with 50 potatoes and 50 corn. I will never starve. I have defeated hunger. 

Granted, i am high level right now, 83, so i should be dominating, but i have had a lot of meat, and i have also noted that locking the recipes behind perks has made the game challenging. I got lucky and got the gumbo recipe my first week, and that feeds you for a day. later on i moved to spaghetti. I have noticed that you only need maybe 10 farm plots total to grow food, at 10 plots per player you will never go hungry. Maybe they should increase the grow time for plants? 

I also think something that will help is more buffs for the food. Everyone wears nerdy glasses. Would they still wear nerdy glasses if there was a food buff that increased experience gain? pumpkin cheese cake stacks with sugar butts and awesome sauce, so those are a necessity if you want to buy vehicles. 

Maybe one solution to the meat problem, is make the wolves and the boars tougher, so that you don't want to fight them as much? i had a 10 dog zombie dog horde attack me in a poi, so maybe more wolf packs? Boars should move in small groups, and maybe give them more bleed attacks? Another solution is a debuff if you keep eating the same thing, and a buff if you have a varied diet? That would force me to cook a bigger variety of recipes. 

 
They should really be managing the recipes instead of the resources. You can do more fine tuning of supply/demand balance by managing recipes' demand than messing with random animal spawn supply.

Change meat needed in recipes from 5 to 4 if metrics say people are hungry too much.

 
I don't think the mechanics of hunting has ever been explained to players. I have never seen a journal note that explains how animal spawning works.

I don't think it's a good idea to complain that noobs can't find animals, when the mechanics has never been explained to them

I think they should reduce the number of canned food you can find from looting, but it scales dramatically with lucky looter. The number of meat you get per animal should also be reduced. Even in A19 B153 before the animal spawn, my team's got more food than we know what to do with

 
Raestloz said:
I have never seen a journal note that explains how animal spawning works.
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I don't think any journal entries talk about game mechanics like 'spawning'. They are meant to be hand-written notes by the survivor, who does not know his/her entire life is actually just a simulation inside a game.  I guess not. Raestloz gives examples below.

Spawning of animals works just the same as spawning of zombies - there is a certain max # alive in any chunk, and a certain delay between respawns. Here's the pine forest's spawn mechanics from A19 b169 (from spawning.xml):

<biome name="pine_forest">
<spawn maxcount="1" respawndelay="2.9" time="Day" entitygroup="ZombiesAll" />
<spawn maxcount="1" respawndelay="3.3" time="Night" entitygroup="ZombiesNight" />
<spawn maxcount="1" respawndelay="1" time="Any" entitygroup="WildGameForest" spawnDeadChance="0" />
<spawn maxcount="1" respawndelay="1.1" time="Night" entitygroup="EnemyAnimalsForest" spawnDeadChance="0" />
</biome>


They have changed the "WildGameForest" spawner to have just a 1 day delay, so animals will try to spawn every day. Used to be 21 days in A18, so this is a significant increase in the likelihood of finding animals. In my A19 game I'm becoming much better at hitting a chicken with an arrow from a primitive bow.

 
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The current animal levels make sense in multiplayer but are massively overtuned for solo. Food is basically not a mechanic any more aside from the buffs higher tier foods give you + the healing (and meds are so common now that if you aren't playing super recklessly food healing is barely relevant, I have like 8 stacks of FA-B and 2 of medkits on day 26, not to mention every medical cabinet I loot having 5-10 aloe creams).

 
I think something that would help is increase the sell price for meat, it's food so i am certain that the traders will buy it. Another thing that would help is to have  a buff/debuff based around diet. If you eat the same thing over and over, you get a debuff and it's not effective, BUT if you eat different foods each day, you get  a buff. That would encourage a diverse set of crops and cooking. Currently i am only eating food made from the cans, like spaghetti and sham chowder. I may eat a chilli dog, and for long excursions out i take fish tacos with me. 

Then again, part of the problem may be that i have gotten good with the game.  A bunch of noobs over on steam are complaining about starving to death, and i have over a thousand hours in the game, so maybe the issue isn't balance, i just have too much experience surviving in the game? 

 
SenpaiThatIngnoresYou said:
I think something that would help is increase the sell price for meat, it's food so i am certain that the traders will buy it. Another thing that would help is to have  a buff/debuff based around diet. If you eat the same thing over and over, you get a debuff and it's not effective, BUT if you eat different foods each day, you get  a buff. That would encourage a diverse set of crops and cooking. Currently i am only eating food made from the cans, like spaghetti and sham chowder. I may eat a chilli dog, and for long excursions out i take fish tacos with me. 

Then again, part of the problem may be that i have gotten good with the game.  A bunch of noobs over on steam are complaining about starving to death, and i have over a thousand hours in the game, so maybe the issue isn't balance, i just have too much experience surviving in the game? 
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They just need to git gud and learn the game, but instead of trying to better themselves they cry about it, till tfp caves in and makes it easy mode, this is why the playerbase has been getting worse and worse at the game. The intro of junk turrets was a major player skill reducer with how automated they are. I mean if they don't wanna figure it out for themselves or are too stupid to do so, go to youtube look for 7 days to die new player hints or something.

 
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Boidster said:
I don't think any journal entries talk about game mechanics like 'spawning'. They are meant to be hand-written notes by the survivor, who does not know his/her entire life is actually just a simulation inside a game
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The armor statistics and encumbrance journals tell you, in no uncertain terms, that they're explanations about video game mechanics. They're most certainly not hand written notes by the survivor.

Even assuming that, a simple "animals will avoid any areas where an animal has been killed for extreme periods of time" will suffice.

 
I also don't get the problem with food and still nobody could (or didn't want to) show their problem in detail. From watching streams i often see them simply "doing it wrong". Wasting food by overeating, eat whatever they have immediately if the hunger symbol comes up, not hunting animals when they come by, not looting bird nests, not want to put one single point in master chef, and so on.

Since A15 i never had a massive lack of meat. In previous alphas i only occasionally walked out for hunting especially. In both SP and MP.

Now in A19 the quests make you travel anyway and i often have seen (and killed) animals on my way, even before the crazy animal spawn patch. With the crazy patch i didn't even need to hunt, just killing predators that attacked me gave way more meat than i could ever use. But the patchnote imho is not a new big change, it's just a correction to the crazy patch before.

And how could people think animals don't respawn? Have you ever seen a server that was cleaned from animals? Do people not move their asses out of their base and have seen animals in regions where they already killed some?

SenpaiThatIngnoresYou said:
Then again, part of the problem may be that i have gotten good with the game.  A bunch of noobs over on steam are complaining about starving to death, and i have over a thousand hours in the game, so maybe the issue isn't balance, i just have too much experience surviving in the game? 
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Sure you have "too much" experience. But how did you come to that experience? Previous alphas have not been that easy and you obviously also didn't rage quit. So you learned how to do it. And with almost every new alpha version you still adept new or changed machanics.

Imho the game has become so popular that many learning resitent players want to play it now, and they struggle, because they don't want to learn a game, they want the game to become like how they want to play. And imho TFP gets onto this and makes the game easier to still keep those players. And that contradicts with experienced players. They want the game to become harder or at least stay at the same difficulty.

 
Scyris said:
They just need to git gud and learn the game, but instead of trying to better themselves they cry about it, till tfp caves in and makes it easy mode, this is why the playerbase has been getting worse and worse at the game. The intro of junk turrets was a major player skill reducer with how automated they are. I mean if they don't wanna figure it out for themselves or are too stupid to do so, go to youtube look for 7 days to die new player hints or something.
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I have to agree with the junk turrets. I really don't understand them that much. Some people play with them a bit, others don't. It seems to be a fun thing so i don't complain, but so far the only time i have used them is the melee turrets: one on top of my horde pillbox to punch the vultures, and the other the front door of my furnace/sniper tower to punch the screamers that i fail to snipe off. If they are going to go the nerd robot route, the instead of a flying drone, i would rather a trash can r2d2 with a machine gun @%$*#!. 

Part of the appeal to 7 days to die for me is the horrible mauling i get for failing to get gud. I liked kenshi, where if you were not gud, the game let you die like the pathetic noob worm that you were: too weak and stupid to even be a slave. My favorite memories of this game were alpha 14ish where the roof of the cabins i was working on collapsed and killed me, trying to fend off a hoard in an unfortified cabin and a dog chewed through the wall, and a horde of zombie footballers destroying my newly built horde base an hour before horde night in war of the walkers. Failing at 7 days is much more fun than succeeding. I do hope bandits become a really nasty thing, like a bunch of drunk gwar fans who show up to your place, steal your stuff, then break a few things on the way out. 

 
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