PC New world gen in A17 B233 is horrible

I have mixed thoughts. On one hand I didn't mind the way it was besides some of the work that still needed to be done but can see where it can have that fill to it that it seems like the same map you just played.

On the other hand I like the randomness not knowing where to go. Again it still needs work obviously so I guess over all I could go either way with it.

But what I personally do not miss is the large bodies of water all over the place. One big one I wouldn't mind I guess but all over the map no thanks. Personally would like even less water to make it more challenging to find water. Also especially now with smaller maps think of where all that water used to be of how much more stuff could of spawned if it was land. So yeah I do not miss large amounts of water and hope that doesn't come back. Just sayin :)

 
Also wow, the town layouts are so much better!
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No I don't think so. These new cities feel a lot more.. empty. The roads themselves feel way more wonky with regards to relief and placement.

 
While it's far from perfect, it's just that : random. Having snow north and desert south was no where near random enough, especially now they removed plains and maple forest biomes. I'd rather play like this than with the prior 3-layer "R"WG.

The 2 issues I see here :

- too few biomes that are worthwhile. This has been a major issue ever since the game started existing, but years later nothing has changed. Burnt forest has no upside and is just an awful place to be in (for both your character's temperature and your own fun), snow isn't really any better as you get cold and there's nothing special there (even though it has SOME merits, overall I just always avoid it and I'm perfectly fine never going there), which basically leaves you with forest and desert being the only "good" biomes.

- they removed plains and maple forest. Madmole stated "plains were useless", but I don't agree with this. First of all, it added diversity. But it was also mostly flat, had decent temperature values, and was actually the perfect spot to build on. Besides, it's not like burnt forest and snow pack more interest than plains...

I miss the good old days in A16 and prior where my first goal was to find that perfect spot where plains/forest/desert met. You had all you needed, a flat terrain to build on, a desert to get some aloe / yucca and easy birdnests, and the forest for all the rest. Finding that spot was another incentive to explore that got lost in A17.

 
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Don't know if I agree that the wastelands and burnt forests need to be reduced. I mean there was an apocalypse and there were bombs...and radiation. It's part of the world and I'm ok if they keep it as is. If I wanted a vanilla world where these things didn't happen then I would go play that game. I do miss the plains, maple forests, large rivers and hills though. Part of the "large hills" problem is how the vehicles behave now. You want to ride a current bike up those old hills? No way. I suppose just avoiding the large ones would be a thing. Cities are nicely done. Random biomes are good if they make them larger.
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yeah-it's not that i necessarily want them to have less area but the tiny patches everywhere are really annoying. it wouldn't be so bad except the sound and haze from wasteland patches being everywhere is annoying. burnt forest isn't so bad but still-it would be nice if they'd make large areas that are in varied locations instead of the tiny patches all over

 
While it's far from perfect, it's just that : random. Having snow north and desert south was no where near random enough, especially now they removed plains and maple forest biomes. I'd rather play like this than with the prior 3-layer "R"WG.
The 2 issues I see here :

- too few biomes that are worthwhile. This has been a major issue ever since the game started existing, but years later nothing has changed. Burnt forest has no upside and is just an awful place to be in (for both your character's temperature and your own fun), snow isn't really any better as you get cold and there's nothing special there (even though it has SOME merits, overall I just always avoid it and I'm perfectly fine never going there), which basically leaves you with forest and desert being the only "good" biomes.

- they removed plains and maple forest. Madmole stated "plains were useless", but I don't agree with this. First of all, it added diversity. But it was also mostly flat, had decent temperature values, and was actually the perfect spot to build on. Besides, it's not like burnt forest and snow pack more interest than plains...

I miss the good old days in A16 and prior where my first goal was to find that perfect spot where plains/forest/desert met. You had all you needed, a flat terrain to build on, a desert to get some aloe / yucca and easy birdnests, and the forest for all the rest. Finding that spot was another incentive to explore that got lost in A17.
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Some would say they love the snow and not be a fan of the desert. It is all just a matter of preference and opinions. But I do believe MM said more to it besides just being useless. I believe he even gave a reason to why they took out the full biomes. Seeing they are still working on rwg it will definitely be interesting to see how it will actually end up being especially seeing the changes after changes being made in just about every update or so.

 
Same story different day here. They give us something and JUST as we are getting used to it they knee jerk yank it out. What a waste. I HATE these hodge podge maps. Why remove 2 fine biomes in plains and maple forest if all you were going to do was go back to this disgusting mess anyway?
I dont recall ANYONE begging to have back huge areas of wasteland and burnt forest, do you guys?
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This!

 
This!
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A few proposed fixes to RWG:

- Larger biome areas

- More mountains, steep hills rather than mostly flat with some bumps in the heightmap

- Biomes based off topology

- More Biome diversity to match topology

- Water level relative to topology and not a fixed height to allow mountain lakes, connection streams/rivers and lowland swamps

- Bring back rivers / channels with added bridges etc. A few larger lakes is fine, just not the flooded map from A14 or 15 I think it was

- Roads laid more like real world - flatten dips and grade out humps for main roads w/ bridges over rivers

- Bring back tall building over 5/6 stories in larger cities

 
The plains are still gone, yes? :sorrow:

Still, i think i like the patchwork better then the regular experimental rwg. Nice to see

progress on that front too. :)

There are however times i would love to see some preset "challenger" maps. IE, a single island, a single

city, etc.

OR maybe, just maybe, seeing as they are working on the RWG, would it be possible to

add a checklist to the RWG mixer with biomes?

As in, default is every biome, but if someone wanted more challenge, they could

make one huge wasteland map. Or, if for one reason or another want to exclude just

one or two, beeing able to make it so.

 
I for one am glad to see the change back towards what we had. The snow north and desert south always maps just didn't do it for me. I want the randomness of biomes. yes the edges are very sharp in the example shown and too much wasteland but RWG is still very much a work in progress and I can almost guarantee this is not the final product. So in a nutshell. Yay RWG is returning!

 
Same story different day here. They give us something and JUST as we are getting used to it they knee jerk yank it out. What a waste. I HATE these hodge podge maps. Why remove 2 fine biomes in plains and maple forest if all you were going to do was go back to this disgusting mess anyway?
I dont recall ANYONE begging to have back huge areas of wasteland and burnt forest, do you guys?
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after having spent all morning trying maps and then trying to edit the rwg to something i actually want to play in-i too will say "THIS!" lol

i really tried to be positive. geeeez

 
I haven't decided if I like or dislike this new RWG. One thing I know I don't like is the prevalence of ruined/destroyed buildings in some of the towns. It seemed like the towns in the burnt/destroyed biomes were nearly all destroyed buildings with a very small number of real POI's.

https://imgur.com/a/xurJCL5

 
yeah-it's not that i necessarily want them to have less area but the tiny patches everywhere are really annoying. it wouldn't be so bad except the sound and haze from wasteland patches being everywhere is annoying. burnt forest isn't so bad but still-it would be nice if they'd make large areas that are in varied locations instead of the tiny patches all over
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I couldn't agree more.

While it's far from perfect, it's just that : random. Having snow north and desert south was no where near random enough, especially now they removed plains and maple forest biomes. I'd rather play like this than with the prior 3-layer "R"WG.
The 2 issues I see here :

- too few biomes that are worthwhile. This has been a major issue ever since the game started existing, but years later nothing has changed. Burnt forest has no upside and is just an awful place to be in (for both your character's temperature and your own fun), snow isn't really any better as you get cold and there's nothing special there (even though it has SOME merits, overall I just always avoid it and I'm perfectly fine never going there), which basically leaves you with forest and desert being the only "good" biomes.

- they removed plains and maple forest. Madmole stated "plains were useless", but I don't agree with this. First of all, it added diversity. But it was also mostly flat, had decent temperature values, and was actually the perfect spot to build on. Besides, it's not like burnt forest and snow pack more interest than plains...

I miss the good old days in A16 and prior where my first goal was to find that perfect spot where plains/forest/desert met. You had all you needed, a flat terrain to build on, a desert to get some aloe / yucca and easy birdnests, and the forest for all the rest. Finding that spot was another incentive to explore that got lost in A17.
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Same here. Plains were the place to build a nice base. I never cared for the maple forest much but it would be a good transition to snow.

 
I can only partially agree. There needs to be some kind of predictability with the biome generation if for nothing more than realism. Higher elevations would typically be colder and snowy, lower lying areas might be more arid like the desert, and I would personally love to see a swampy biome. Warmer temperatures and arid climates would be found more often in the south and more arctic climates would be found more prevalently in the north (assuming you live north of the equator). I do agree that long and occasionally wide rivers need to make a comeback, but not these monstrosities that would dominate the map and destroy the road generation system we had before. Also, if they are going to bring those huge rivers and large lakes back, I'd like to see some kind of boating option as many people have already stated. I'm not asking for a multimillion-dollar yacht to sit out in the middle of a lake and watch the apocalypse happen from afar, but we have all the makings already to build a raft or maybe even a canoe. Higher skill could allow for an actual boat to be made with the option to attach a motor to it along with a rudder and prop shaft that could either be crafted or found. I'm not downing TFP for making these changes because I feel that RWG should have an element of randomness to it, as the name implies, but when the random gen biome map looks like a patchwork quilt made by someone with cataracts and dementia there's going to be inconsistencies and issues.
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This..... I agree. I was thinking along the same lines.

 
I haven't decided if I like or dislike this new RWG. One thing I know I don't like is the prevalence of ruined/destroyed buildings in some of the towns. It seemed like the towns in the burnt/destroyed biomes were nearly all destroyed buildings with a very small number of real POI's.
https://imgur.com/a/xurJCL5
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That's been happing a lot in A17 in general. Apparently they had a huge problem with a lot of "downtown" buildings not spawning that has been fixed now. I assume this pertains to the large skysrapers we got in A16 as well as a lot of the mid sized POIs.

 
This is progress in a way.
Randomly placed biomes are far better than the static crap they had.

Now... these biomes could be a little bigger and more dithered but... give them time.

I think this is a step in the right direction.
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I had a feeling they added the random back to randomgen for biomes, when I was at the middle of the map with snow and desert biomes there where I spawned.

 
I liked the North/south idea for Snow/Desert... would not mind seeing a east/west border area that could generate as sandbar type Islands that lead or end in the radiated area. I was ok with the A16 mess, I just need random. knowing where everything is on map start is what made me never ever play ark again after 2 weeks.

I do think, that finding a good balance between what was, and where they want to go would be like winning the Powerball 7x in a row...

But I have enjoyed using MUCH larger seed names.

ones that were liked

Dizzygrenade has a minigun

microwave your tea and don't care about when the brittish come to kill you

Lazy8244 has a fez, fez are cool

team giggity rides again, that means two things, double giggity

By the power of Grayskull

stick that tool where the sun shines not

laurie likes french toast and sausages

i mean, what is good/not good is also subjective. A general idea of what is liked more may help a little. (none of these seeds had less the 12 traders for an 8x8 map)

 
Same story different day here. They give us something and JUST as we are getting used to it they knee jerk yank it out. What a waste. I HATE these hodge podge maps. Why remove 2 fine biomes in plains and maple forest if all you were going to do was go back to this disgusting mess anyway?
I dont recall ANYONE begging to have back huge areas of wasteland and burnt forest, do you guys?
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I honestly feel like everything they're "fixing" in A17 is just sliding back to A16.

To be honest I liked the crazy patchwork we got in the initial A17 release. Now I don't even know.

 
I had a feeling they added the random back to randomgen for biomes, when I was at the middle of the map with snow and desert biomes there where I spawned.
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Yeah and it's a good sign.

I get that a lot of people are unhappy with RWG right now because I'm one of them.

I also remember MadMole talking about how LONG the process was to create the A16 RWG.

We're seeing development right before our eyes.

It's fascinating in a sense. Not so fun if you want to play, however.

It's just going to take time. We may not see a proper RWG till 17.2 or later.

That's just the reality of it.

Bleh! It's not fun waiting.

 
So as soon as the update came through i immediately started testing out RWG worlds in the previewer and they looked....awful lol. Most of the buildings in the towns are destroyed, the biome layout makes no sense, and im getting tons of "sunken" POI's. Whatever they did to try and fix the floating buildings ended up creating a new problem because i found numerous POI's like the trader where just the top was sticking out the sand. Didnt find a single skyscraper, there are more parking lots and parking garages than there are stores. it seems like most of the POI's are just junk. and i get lots of "empty cities" where there is a grid road layout but for some reason there are no buildings there.

This is not meant as a rage post, just posting the problems i see so that they can hopefully be resolved by the time stable comes out. But for now RWG is just unplayable for me, back to Navesgane.

A good solution to some of these issues would be what a previous poster suggested, a bunch of map templates that worked out the general layout of the map, city layouts and placement and then the individual buildings would be somewhat randomized depending on the zoning. so you might get a police station on the corner of an intersection or a fire station another time, but the POI would make sense based on its location in the city. and if you had enough of these kinds of templates (a few dozen or so) then you could still have tens of thousands of possible unique maps but they would all be of good quality, like navesgane

 
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