My opinion on some nerfs needed for better balance.

[SethPace8]

I posted this message below in a previous discussion where one of the devs, Fatal, mentioned that they are taking in feedback regarding the concern of the new perks being too strong in 2.0 Experimental. He said they will be nerfing the Pack Mule perk, as it is very powerful in its current state. I thought I would post my opinion here, on further balancing that I think needs to be done, and see what anybody else's opinions are. Thanks.

"I would like to add some more input regarding further balance to other perks as well, along with the preacher gloves. I believe that the level 5 strength mastery perk could use a nerf, either with its 50% damage resistance value and/or its 10 second duration. I also think that the agility's hard target perk could use a nerf. At max level 5 you can have a 50% damage resistance, just by moving, which is effectively almost every fight you will encounter. And with it being an agility perk and resisting that much damage just seems kind of odd to me. I think reducing its percentage damage resistance in half would still make it amazing. Lastly, the "no brainer" choice of an armor slot, the preacher gloves. I always thought it was strange how overpowered the preacher gloves are, especially compared to the other options. At max level 6 you get a whopping 60% damage increase to zombies. On it's own, I think that is way to much of a boost, but then you also factor in that 60% damage increase to ALL zombies and is applied across the board no matter what weapon you are using, unlike some of the other armor damage buffs that are more specific to a type of weapon or type of zombie, and those armor percentage damage increases are the same or LESS than the preacher gloves damage increase, which seems backwards and unbalanced. The preacher gloves damage increase should be less than other armors, solely because of its damage boost versatility.

Thank you guys for taking in the feedback, and all the hard work!"

 

[Uncle Al]

The preacher gloves, and other armour damage buffs, are a LOT less good than people generally assume.

The extra damage is calculated off base weapon damage, only, and does not get multiplied by other damage increases. Level 6 gloves are not +60% DPS. Far from it.

Add to that, extra damage doesn't actually matter if it doesn't change your number of hits required to kill a target. The gloves virtually never do except in very rare edge cases.

 

[theFlu]

Add to that, extra damage doesn't actually matter if it doesn't change your number of hits required to kill a target. The gloves virtually never do except in very rare edge cases.

The zeds do have a randomness to their health pool, which makes those edge cases appear roughly as commonly as you'd expect for the relative damage increase. "Not often", sure, but not really "very rare". Me, pedantic? Never!

 

[RipClaw]

I think it is far too early to say what is too OP and what is not. So far, most players probably won't be at the point where they encounter many charged or inferno zombies.

 

[ElCabong]

This sort of thing depends on the difficulty level you play on.

 

[Uncle Al]

The zeds do have a randomness to their health pool, which makes those edge cases appear roughly as commonly as you'd expect for the relative damage increase. "Not often", sure, but not really "very rare". Me, pedantic? Never!

They do? Every day is a school day. I suppose I don't use health bar mods so it's a hard thing for me to notice.

I still think it's a shame TFP didn't go with damage randomisation rather than enemy health variation, because of block damage. The breakpoints on shovels, in particular, make many upgrades completely worthless, because pretty much nothing over 125 damage matters until you reach 200. Damage randomisation would have avoided that.

I still stand by preacher gloves not being particularly amazing though.

 

[theFlu]

I suppose I don't use health bar mods so it's a hard thing for me to notice.

Yeh, the only indication is that sometimes zeds can take an extra hit; and you can't be sure if it was just a non-headshot at some point.

The breakpoints on shovels, in particular, make many upgrades completely worthless

Randomness would be better on the dealing side; but even the old way of linearly reducing damage with durability worked all right. Your better tool would two-shot things for a longer time before you'd choose to repair it or not. Giving benefit for both better durability and higher damage.

I still stand by preacher gloves not being particularly amazing though.

Indeed, they're not. They say +60% but the effect is more like 20%. Not that that makes the alternatives much better either..

 

[SethPace8]

The preacher gloves, and other armour damage buffs, are a LOT less good than people generally assume.

The extra damage is calculated off base weapon damage, only, and does not get multiplied by other damage increases. Level 6 gloves are not +60% DPS. Far from it.

Add to that, extra damage doesn't actually matter if it doesn't change your number of hits required to kill a target. The gloves virtually

The preacher gloves, and other armour damage buffs, are a LOT less good than people generally assume.

The extra damage is calculated off base weapon damage, only, and does not get multiplied by other damage increases. Level 6 gloves are not +60% DPS. Far from it.

Add to that, extra damage doesn't actually matter if it doesn't change your number of hits required to kill a target. The gloves virtually never do except in very rare edge cases.

Interesting. That makes sense. Thanks for the clarification. Would you think that the preacher gloves damage bonus should be less than other armour with more specific damage bonuses because of its versatility?


Do you think any of the above or other new/updated perks need any nerfs?

 

[Riamus]

Just so people know, in case they missed it... faatal has stated that they plan to balance some of those perks, including pack mule, because they are too much. This is experimental and that is when they do a lot of balancing of things after they see how things work with a lot of people playing the game. So you should expect to see some of those change within the next update or two (probably) in experimental. Whether or not we feel they are better or worse will depend on how they change them, of course.