PC Lets help TFP improve PvP

[Sy Tarn]

okay i don't get what the misunderstanding is of what i'm trying to say.

TFP and all the devs keep saying the same thing, "we don't want this to be just like every PVP game"

what does that mean? that means that they don't want features or suggestions that ADD OR CHANGE aspects of the game away from what they envisioned the game to be. and their vision more or less is to have an UNFORGIVING zombie apocalypse voxel based survival game. which to me is a perfect concept for the game as is. which pvp is actually pretty good in this game as is. sure there could be some few changes that could be made to make it better. but the whole point of what TFP devs are saying is that they don't want to change or add too much code and game mechanics that make it feel less like an UNFORGIVING zombie apocalypse voxel based survival game. which is what most of these suggestions in this thread would inevitably do.

honestly were getting ahead of ourselves here and if we keep trying to push all these new features straight outta OTHER PVP games TFP is going to read the first two pages of this thread and immediately dismiss it and PVP will never see the light of day because the suggestions made here are just going to reinforce their fear that people just want to change their game.

this thread should be about making changes to the game that is already there, and adding things that have already been talked about for THEIR games development to make pvp viable in the game and said games mechanics that have already been implemented and or talked about being features in the past during this whole development process. keep the changes simple yet not too hard to do that fixes the most issues that we as PVPr's see.

so in conclusion we need to start thinking about what could help PVP within the game and confines of 7 DAYS TO DIE and not any other game. and that raises our chances that TFP won't just end up dismissing the idea and not do it in the first place and NONE of us get what we want.

P.S. i know you guys are prob thinking i've been a ♥♥♥♥ but unlike most people in this forum i'm actually listening and understanding what TFP developers are saying. and also unlike most people in this forum i'm actually trying to defend them and what they have been saying.

 

[bloom_meister]

okay i don't get what the misunderstanding is of what i'm trying to say.
TFP and all the devs keep saying the same thing, "we don't want this to be just like every PVP game"

what does that mean? that means that they don't want features or suggestions that ADD OR CHANGE aspects of the game away from what they envisioned the game to be. and their vision more or less is to have an UNFORGIVING zombie apocalypse voxel based survival game. which to me is a perfect concept for the game as is. which pvp is actually pretty good in this game as is. sure there could be some few changes that could be made to make it better. but the whole point of what TFP devs are saying is that they don't want to change or add too much code and game mechanics that make it feel less like an UNFORGIVING zombie apocalypse voxel based survival game. which is what most of these suggestions in this thread would inevitably do.

honestly were getting ahead of ourselves here and if we keep trying to push all these new features straight outta OTHER PVP games TFP is going to read the first two pages of this thread and immediately dismiss it and PVP will never see the light of day because the suggestions made here are just going to reinforce their fear that people just want to change their game.

this thread should be about making changes to the game that is already there, and adding things that have already been talked about for THEIR games development to make pvp viable in the game and said games mechanics that have already been implemented and or talked about being features in the past during this whole development process. keep the changes simple yet not too hard to do that fixes the most issues that we as PVPr's see.

so in conclusion we need to start thinking about what could help PVP within the game and confines of 7 DAYS TO DIE and not any other game. and that raises our chances that TFP won't just end up dismissing the idea and not do it in the first place and NONE of us get what we want.

P.S. i know you guys are prob thinking i've been a ♥♥♥♥ but unlike most people in this forum i'm actually listening and understanding what TFP developers are saying. and also unlike most people in this forum i'm actually trying to defend them and what they have been saying.

Hi Sy,

Only, 4, 8, 13, 15 & 17 refer to things not currently 'within' 7dtd, the rest are just changes to existing systems.

 

[Sinz]

okay i don't get what the misunderstanding is of what i'm trying to say.
TFP and all the devs keep saying the same thing, "we don't want this to be just like every PVP game"

what does that mean? that means that they don't want features or suggestions that ADD OR CHANGE aspects of the game away from what they envisioned the game to be. and their vision more or less is to have an UNFORGIVING zombie apocalypse voxel based survival game. which to me is a perfect concept for the game as is. which pvp is actually pretty good in this game as is. sure there could be some few changes that could be made to make it better. but the whole point of what TFP devs are saying is that they don't want to change or add too much code and game mechanics that make it feel less like an UNFORGIVING zombie apocalypse voxel based survival game. which is what most of these suggestions in this thread would inevitably do.

honestly were getting ahead of ourselves here and if we keep trying to push all these new features straight outta OTHER PVP games TFP is going to read the first two pages of this thread and immediately dismiss it and PVP will never see the light of day because the suggestions made here are just going to reinforce their fear that people just want to change their game.

this thread should be about making changes to the game that is already there, and adding things that have already been talked about for THEIR games development to make pvp viable in the game and said games mechanics that have already been implemented and or talked about being features in the past during this whole development process. keep the changes simple yet not too hard to do that fixes the most issues that we as PVPr's see.

so in conclusion we need to start thinking about what could help PVP within the game and confines of 7 DAYS TO DIE and not any other game. and that raises our chances that TFP won't just end up dismissing the idea and not do it in the first place and NONE of us get what we want.

P.S. i know you guys are prob thinking i've been a ♥♥♥♥ but unlike most people in this forum i'm actually listening and understanding what TFP developers are saying. and also unlike most people in this forum i'm actually trying to defend them and what they have been saying.

I think you're being really argumentative for no good reason.

You're a troll.

Their game will never be like every other PvP game. It's one of a kind.

You don't speak on behalf of TFP so you can't dictate further meaning behind their comments like you have here.

TFP openly said the main inspirations for the kickstarter and the game are fallout, minecraft and the TV series the walking dead.

So they clearly don't care if they take inspiration from other sources. No developers restrict themselves like that. Even if every idea someone had was original to them, most of their ideas have already been done before. I think you're missing the point.

Your statements contradict TFPs statements completely. Suggesting that TFP would dismiss comments from their own request for suggestions?

Madmole said he likes pvp and wants to make pvp in 7dtd awesome.

The only person dismissing ideas here is you.

Most people are trying their best to suggestion ideas that don't negatively effect the player vs environment. Not every idea is perfect. But this thread is a place to brainstorm. Most of the ideas shared here can be implemented into the game in a balanced fashion without any negative impact on player vs environment, contrary to what you're saying and you're not the official judge and executioner for other peoples suggestions.

You want to hear ideas that fit the accusations you're making?

Here:

We should have starting classes with loadouts with a primary weapon, seconady weapon and equipment like grenades and when we respawn we should respawn with a new loadout #make7dtdintocod

The radiation zone should get smaller every in game day #make7dtdbattleroyal

Take away building and crafting #takeawayeverythinguniqueabout7dtd

What a joke.

 

[Sy Tarn]

You want to hear ideas that fit the accusations you're making?

Here:

We should have starting classes with loadouts with a primary weapon, seconady weapon and equipment like grenades and when we respawn we should respawn with a new loadout #make7dtdintocod

The radiation zone should get smaller every in game day #make7dtdbattleroyal

Take away building and crafting #takeawayeverythinguniqueabout7dtd

What a joke.

and now your just being a dumbass. because that's exactly what has been more or less happening since this thread started. and now with that comment your just being an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

i've said my piece and when nothing happens and pvp never gets its love and TFP pretty much tells you the reason like i've been saying i'll be able to say i told you so.

 

[bloom_meister]

Guys, remember, TFP want ideas from us, it doesn't matter that we cant get everyone to agree with everything, that's just life. What we can do however is make our list of suggested changes and let TFP think them over and choose what they think fits with their game and resources in the timespan that's given.

I can guarantee you they wont implement all the suggestions but even if we only got 1/3 well, hey, that would be progress ..right?

On that happy note, lets collaborate, not be uncivil, we can save that for the next time I see either of you on a pvp server and make a hole in the ground out of your base whilst teabagging your corpse

 

[Drunkwolf]

This idea might just be more of a option added to servers. but some kind of judgement hour option like they do in life is feudal would be nice. so people can know what days their bases would be open to raid and can be online for fun pvp battles. instead of people just waiting for you to log off then raid your base and take everything.

or maybe a option for factions, maybe split the map into 3 zones, what ever zone you build your base in is your faction and you cant pvp your own guys but anybody else wandering into your teams zone is fair game.

 

[Sinz]

Guys, remember, TFP want ideas from us, it doesn't matter that we cant get everyone to agree with everything, that's just life. What we can do however is make our list of suggested changes and let TFP think them over and choose what they think fits with their game and resources in the timespan that's given.
I can guarantee you they wont implement all the suggestions but even if we only got 1/3 well, hey, that would be progress ..right?

On that happy note, lets collaborate, not be uncivil, we can save that for the next time I see either of you on a pvp server and make a hole in the ground out of your base whilst teabagging your corpse

I agree. Well said.

 

[Qyzer]

Not sure how much this will help, since it's just 1v1 PvP. but my daughter and I have a LOT of fun playing PvP against each other by:

1) Creating a new game in Navezgane each time

2) Turning on the creative menu

3) Blowing the crap out of each other for a few hours.

I'm convinced that PvP is more of a mode than something you add to a leveling/crafting/survival game. I get that people DO like the idea of having player enemies while doing all of that, but open world PvP had never worked well where the people playing weren't relatively evenly matched in terms of options. When people aren't relatively evenly matched it's really not PvP in my opinion, it's just ganking (unless a better player is limiting themselves to prove their ability).

I'm not saying there shouldn't be a PvP option in the normal game, but I just don't see how it's ever going be a lot better as long as people can literally get weeks worth of work ahead of each other. PvP is just not something I see as a fixed thing outside of a mod or a separate play mode.

 

[bloom_meister]

Qyzer,

Why on earth should the enemies be evenly matched? one guy might have put in 200 hours gearing up on that server and you expect him to be even to some guy playing an hour? If you want that type of game go play COD or something similar

The level 1 guy with a rubbish pistol can however still kill the guy with 200 hours, just need to play smart and be skillful, things that come with time and experience, which has a value in this game.

 

[Qyzer]

Qyzer,
Why on earth should the enemies be evenly matched? ...

I said "relatively evenly" to note they don't need to be exactly the same. And they should be relatively even because I prefer PvP as a contest between players, not a contest between character gear (or stats) and a player. It's fine if you feel differently, but I'd call that G(S)vP ("Gear(Stats) vs Player, more widely known as "ganking") which I don't personally feel is very fun PvP.

... If you want that type of game go play COD or something similar...

Luckily I don't have to. I'm having tons of fun doing PvP in 7 Days via new Navezgane maps and the creative menu. I am thinking of making a mod to make it even easier. One of the best things about 7 Days is that they have given us so much freedom to mod things to create the game we want to play and they seem to be very focused on making it even easier. We don't have to rely on the devs getting everything exactly configured to our personal preferences.

 

[skullpoker]

Not sure how much this will help, since it's just 1v1 PvP. but my daughter and I have a LOT of fun playing PvP against each other by:
1) Creating a new game in Navezgane each time

2) Turning on the creative menu

3) Blowing the crap out of each other for a few hours.

I'm convinced that PvP is more of a mode than something you add to a leveling/crafting/survival game. I get that people DO like the idea of having player enemies while doing all of that, but open world PvP had never worked well where the people playing weren't relatively evenly matched in terms of options. When people aren't relatively evenly matched it's really not PvP in my opinion, it's just ganking (unless a better player is limiting themselves to prove their ability).

I'm not saying there shouldn't be a PvP option in the normal game, but I just don't see how it's ever going be a lot better as long as people can literally get weeks worth of work ahead of each other. PvP is just not something I see as a fixed thing outside of a mod or a separate play mode.

That's just about perfect. Levels and skills and RNG loot are why 7 days is not a game for PvP. Even Blizzard recognized this and limited PvP to specific level ranges. Putting someone at level 1 with no gear up against players at level cap with the best gear in the game simply isn't fun. Creative Mode is a good counter for that since you can get any gear you want to try out, but it is still very limited in Alpha 16 since there are so few weapons.

Maybe TFP should try a PvP mode with no levels or skills and Creative Mode enabled by default. That way a player just joining the server will stand a chance against somebody who plays there frequently, and so people wouldn't be discouraged from joining a PvP server that has been active for 1000 days.

 

[Hydr0]

i think that the main problem with pvp are the bases, best pvp bases are those not found, but then you are missing 98% of the game. I dont think there is a way to make a base "secure".

what i would do without completely changing the game:

1- lcb to be 100% effective all times, that means no raiding yes, but then you can enjoy the game as it is and have some pvp elsewhere. make your anti zombie base or your big design Maybe this point could be revisited later as its not the best solution. I dont think that raiding is any fun as it is now, neither pvp "secure" base building. Disallow lcb near cities to prevent abuses.

2 - Next thing is to stimulate/force players encounter and compete for resources.

Ways to achieve this:

> specific zones to be more interesting , example : 500% loot and loot respawn in "main city" and 10% elsewhere, extra quality loot etc.

> Make some special random events like announced number of airdrops in a city. loot respawn etc etc so you move the players into specific area where they fight for resources.

> having resources only in a specific place having weapons only in a specific city, or having a single gas station with no gas elsewhere, or maybe the minibike parts can only be found in a store in the city on desert and loot spawns only the day after the horde.....

 

[bloom_meister]

i think that the main problem with pvp are the bases, best pvp bases are those not found, but then you are missing 98% of the game. I dont think there is a way to make a base "secure".
what i would do without completely changing the game:

1- lcb to be 100% effective all times, that means no raiding yes, but then you can enjoy the game as it is and have some pvp elsewhere. make your anti zombie base or your big design Maybe this point could be revisited later as its not the best solution. I dont think that raiding is any fun as it is now, neither pvp "secure" base building. Disallow lcb near cities to prevent abuses.

Hi Hydra,

The thread is for new suggestions/ideas so the above one doesnt count as you already have the ability for land claims to have infinite online AND offline protection. As for disallowing LCB in or near cities, this is definitely an idea that some enjoy and some admins make this part of their server rules.

I would add that the definition of PvP is not fixed and that in my own experience the majority of PvP players (by far) enjoy the ability to raid as well as the player to player combat but here we are into opinions rather than suggestions, if you take my point

I like your suggestions on encouraging pvp by having more limited resources to fight over but again this is possible today by a combination of '% loot drop', for example setting it to 25% and 'Loot respawn' by setting it to a long duration (30 days seems very common) both of which are existing server configuration options.

There is another way to decrease loot availability but you need to edit the xml for that. What you do is look at the types of loot you want to be rare, for example military weapons, and then decrease the spawn chance of the POI's containing those loot containers down to whatever rarity you feel is required.