JCrook1028
New member
They did NOT "duck and crawl" there. They FELL from the ceiling and stumbled. Got another example for me to show you wrong with?
PC Is there a reason behind Zombie digging & Matrix-esque abilities?
- Thread starter Paiper Zombee
- Start date
theFlu
Well-known member
That doorway-part; Arlene got stunned, fell on her back, her stunned body making the doorway into 1.5 block high space. Because of that, Edgar figured he'd have to crawl after the stun animation clears and so he did. Arlene was already dead by that time, but the animation sequence didn't update for it.
Ramethzer0
Well-known member
Why do folks go for the complicated answers when simpler ones are much more in line with reality?
They already compensated for that initial fall. They only had to move down one block (which doesn't stumble them) to get to the door because they landed on what looked like a desk which was behind the wall when he peeked in finally.
I said I could get behind the idea that the animations (and in your example, the timing of them) but I have experienced it on open ground. I don't tape my sessions, so I can't prove it. But hey.. I mean if you're into this to prove people wrong on the internet with just as much lack of actual proof, you can go find another chew toy, friendo.
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Boidster
New member
What am I supposed to do with these 10,000 spoons, when all I need is a knife?
Rameth. Buddy. You have made a claim about how the zombies behave. We all have provided evidence that that claim doesn't seem to be correct, including looks into the actual code. You provided 3rd-party video evidence, and people explained how the behaviors shown exactly match known, expected zombie behavior. At this point there is zero convincing evidence from you. You have a claim, and strong feelings about it. That's cool and we can't prove a negative so hey maybe you've discovered something new (and not visible in the code somehow).
But ya gotta provide evidence that can't be explained by known existing zombie behaviors. There are dozens of hours of video of people fighting hordes out in the open. If zombies are pro-actively dodging attacks, it should be fairly easy to find other people experiencing it. Frankly, it ought to be easy to find many people complaining about too-smart zombies which anticipate attacks. But for now there's only you. It would be pretty neat to be the one who discovers a new zombie behavior that nobody else noticed.
Ramethzer0
Well-known member
See, this is an assumption. I never once said that my claim was 100% positive. I'm trying to have a discussion about it, but there are people that take discussions as challenges and not as two adults trying to get to the bottom of a situation. The only thing I've said is that I'm skeptical. When you posted about the code, this doesn't really do much to tell me anything, because I don't know what any of that means, and as I've said previously - I have a difficult time just taking people's word for it. Roland seemed to make a joke, which tells me he might just wanna torture me with the unknowns (which, btw.. jerkface
) or maybe there really isn't a straightforward answer to it.I'm pointing out literally, that I just need more proof for me to understand. Nothing more, nothing less. Until I get more reliable evidence that I understand, I don't see a reason to change my stance on the matter. There is nothing about having that process that is unreasonable.
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theFlu
Well-known member
I don't know if you're referring to me as an adolescent - and I don't mind if you are - but I did post my interpretation in exactly the spirit you're looking for; trying to describe the event as I see it unfold, so you can go and compare if I might be correct. I sometimes tend to be short in my replies, which may feel hostile, but I'm describing reality the best I can. "As I see it", of course.
That also applies to "why the complex route"; if the reality is complex, I'll rather deal with the complexity when I can, than try to come up with inaccurate shorthands.
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Roland
Community Moderator
Roland seemed to make a joke, which tells me he might just wanna torture me with the unknowns (which, btw.. jerkface
It was Matrix reference humor. That's all.
Zombies don't dodge player attacks. Deer don't move at the last moment knowing exactly when you are going to pull the trigger to make you miss. I believe there is still some work to be done with transitional animations to make the move from standing to crouching and back again less instantaneous.
Minkles
New member
I stopped playing after alpha 16 as I liked my hidey hole…. I’ve only recently come back n giving it another go as I had 800 hours in this game until that point.
I’ve rolled back to alpha 19 as I like farming and I’m on Pregen01. I’ve set myself up in the red fire station across from the trader and I’m having a blast haha.
I’ve rolled back to alpha 19 as I like farming and I’m on Pregen01. I’ve set myself up in the red fire station across from the trader and I’m having a blast haha.
Laz Man
Fun Pimps Staff
That video is a good example, at a quick glance it looks like an animation of some type was missing.
Like moe went into fall down animation after getting hit and instead of him going into a standing up animation, it jumped immediately into a crouched swing animation.
I vaguely recall faatal mentioning he used existing animations for the new crawling one so perhaps the problem lies somewhere in that area.
Will check with him and see if a bug report would be good for this or if its already in the pipe line.
Like moe went into fall down animation after getting hit and instead of him going into a standing up animation, it jumped immediately into a crouched swing animation.
I vaguely recall faatal mentioning he used existing animations for the new crawling one so perhaps the problem lies somewhere in that area.
Will check with him and see if a bug report would be good for this or if its already in the pipe line.
BFT2020
Well-known member
No need to worry about your memory, he discussed exactly that. Got the AI done, but the animations were still not ready; used what was already there in order to start testing the new AI
JCrook1028
New member
Actually no. You're the one making assumptions. Reading you the code is sharing a fact, not an assumption.
Stranded_Napkin
New member
This is a really poor argument. The game is perfectly fine as is because you can cheat to get what you want. How is that a good thing? A horde night where you can just tool around in your base or AFK should be a reward for coming up with a good enough base to be able to do that at all. You're just taking Kage848's perspective and pulling a 180 from the direction he takes. If you can do all those things to not deal with the blood moon, why is it so necessary that TFP go out of their way to force you to deal with it? The whole thing is just illogical and robs the player of agency.
Jinx_DG
New member
Maybe not.... BUT the Ninja Rabbits are Real. One minute you're chasing them through the grass... hard left then a hard right then a fake 180 which is really a 360 then POOF... Gone. As you sit there staring at the monitor trying to subdue the motion queazies you're left asking.... Where TF did it go??? Ninja Rabbits.
You are bringing new arguments to a month old thread. I don't have the time to reread the whole thread to know exactly what the argument was all about and I don't know what Kage has to do with it as there doesn't seem to be a post by him in this thread, he isn't even mentioned at all.
So I have to ignore part of your argument and can only answer generally:
I probably did not say the game is fine BECAUSE you can cheat to get what you want. I probably said the game is fine EVEN THOUGH you can cheat to get what you want. Because when a player uses a cheat he also knows he is outside the vanilla game, he knows that he cheats. It is a psychologically hurdle and that is all that TFP can achieve really.
Because this game is moddable and its protection against patching is completely optional there is no way TFP can prevent cheats in the general sense. Save-scumming and patching and modding the game are ways to remove danger from the game that TFP can't and in the case of modding does not want to remove. So the only option left is the pschological barrier. I.e. saying that vanilla IS the horror adventure crafting ... game, playing anything else is possible but there is no guarantee at all what game that might result in. Is there still horror and danger, accomplishments, narrow escapes from death? No idea.
"You don't want horror, don't like spider zombies, you want a horde night that consists only of distant zombie sounds in your headphones or no horde night at all? Go ahead, we want you to be happy. But we still want to show other people our vision of the horror adventure crafting ... game how we envisioned it. Play vanilla and you will not be able to simply avoid horde night, you will have to work for your safety". (Note I can't speak for TFP, I just guess this is something they might say about their game).
And this is the minimum the game should try to achieve (unless all it wants to be is a pure sandbox game) and also the maximum it can inside the parameters of a freely moddable game.
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theFlu
Well-known member
"Agency"; yup. Because having agency must mean you're never in any threat at all. Also, it's a game; 99.99% of your choices are already pre-emptively removed. You can't grapple. You can't kick. You can't shoot from the safety of your 4x4. You can't fall off your vehicle upon impact. You can't lock a door you just got the key to. You can't turn off a quest generator. You can't ... a whole lot.
You can't hide under a layer of dirt and be safe from a horde? Who told you these things were Predator?
Stranded_Napkin
New member
Dude, when you already have limited agency, losing more is unacceptable. Talk about weak arguments.
Old thread plus you didn't read the quoted text. Laziness isn't an argument. Nor is trying to weasel yourself around what you said. Kage was just a comparison. You can do this anyways so this. Same line of thinking but you went a different direction. A non-issue comment meant to keep the issue from becoming a meltdown. Too bad people are so freaking touchy here.
theFlu
Well-known member
I did read the quoted text. Probably I missed reading between the lines of my own writing?
It seems I told someone he can do lots of stuff to avoid horde if he wants. Which is fine by me. It doesn't bother me much in my own gaming, I can very easily ignore that stuff (like creative menue, god mode, turn off zombies button...).
BUT what would bother me would be easy in-game ways to ignore the horde night, like it was in previous alphas with just driving around. I'm all for cm and zombie-turn-off options. I'm all against removing the vultures that target you on bike. And I don't see that I do any weaseling with that statement. Can you point me to the place where I say something different?
Here you lost me completely.
Wait. You wanted to prevent a meltdown to occur in a month old dead thread ?
. Commendable but probably the wrong place.
Matt115
New member
I think he mean that perfect base against zombie should be main target for players. that's why people making castles or why prison was so good base in walking dead. Well only game similiar to 7dtd about defending base against zombie is metal gear survival and there zombie attack all you base not just making hole in one point ignoring rest of walls - so zombie AI is too smart because in some point perect base would be able to be passive defence that just need kiling special zombies and fixing weaked points of defence.I did read the quoted text. Probably I missed reading between the lines of my own writing?
It seems I told someone he can do lots of stuff to avoid horde if he wants. Which is fine by me. It doesn't bother me much in my own gaming, I can very easily ignore that stuff (like creative menue, god mode, turn off zombies button...).
BUT what would bother me would be easy in-game ways to ignore the horde night, like it was in previous alphas with just driving around. I'm all for cm and zombie-turn-off options. I'm all against removing the vultures that target you on bike. And I don't see that I do any weaseling with that statement. Can you point me to the place where I say something different?
This is just interpretation what he mean and he not mean cheating as using god mode or turn off zombie but make perfect base against zombie
Roland
Community Moderator
He means he does not like it when the developers add zombie behaviors to the game that end what used to be a player choice.
Players used to be able to drive around on horde night without any risk. Homing Vultures ended that player choice.
Players used to be able to dig under ground a couple of blocks on any night and be 100% safe. Digging zombies ended that player choice.
Players used to be able to tread water and be 100% safe from zombies. Swimming zombies ended that player choice.
Players used to be able to stand behind 1.5 meter gaps and melee and shoot zombies without risk. Ducking and crawling zombies ended that player choice.
Up until about a week ago players were able to stand on poles and be 98% safe. Pole hitting zombies ended that player choice.
In his mind the developers are taking away important player choices.
Players used to be able to drive around on horde night without any risk. Homing Vultures ended that player choice.
Players used to be able to dig under ground a couple of blocks on any night and be 100% safe. Digging zombies ended that player choice.
Players used to be able to tread water and be 100% safe from zombies. Swimming zombies ended that player choice.
Players used to be able to stand behind 1.5 meter gaps and melee and shoot zombies without risk. Ducking and crawling zombies ended that player choice.
Up until about a week ago players were able to stand on poles and be 98% safe. Pole hitting zombies ended that player choice.
In his mind the developers are taking away important player choices.