PC How this game is supposed to be played

[mr.devolver]

It already got old!
Of old watching videos of you, G4K, GameEdged etc. craft huge interesting bases and all the cool things that came with that was awesome. Lots of creativity, randomness, striving for progression, luck of the draw on loot drops (screaming like a girl at an early game mini bike book find) in an openworld sandbox tower defense with Z's fun game.

Now watching the stamina management simulator with one horde per POI is not entertaining. Watching G4K with the cam you can often see it is in his expressions, "wtf, seriously game!" (and as i type that i hear his voice in my head lol).

I feel for 7DTD content creators who built their channels around the game because while many viewers will remain for me the draw of watching A17e in its current form has gone.

It's going action fps game rather than what it built it's loyal fan base on. Very few people put 1000's of hours into a game of whack a Z, Minecraft with Z's on the other hand i'll invest that time.

I will definitely keep watching videos from GameEdged, he's one of my favorite youtubers. He's funny, even his voice is funny when he talks to zombies and gives them names like George (his name for a business man zombie) and it never gets old when he goes bravely "Come on, you little sh*t!" only to get beaten up nearly to death.

 

[Bubbahotetp]

Because those other 2-3 ways of beating the horde night weren't intended, they were either exploits or cheap cop outs; such as digging a hole in the ground and hiding in it, going up on a roof top and then destroying the ladders, building a fence with certain blocks that confused the AI so that it was impossible for zombies to get you... etc.
Some people loved doing that, but truly speaking that's not what the intention of having a 7 day horde was.

So, "truly speaking" you are telling people how to play the game even if they think they are having fun doing what ever they feel like doing? If I want to defend against a horde by building a huge field of yucca as a wall, can you come and tell me "that way of beating the horde night wasn't intended - you have to remove those!" Why is it up to anybody but the player how they want to do what they want to do?

What the intention of something is, should be up to the player, and the player should have options to find their own way of doing things when and however they please, without having illogical rules and restrictions posed on them just because the "gods" had other intentions for something. That doesn't make sense! Once you release a build it is actually out of your hands what people do with it and going in and trying to control everybody's behaviour with sanctioning game mechanics is really nothing but a ♥♥♥♥ move! Fixing bugs is one thing, but first opening up all sorts of possibilities, making them work, and then all of the sudden shutting them down is downright idiotic!

After years of existing gameplay they now go in and yank away options and freedom of choice because something wasn't intended? That's just messed up! And you know why I don't even think that's a valid argument? Because who put the frigging stuff into the game in the first place?? It sure wasn't the players! If they didn't intend it - why did they spend years putting it into the game??

The result of all this is now a boring mess where I don't have any personal influence over my game-style and gaming experience because I have to follow a cookie cutter path to what ever "they" envisioned. Linear gaming, anybody? As if there weren't 100.000 games like that already!

And I don't for the life of me understand players who now are standing up for all the restrictions, applauding the lack of choice that suddenly is the norm. If they didn't like a certain play-style then why the hell didn't they just play it the way they wanted it back in a16?? Is it because they somehow have to prove to every player on the server that they have the biggest horde night defending balls since first horde and everybody not doing the same should be punished? I honestly couldn't care less about those people, and if I wanna be behind my yucca wall, let me be there and get the f* out of my claim zone!

 

[enragedcamel]

So, "truly speaking" you are telling people how to play the game even if they think they are having fun doing what ever they feel like doing? If I want to defend against a horde by building a huge field of yucca as a wall, can you come and tell me "that way of beating the horde night wasn't intended - you have to remove those!" Why is it up to anybody but the player how they want to do what they want to do?

If you want to be able to do literally anything, you can. Edit the XMLs, enable the in-game editor, mod the ♥♥♥♥ out of everything... you have the ability to do those things.

But the "default" game experience is up to the devs to design.

 

[Bubbahotetp]

Pssst... here's a secret...
You don't have to kill all the zombies. No, seriously.

Lots of people are talking about how you are "forced" to kill zombies to go up levels quickly. But what does killing zombies and going up levels actually get you? Yes, it unlocks some perks, but it also pushes up the Gamestage and makes the zombies harder.

If you take it easier and kill as few zombies as you can get away with, then you have more time to scavenge, trade, and loot and more time to build and repair before the Gamestage starts going through the roof. For any particular Gamestage you'll be more prepared and better equipped to deal with it.

Rushing levels to get the higher perks is counterproductive because you're making things harder on yourself by ramping up the Gamestage too quickly rather than making things easier on yourself.

Good to know that I now have to play by some arbitrary formula to feel that I'm having the most fun! Awesome. (That was sarcasm).

 

[Darthjake]

If you're a base builder, the best way to enjoy the game is to MOD it. Much like Fallout or Morrowind, 7DtD is a flawed gem that needs mods to shine, especially for turtles and people who play SP.

7D2D is in Alpha, I understand this.

This build is experimental, I understand this too.

Why do I have to mod a game to make it a better experience? They, (the Pimps), might have as an option to make things harder, Dead is Dead, GPS Zombies homing in to your support struts, etc. Do they enhance my play? No.

Am I having fun in 7 Days now? Some, not nearly as much as I was before, but some. I now feel like it's 7 Days to walk somewhere.

7 Days to starve, while I'm eating already. Yes, I've been eating and had the game tell me I'm starving.

I use stilt bases, yes, but I also defend them too. So don't go calling me a care-bear builder only, yeah I like to build, but I'll smash, crush, and make holes in the Z's when I need to do so. I don't crouch in my base at night waiting for them to eat me. Night time is my time to harvest materials and explore some. I don't mind not magically knowing when the Z's sense me, but I also don't like them homing in on me like, well, a GPS compass. This needs to be fixed.

I shot a hungry Z in a dark house, moved from my firing point, and watched as she tracked me with unerring precision. Thankfully, it was a sneaking headshot, and one powerswing of my iron reinforced club put her down, but what if it had been a cop? (Well I would not have engaged then, but thats a different story...)

The Pimps, have made some strides, but they've also taken a few steps back, in my opinion. Hopefully they will listen and not assume that all is well with the world since lots of people have 17 experimental still loaded on our computers, because we're trying to cope, rather then happily eating out of the slop trough we've had dished out to us.

 

[Drunkwolf]

I think people have been sitting in their bases to long drinking tea and letting the OP spikes kill all the zombies for them. they forgot how to actually go out and hunt zombies and get those levels! The super easy mode that was alpha 16 made people lazy. now they get to level 10 and give up because they dont have a forge yet when getting to level 20 is nothing. or they are use to zombie loot giving them everything after the spikes kill them and dont want to venture into town anymore. i dunno what the deal is, i was level 60 in 2 real days playing it isnt hard to level and its fun.

cant wait to design a horde base with no spikes so i can get all that delicious xp for myself.

 

[Roland]

And I don't for the life of me understand players who now are standing up for all the restrictions, applauding the lack of choice that suddenly is the norm.

What if it’s simply because I don’t feel restricted as you do?

There was always a period of time that you couldn’t build a forge. It used to be random. Then it was a day. Now it is somewhere between 5 - 10 days.

You can still build a base, take over a POI, go underground, and/or play Nomad.

I’ve played several very different games where I only majored in Strength or Agility or Fortitude or Intellect or Perception and minored in one of the others. Very interesting and different feeling games.

I’ve played using the traders and ignoring the traders.

I don’t particularly care for level gates either but see them as a non issue for the most part because I’m fine progressing slowly and like to fully experience each step in progression. I understand that not everyone does.

But there is still plenty that can be done and all the ways of playing once you stop believing them to be impossible.

 

[DrTeath]

Ok, so, before you get set up to do real base building, take a poi, and set it up as your base . Mark it on your map. Do not set your claim block there .

To set up for horde night , find a large poi, clear it and set your claim block there . Turn the inside into a maze of traps and choke points so you can us your bow to hande the majority of zeds .

Find an isolated place in said poi to set as a respawn point , with a chest set up as a bug out bag if you need to gtfo .

after horde night , put your bed back in your main base , and continue to level until you can build something defensible . Repeat as needed.

 

[Bubbahotetp]

If you want to be able to do literally anything, you can. Edit the XMLs, enable the in-game editor, mod the ♥♥♥♥ out of everything... you have the ability to do those things.
But the "default" game experience is up to the devs to design.

Time will tell how much is left in the XMLs for the modders once the dust settles. All fine and good that they make the game they want - but let me put it like this: You buy a bicycle simulator and play it happily for years, and all of a sudden it becomes a Formula 1 simulator because someone decides that using two wheeled vehicles was never the intention of the game! Thanks!

 

[RestInPieces]

I don’t particularly care for level gates either but see them as a non issue for the most part because I’m fine progressing slowly and like to fully experience each step in progression. I understand that not everyone does.

I may be wrong on this, but I think that a lot of people would pay less attention to the gating, if it was more seamless. Atm they get a lot of points and have to spread them somewhere they may not want to, while they face a clear restriction. How they are gated doesn't practically make a difference, but it would be more prudent if they were gated by less obvious means, or by lack of points instead of a "wall".

 

[Roland]

Time will tell how much is left in the XMLs for the modders once the dust settles. All fine and good that they make the game they want - but let me put it like this: You buy a bicycle simulator and play it happily for years, and all of a sudden it becomes a Formula 1 simulator because someone decides that using two wheeled vehicles was never the intention of the game! Thanks!

The xmls have only become more robust and the devs have continually made new features of the game visible for modders to play with. There is absolutely no evidence of what you are insinuating “once the dust settles”. You are way off in crazy town now if you’re accusing these devs of backing off from keeping their game fully moddable.

Your metaphor depicts too extreme a change to be a good fit in my opinion. It’s more like it was mountain bike sim with no physics so you could just cruise down the mountain without risk or ruin but then they added physics so the old ways of just flying straight down no longer work.

You need to take a breather because your arguments have slipped into the ridiculous. It’s still 7 Days to Die and pretty much the same general game it’s always been. It is merely four days into experimental and they are waiting until they get a good measured picture of all feedback before making revisions. You’ve said your piece and I know for a fact the devs are aware of your stance. If your goal was to bring to light your feelings about the changes then mission accomplished

 

[mr.devolver]

You need to take a breather

I was thinking what would be the best way to describe gameplay of Alpha 17. I think this part of your post describes it perfectly. Give me at least a freaking bicycle early, please!

 

[bloom_meister]

I really thought there would be threads discussing new strategies and sharing ideas on how to survive horde night. I didn’t expect defeat threads where people would give up after less than a week with the game saying “It’s impossible!”

I just hit level 78, the game gets harder, not easier, and yes i have adapted my playstyle but when 3-5 feral irradiated cops and ferals jump out on you because you fell through a floor you did not know was broken, giving you a broken leg and then dying to said mobs, thats not a case of ''not adapting your playstyle'', thats just retarded

The more i level the more UNfun it gets, if anything i probably felt stronger at level 1 on day 1 with grass armour and a wooden club than i do at level 78, food sucks, stamina sucks, guns suck armour sucks, the feel of the game is like i am moving in treacle, just feels way less smooth than A16.

I have no incentive to travel, i am surrounded by POI 'dungeons' of which i cant even clear more than 4 in a full day, and thats if i am lucky so i wont ever see the rest of the map

I have no incentive to get more guns because the one i got on day 1 is the same as the one i got at level 78 on day 45.

I have no incentive to build a base because when i tried, using concrete, which was grindy as HELL to make, the zeds tore through it in under 1 minute

I cant hide underground because some total and utter idiot decided that they didnt want players playing the game how they liked and deliberately broke the playstyle of many players who like to bunker down and build, you know, like you would in a real apocolypse scenario and as we have been able to do for literally years now

I cant protect any base i do build because i can only place one claim and then it break after a few minutes anyway.

IF i wanted to explore i cant before my stamina runs out (with perks) in literally 6 seconds and you disabled every single stamina giving drink from A16 just leaving a very weak version of coffee because you want to FORCE us to suffer through the grind

So in summary I cant explore, i cant build, i cant hunt for upgrades because its pointless and i have to walk everywhere encumbered because again some IDIOT thought adding encumbrance would make the game more ''fun''.

I am trying very hard to keep going to see if there is ANY light at the end of the tunnel but tbh I dont see it

And dont even get me started on the single most idiotic thing, level gating perks which are already gated behind levelling and points so that NO-ONE can specialise in anything anymore, we are all just cookie cutter little clones.

You have broken this game badly and if you dont fix these glaring design erros then your playerbase will disappear and no new players are going to put hundreds or thousands of hours into THIS game

 

[Guppycur]

Bloom. Every paragraph worked... Except the last one.

Surely you see it.

 

[giKoN]

Bloom. Every paragraph worked... Except the last one.
Surely you see it.

Guess which one Roland will quote.

 

[DrTeath]

I may be wrong on this, but I think that a lot of people would pay less attention to the gating, if it was more seamless. Atm they get a lot of points and have to spread them somewhere they may not want to, while they face a clear restriction. How they are gated doesn't practically make a difference, but it would be more prudent if they were gated by less obvious means, or by lack of points instead of a "wall".

You arent forced to spread those points out . You dont loose them if you dont spend them. You can just be patient and wait to spend them when you hit the level you need for what you want .

 

[Sergoros]

The xmls have only become more robust and the devs have continually made new features of the game visible for modders to play with. There is absolutely no evidence of what you are insinuating “once the dust settles”. You are way off in crazy town now if you’re accusing these devs of backing off from keeping their game fully moddable.
Your metaphor depicts too extreme a change to be a good fit in my opinion. It’s more like it was mountain bike sim with no physics so you could just cruise down the mountain without risk or ruin but then they added physics so the old ways of just flying straight down no longer work.

You need to take a breather because your arguments have slipped into the ridiculous. It’s still 7 Days to Die and pretty much the same general game it’s always been. It is merely four days into experimental and they are waiting until they get a good measured picture of all feedback before making revisions. You’ve said your piece and I know for a fact the devs are aware of your stance. If your goal was to bring to light your feelings about the changes then mission accomplished ��

Emmm....Im sorry Roland, but this is just wrong. If we continue the metaphor, we would have a bike simulator, where you can build a big garage, with alot of upgrades. It was a very customisable garage. With alot of rooms for different purposes. And you can make many of them on the road. Now, you have only 1 lock to lock the garage, you can't make multiple garages now. And 1 lock is not even enough to protect your one garage anyway. Once its gone, anybody can steal your stuff.

Which in all together means, that game, from bike and garage simulator, has turned only in bike simulator. Sounds like a big cut, that xml can't fix btw.

 

[Mestema]

I just hit level 78, the game gets harder, not easier, and yes i have adapted my playstyle but when 3-5 feral irradiated cops and ferals jump out on you because you fell through a floor you did not know was broken, giving you a broken leg and then dying to said mobs, thats not a case of ''not adapting your playstyle'', thats just retarded
The more i level the more UNfun it gets, if anything i probably felt stronger at level 1 on day 1 with grass armour and a wooden club than i do at level 78, food sucks, stamina sucks, guns suck armour sucks, the feel of the game is like i am moving in treacle, just feels way less smooth than A16.

I have no incentive to travel, i am surrounded by POI 'dungeons' of which i cant even clear more than 4 in a full day, and thats if i am lucky so i wont ever see the rest of the map

I have no incentive to get more guns because the one i got on day 1 is the same as the one i got at level 78 on day 45.

I have no incentive to build a base because when i tried, using concrete, which was grindy as HELL to make, the zeds tore through it in under 1 minute

I cant hide underground because some total and utter idiot decided that they didnt want players playing the game how they liked and deliberately broke the playstyle of many players who like to bunker down and build, you know, like you would in a real apocolypse scenario and as we have been able to do for literally years now

I cant protect any base i do build because i can only place one claim and then it break after a few minutes anyway.

IF i wanted to explore i cant before my stamina runs out (with perks) in literally 6 seconds and you disabled every single stamina giving drink from A16 just leaving a very weak version of coffee because you want to FORCE us to suffer through the grind

So in summary I cant explore, i cant build, i cant hunt for upgrades because its pointless and i have to walk everywhere encumbered because again some IDIOT thought adding encumbrance would make the game more ''fun''.

I am trying very hard to keep going to see if there is ANY light at the end of the tunnel but tbh I dont see it

And dont even get me started on the single most idiotic thing, level gating perks which are already gated behind levelling and points so that NO-ONE can specialise in anything anymore, we are all just cookie cutter little clones.

You have broken this game badly and if you dont fix these glaring design erros then your playerbase will disappear and no new players are going to put hundreds or thousands of hours into THIS game

This is my exact statement, and after roaming various streams and chatting with wiewers, we're far from alone. Like zergs, really.

Exept the digging thing. The absence of digging made a16 end at day 30 mainly. Digging Z is exactly what missed in A16, with his very good balance of Z's block damage.

A base of A16 with A17's engine, POIs and Z's AI would make it almost perfect ! With traders that give only 1 quest/week.

 

[thraka]

I dont see any way to come up with new strats. And when people do come up with new strats they are labeled exploits and the zombies fixed to defeat them lol. I am already getting people telling me about strats but they will be considered exploits. Mark my words. The zombies are simply too smart at this point.

Yup. The cabal of people who judge what is BadWrongFun have an approved playstyle, and all others are exploits to be removed from the game.

 

[Xtrakicking]

So, "truly speaking" you are telling people how to play the game even if they think they are having fun doing what ever they feel like doing?

We could add unicorns and a way to tame them so we can fly into oblivion. Many people would find that fun. Should it be added, then? No. Definitely not.

With this I'm trying to tell you that the game has a certain premise, and everything the game has should aim to support that premise. In this case, the game is called 7 Days to Die, because every 7 days you get a huge horde swarming you, and you're supposed to build a fortress and defend it against that horde. That's the main premise of the game.

If there's an exploit that allows the player to dig a 2 meter deep hole in the ground and hide in it every horde night, then that's something that needs to get removed, because it's not intended and completely ruins the premise of the game.

What's the point of having reinforced steel walls and electrified, bladed traps if you can fight off the horde with a Yucca wall? It's plainly dumb. Nobody would care about the high tier items and everybody who actually wants a challenge would become bored extremely fast. This isn't Garry's Mod, this isn't a silly sandbox "screwing-around" game. This game is aiming to be a challenging survival, tower defense game. Obviously, not every playstyle will be satisfied.

That's just how it is.