PC Health bars locked behind INT perk?

Dimpy

Dimpy

New member
I just read this exchange in the thread "shotguns" and thought I'd put this kind of ridiculous idea in a new thread rather than clutter up that one.

Uhm... what? :D If I use a shotgun for more than 5-8 blocks, I feel like I do 0 damage!
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That's why we need HP bars. =P
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What I was thinking is that there's a perk you can buy to let you see zombie health bars, and maybe unlock some other "gross" UI elements. Of course, is there really anyone who'd buy that?

 
I just read this exchange in the thread "shotguns" and thought I'd put this kind of ridiculous idea in a new thread rather than clutter up that one.




What I was thinking is that there's a perk you can buy to let you see zombie health bars, and maybe unlock some other "gross" UI elements. Of course, is there really anyone who'd buy that?
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I am going to watch this thread carefully.

Some people HATE health bars on enemies.

Other people really like them.

My query is... why?

So, I'm going to be very interested in seeing how this one plays out.

 
I am going to watch this thread carefully.
Some people HATE health bars on enemies.

Other people really like them.

My query is... why?

So, I'm going to be very interested in seeing how this one plays out.
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Same here. Honestly, they should just give the option to turn them on and off. I'm sure that at least most people would have them on, and modders would find them very helpful for getting exact damage numbers. The only real argument against them is that it might break immersion a little, which I actually agree with, which is the whole point of making them a toggle option just like air drop marker.

 
The reason I suggested locking it behind a perk as opposed to being an option is that it is an advantage in the sense of allowing you to more effectively metagame, at the cost of immersion. Come to think of it, perhaps hit markers and that loud "thump" you hear when successfully pulling of a long-range shot should perk-locked too, under the same principle.

 
The reason I suggested locking it behind a perk as opposed to being an option is that it is an advantage in the sense of allowing you to more effectively metagame, at the cost of immersion. Come to think of it, perhaps hit markers and that loud "thump" you hear when successfully pulling of a long-range shot should perk-locked too, under the same principle.
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I don't know. I feel like anything that could possibly be immersion breaking should be behind a selectable option so that people can choose to activate it or not. It would create just as much of an advantage as selecting zombies to always walk regardless of being feral, blood horde, or it being night, or turning up loot quantity, etc. This is all part of people customizing their game to play the way they want while maintaining the mechanics.

 
I am going to watch this thread carefully.
Some people HATE health bars on enemies.

Other people really like them.

My query is... why?

So, I'm going to be very interested in seeing how this one plays out.
Click to expand...
I hate health bars, immersion (that's right, I used this argument lmao) breaking imo

 
I think the argument of immersion breaking is sort of irrelevant with this discussion mainly because it's meant to show you how much damage you have inflicted on an enemy. What would work better is if a zombie taking damage was progressively bloodied more and more and damaged more and more visually to be able to tell if you are getting close to killing it.

Same thing with the weapon sound hitting, normally you wouldn't know if you hit something, and I really like the idea of locking away the UI behind certain perks to make it that you can tailor your experience. If KNOWING you hit something is important to you, buy the perk, if you want to know what time it is, get a watch, or buy the perk, how about an actual compass and not starting with one on the screen?

This discussion has implications that can reach several aspects of the game if you push for it, the map, UI unlocks, and helping sounds are all game when it comes to this type of stuff and I sort of like that.

Several survival games have lot's of success with a system like this that slowly adds useful information for you, after all we don't want to make it too easy right?

Last point is the hate people get on the water and food bars... saying it's immersion breaking... well in real life I don't need to open a window and check my character screen to see how hungry I am... I just know, hence my point about it being immersion breaking is sort of irrelevant, some important pieces of information you would normally have no problem knowing in real life are difficult to get to and not intuitive.

 
i love it that you need to look twice if a enemy is death or not
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Unfortunately once a zombie goes down, they tend to get right back up, especially now with them getting up much faster. Not like the early days of Resident Evil where a downed zombie might just be playing possum and waiting for you to get close enough to take a chunk out of your calf muscle. Now that would be an interesting addition to the game. The ultimate sleeper. Play dead till you're close enough to attack. Should make for some interesting pants wetting moments.

 
I think the argument of immersion breaking is sort of irrelevant with this discussion mainly because it's meant to show you how much damage you have inflicted on an enemy. What would work better is if a zombie taking damage was progressively bloodied more and more and damaged more and more visually to be able to tell if you are getting close to killing it.
Same thing with the weapon sound hitting, normally you wouldn't know if you hit something, and I really like the idea of locking away the UI behind certain perks to make it that you can tailor your experience. If KNOWING you hit something is important to you, buy the perk, if you want to know what time it is, get a watch, or buy the perk, how about an actual compass and not starting with one on the screen?

This discussion has implications that can reach several aspects of the game if you push for it, the map, UI unlocks, and helping sounds are all game when it comes to this type of stuff and I sort of like that.

Several survival games have lot's of success with a system like this that slowly adds useful information for you, after all we don't want to make it too easy right?

Last point is the hate people get on the water and food bars... saying it's immersion breaking... well in real life I don't need to open a window and check my character screen to see how hungry I am... I just know, hence my point about it being immersion breaking is sort of irrelevant, some important pieces of information you would normally have no problem knowing in real life are difficult to get to and not intuitive.
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I have to agree with a lot of these points. Many survival games i.e. Stranded Deep, Green Hell, etc make use of very minimalistic UI and utilize a smartwatch to show vitals, time, etc.

However, I don't want this to turn into a 3D zombie version of Upgrade The Game. That would be a catastrophe.

Progressive damage was something that used to be at least partially in the game with dismemberment. Now it seems that all but decapitations with perk points have been removed. I like this idea actually since it would have a more realistic feel.

 
I think the argument of immersion breaking is sort of irrelevant with this discussion mainly because it's meant to show you how much damage you have inflicted on an enemy. What would work better is if a zombie taking damage was progressively bloodied more and more and damaged more and more visually to be able to tell if you are getting close to killing it.
Same thing with the weapon sound hitting, normally you wouldn't know if you hit something, and I really like the idea of locking away the UI behind certain perks to make it that you can tailor your experience. If KNOWING you hit something is important to you, buy the perk, if you want to know what time it is, get a watch, or buy the perk, how about an actual compass and not starting with one on the screen?

This discussion has implications that can reach several aspects of the game if you push for it, the map, UI unlocks, and helping sounds are all game when it comes to this type of stuff and I sort of like that.

Several survival games have lot's of success with a system like this that slowly adds useful information for you, after all we don't want to make it too easy right?

Last point is the hate people get on the water and food bars... saying it's immersion breaking... well in real life I don't need to open a window and check my character screen to see how hungry I am... I just know, hence my point about it being immersion breaking is sort of irrelevant, some important pieces of information you would normally have no problem knowing in real life are difficult to get to and not intuitive.
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Yeah I agree with a lot of this.

However....

I makes me wonder if the discrepancy between opinions on this matter have something to do with how people perceive and/or interpret the world.

We know some are more visual, some like to hold things in their hands, some are more introspective.

So... to some it makes sense that you should have SOMETHING to indicate the health as our real senses aren't available.

[The hunger example was perfect!]

To others it makes sense to avoid visual indicators as this breaks immersion and might even be distracting.

I don't really have any science atm to back this up but it's really got me wondering.

 
Yeah I agree with a lot of this.
I makes me wonder if the discrepancy between opinions on this matter have something to do with how people perceive and/or interpret the world.

We know some are more visual, some like to hold things in their hands, some are more introspective.

So... to some it makes sense that you should have SOMETHING to indicate the health as our real senses aren't available.

[The hunger example was perfect!]

To others it makes sense to avoid visual indicators as this breaks immersion and might even be distracting.

I don't really have any science atm to back this up but it's really got me wondering.
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Well, after giving it some thought, you could actually create "senses" for things like hunger, thirst, etc, with audio cues. Stomach growling, or maybe raspy breathing when you're getting dehydrated, and combine them with visual cues for things such as diseases...perhaps leaving little brown trails wherever you go when you have dysentary that zombies can smell and follow, vomiting for food poisoning, etc. I mean if we're really going for realism here, there's ways to make it happen, and other survival games have done that in some form or another.

 
LOL, thoroughly ridiculous! I'd buy it of course, if it couldn't be modded in.

So the immersion breaker argument - it runs both ways, although it's usually the "purists" that want more "realism" who refer to things as immersion-breaking.

Myself I want all the HUD info I can get. The more the better. What breaks immersion to me is that in a game world where a couple minutes is an hour combined with the fact that I am deprived of several senses (we've got a flat screen simulating 3d - no depth perception or peripheral vision and positional audio if we are lucky, non-positional if we aren't - like 7DTD) means every single ♥♥♥♥ing time I have to stop what I am doing and go into an inventory screen or guess at something, THAT to me is immersion breaking. Sit and read something? Ain't nobody got time fo'dat! Zombie bear spawn in and eat yo'ass in the time it takes you to read this paragraph.

 
Well, if then as option.

Simple point

That i Feel hungry or cold i can feel, so a info in Hud is ok.

If i hit a zombie and he goes down there is (except the head explode) no indicator if he is "finished"

Besides that Red HP bars over the head are a Arcade game element i dnt want in 7D2D

 
Well, if then as option.

Simple point

That i Feel hungry or cold i can feel, so a info in Hud is ok.

If i hit a zombie and he goes down there is (except the head explode) no indicator if he is "finished"

Besides that Red HP bars over the head are a Arcade game element i dnt want in 7D2D
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I think the idea of it being behind a perk is that you now have enough experience killing zombies to *know* when it's dead. This also doesn't mean there shouldn't be random options like zombies being revived based on several factors? If anything it could add a lot to the gameplay and make it more interesting still.

I remember a while ago the Fun Pimps saying they wanted randomly reviving zombies in the game...

EDIT: I think it's also important to wait till the next update since Roland already said the level gates are going to be removed in the next update... I imagine this will also come with some significant balancing changes and a revamp of the already awesome perk system.

 
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Well, if then as option.

Simple point

That i Feel hungry or cold i can feel, so a info in Hud is ok.

If i hit a zombie and he goes down there is (except the head explode) no indicator if he is "finished"

Besides that Red HP bars over the head are a Arcade game element i dnt want in 7D2D
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Well, good point. I don't want constant loud obnoxious bars.

Something that only shows up briefly after it takes damage maybe.

 
I would love to have the option to turn health bars on. It would be nice to see how much damage we are actually doing to the zombies.

 
L...I want all the HUD info I can get. The more the better. ...
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Yeah I'm like this too.

I mod in Food/Water bars already.

I don't mind a health bar on zombies.

[A transparency setting would be a nice touch for it, however.]

Having info about what I'm doing helps with immersion for me.

Not for others though.

That's what I find most fascinating about this subject.

 
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