FennecMod - Deadly Ferals, Rad Zeds, Specializations, Ore Processing and More

[mdf25]

I love this mod!Very good work.

Gameplays in Spanish:

I'm really glad you're enjoying it 1.1 is almost out of the moulding phases, so hopefully it will be done either by the end of this week or next

Then, the 1.2 phase begins, adding more uses for some of the items, new recipes, and endgame stuff with the fadium and foxium things. It should be awesome

 

[Katlima]

Hi,

while enjoying your new mod, I suddenly realized I never gave any feedback for your Fennec Mod project. I haven't yet proceeded very far into the game, but if I wait too long, I will forget the things I noticed in the beginning.

First impression: Good! Challenging and complex, but playable.

I like many of the added recipes and mechanics and the good ones are definitely the majority. However, there are some things I'd do differently and by mentioning them here, I'll be happy if you consider them. I'll still love your mod, if you decide to leave everything as it is right now.

- vanilla only has very few workstations and they each have a distinct icon in the crafting menu. Fennec Mod adds more workstations and this makes it confusing or sometimes impossible to figure out, where you craft a recipe. I know I'm not alone with this, looking at how many people gave positive feedback in the Undead Legacy thread. Suggestion: add information to the recipes

- fire pit craft description says you can add cooking pot and cooking grill as a tool. This is probably left over from copy-pasting the campfire

- fermented vegetable oil: wow, that's a clunky name and it sounds "invented". Suggestion: add a piece of wood to the recipe and call it turpentine

- the oil recipe: this is a big one. There are two separate things not quite right with this. The first thing is the need for three different seed types to make oil. This just doesn't make sense. Vegetable oil just doesn't require a mix of three different seed types. Potatoes are not a good source for oil. They could be replaced by wheat, a plant already in the mod.

What's more: the water doesn't make any sense. Yes, this has been done in other mods, but it doesn't get better with repetition. Oil and water don't mix and YOU KNOW IT, lol. Most of us have a basic idea how you make oil: you take the seeds, grind them, squeeze them, done. And if you're not Chuck Norris, you'll need the help of some contraption to press the oil out.

Suggestion: step 1: ground seeds by crafting three seeds (either corn, wheat or soy) and two stones

step 2: oil by crafting ground seeds with a piece of cloth, a piece of wood and an empty jar

Alternatively: a machine that can double as a workstation for paper, possibly charcoal powder

- soy milk appears to be too good the way it's balanced. Hydration without risk AND wellness with reusable container. An abundance of soya plants in the wild. No other ingredients needed, no workstation or skills needed.

suggestion: first of all I'd get rid of the containers. While it makes sense that supermarkets sell the milk in these containers, you wouldn't use them if you make your own milk.

Then, the soya milk should be slightly less good and slightly more expensive. Something like 4-5 beans and 1/4 less hydration or so.

- Yucca juice: needs bottled water and a fireplace now. That's tea, not juice then, right? Let's go back to the vanilla recipe and reduce the effect or give a higher chance of the Yucca desease, I believe it's called Yuccaria?

- Yuccaria: where is it? Does it even exist?

- Cacti seed: the same, still getting yuccas. Is that under construction?

- Some of the plants have a way too close rendering distance. In the plains, you have to stand 1-2 blocks from the spiky green azalea variety, to even see it. The wild soya plants have a bit of a longer rendering distance, but still way too close.

- Wheat: this is purely cosmetic. You know when a gamer starts talking about immersion, it's most of the time bull♥♥♥♥ and we're bargaining for some sort of buff, but I mean it. Suggestion: I still think the tree seedlings are bland and versatile, allow for tinting and you don't expect to encounter them in the wild.

I hope I didn't make you angry with the feedback. Angry foxes are scary! I like this mod, it's good already and I'm excited and curious about what's to come.

edit: I forgot one, the food poisoning: 6 hours of -10 stamina per second without a way to cure it? Plus the hidden bonus of losing about 14 wellness. All that for maybe 10 or 20 satiation. Great. I kind of get it in a way of "trolling the noob", but if your desease is worse than death in EVERY aspect, that's probably not the best design. Let's compare: death sets your food and hydration to 50%, you lose 10 wellness but don't suffer any lingering debuff, instead it cures all the debuffs you already have going. Yep, way better than food poisoning in every regard.

People will probably rather go and hug a cactus than getting food poisoning a second time.

To keep the condition in a challenging but not frustrating way, it could be like this instead:

1. A reduced chance to contracting food poisoning but a wider variety of food, that has a risk of doing so.

2. If the effect lasts that long, it should only have a moderate effect, to be annoying but not entirely prevent playing. 4 hours and -2 stamina every 3 seconds sounds reasonable.

3. Don't reward players for suiciding to cure themselves, punish them for it! Make the player lose 5 wellness the moment they acquire food poisoning, but give back +1 wellness for each hour of recovery without death, resulting in -1 wellness in total opposed to -15 if you suicide.

 

[mdf25]

Hi,
while enjoying your new mod, I suddenly realized I never gave any feedback for your Fennec Mod project. I haven't yet proceeded very far into the game, but if I wait too long, I will forget the things I noticed in the beginning.

First impression: Good! Challenging and complex, but playable.

I like many of the added recipes and mechanics and the good ones are definitely the majority. However, there are some things I'd do differently and by mentioning them here, I'll be happy if you consider them. I'll still love your mod, if you decide to leave everything as it is right now.

Greetings! Thanks for taking the time to give some feedback on things, I'll respond to each bit, as it's easier to keep track that way

- vanilla only has very few workstations and they each have a distinct icon in the crafting menu. Fennec Mod adds more workstations and this makes it confusing or sometimes impossible to figure out, where you craft a recipe. I know I'm not alone with this, looking at how many people gave positive feedback in the Undead Legacy thread. Suggestion: add information to the recipes

I wish there was a way I could give an icon to new workstations - well there may be a way somewhere but I've not seen how to do so unfortunately... I'll see if I can get the descriptions updated a little bit for some of the things though and go from there.

- fire pit craft description says you can add cooking pot and cooking grill as a tool. This is probably left over from copy-pasting the campfire

I can fix that... Probably the description key copying over, I'll have a look...

- fermented vegetable oil: wow, that's a clunky name and it sounds "invented". Suggestion: add a piece of wood to the recipe and call it turpentine

I had a look into turpentine and it seems that as well as being used in tanning of small hides it can also be used medicinally as well. I'll have a look into reworking this and maybe adding a couple extra things into the recipes for 'turpentine cream' or something that's similar to aloe and can be used to relieve some illnesses, or used to make first aid bandages as an alternative.

I think I have an idea - we have 2 types of oils, vegetable oil and turpentine which replaces the fermented one. Then leather tanning requires 4 hides, 1 grain alcohol and either 1 vegetable oil or 1 turpentine to give you 4 leather out of it after doing the tanning (the 4 can be changed to 5 or more if the balance is still off).

Then for the turpentine bit, you can chop trees to get a source of resin. From what I read it's made by steam distillation, so we could have that distilling 10 resin with a bottled water gets you 1 turpentine on a campfire with a cooking pot, 5 with a bottled water gives you 1 on a chem station for more efficiency, and 3 on a purification plant with a murky water gives you 1. That way we can use the vegetable oil or the turpentine and it's a little less biome dependent as well. Vegetable oil is currently used in a handful of food recipes (maybe 2 currently but plan to make more available) so keeping them for separate things would be good - one for food, one for medicinal, both for tanning... Profit!

- the oil recipe: this is a big one [...]

Suggestion: step 1: ground seeds by crafting three seeds (either corn, wheat or soy) and two stones

step 2: oil by crafting ground seeds with a piece of cloth, a piece of wood and an empty jar

Alternatively: a machine that can double as a workstation for paper, possibly charcoal powder

I like this idea - we have then 3 separate recipes which would be a little easier to manage I think. I think we could use the industrial grinder workstation for more efficient grinding of seeds as well. So you could maybe have

- 5 seeds + 2 stones = 1 ground seeds when in your backpack

- 3 seeds = 1 ground seeds when using the grinder.

Then a squeezer station for the seed oil could be added as a new machine I'm all for new machines

- soy milk appears to be too good the way it's balanced. Hydration without risk AND wellness with reusable container. An abundance of soya plants in the wild. No other ingredients needed, no workstation or skills needed.

suggestion: first of all I'd get rid of the containers. While it makes sense that supermarkets sell the milk in these containers, you wouldn't use them if you make your own milk.

Then, the soya milk should be slightly less good and slightly more expensive. Something like 4-5 beans and 1/4 less hydration or so.

I did find this a little OP as well when I was playing through, it's on my todo. I also discovered soybeans eaten raw can actually be harmful so something has gotta be done about that too. Usually soaking and letting them sprout, and eating the sprout is much better for your system. So, I could leave the option to eat raw, but after a few you'd get food poisoning (more on this later) or maybe just 'stomach cramps' that reduce movement speed and double the rate at which you need to poop for a while.

I am adding a kitchen worktable for some of the recipes (dough making will be moved to the kitchen worktable as well as a few other things) so perhaps grinding soybeans could be done here as well for a 6 to 1. Maybe the squeezer could get even more out of the soybeans too for a 4 to 1 or 3 to 1. But yeah turning down the hydration is also a good idea.

- Yucca juice: needs bottled water and a fireplace now. That's tea, not juice then, right? Let's go back to the vanilla recipe and reduce the effect or give a higher chance of the Yucca desease, I believe it's called Yuccaria?

- Yuccaria: where is it? Does it even exist?

We could turn it back to the regular one but costing more yucca fruit, maybe 5 to 1 as it is now but just in the hand. Then, the kitchen table could be used with a juicer tool to get it for a 1 to 1 ratio. Yuccaria does exist - you have to eat about 10 yucca for it to take effect if I remember right...

- Cacti seed: the same, still getting yuccas. Is that under construction?

In the works still - I need to make cacti grow, so probably will have them turn from the ball shaped one to the medium sized one when fully grown. I think grow your own defense is a cool idea hehe.

- Some of the plants have a way too close rendering distance. In the plains, you have to stand 1-2 blocks from the spiky green azalea variety, to even see it. The wild soya plants have a bit of a longer rendering distance, but still way too close.

I haven't seen an issue with rendering though I will have a look - I was seeing the blocks at a good distance when I was playing on devbranch so maybe it could be to do with tree quality settings at least for the azaleas? Not too sure on that but I just copied the existing plant growing code and gave it new models... Hmmm.

- Wheat: this is purely cosmetic. You know when a gamer starts talking about immersion, it's most of the time bull♥♥♥♥ and we're bargaining for some sort of buff, but I mean it. Suggestion: I still think the tree seedlings are bland and versatile, allow for tinting and you don't expect to encounter them in the wild.

Haha I know wheat currently looks like coffee plants and I'm not happy about it either I can see if it's possible to tint the seedlings though as that could work if it's tintable.

I forgot one, the food poisoning [...]

To keep the condition in a challenging but not frustrating way, it could be like this instead:

1. A reduced chance to contracting food poisoning but a wider variety of food, that has a risk of doing so.

2. If the effect lasts that long, it should only have a moderate effect, to be annoying but not entirely prevent playing. 4 hours and -2 stamina every 3 seconds sounds reasonable.

3. Don't reward players for suiciding to cure themselves, punish them for it! Make the player lose 5 wellness the moment they acquire food poisoning, but give back +1 wellness for each hour of recovery without death, resulting in -1 wellness in total opposed to -15 if you suicide.

I didn't realise the wellness drain was that bad - totally not intended though the length was. Reduced stamina penalty though I can do.

I actually wanted to combine the 'pooping' with food poisoning though so that you could poop it all out of your system and it would triple the rate of which the poison goes away, same with yuccaria. So if I reduce it to 3 hours game time, sitting on a pooper for an hour would get rid of it or you could tough it out for 3 hours. I know there's a tickrate somewhere that I can look into...

 

[Katlima]

Greetings! Thanks for taking the time to give some feedback on things, I'll respond to each bit, as it's easier to keep track that way

I'm thrilled to see you're taking time to think about my feedback!

I wish there was a way I could give an icon to new workstations

I haven't yet seen any mod use custom symbols there, so it's probably not possible. Adding the info to the recipe description would solve the issue though!

You have a lot of good ideas here with the turpentine, especially finding multiple uses for that ingredient. I just looked it up to get updated on what it really does and it seems to be quite versatile.

I like what I read here, though I'd suggest cutting out the resin part (as long as you don't intend to add other uses for resin as well), because it would cause you more work and the player more clutter. I think wood (or wooden logs) can be safely used as a stand-in because wood contains resin.

I also discovered soybeans eaten raw can actually be harmful so something has gotta be done about that too.

Yes, I think they are less harmful than standard beans, but still cause trouble when eaten raw.

Yuccaria does exist - you have to eat about 10 yucca for it to take effect if I remember right...

I'm feeling a little bit bad for my character now, but I'm curious to see it in action, so...

In the works still - I need to make cacti grow, so probably will have them turn from the ball shaped one to the medium sized one when fully grown. I think grow your own defense is a cool idea hehe.

This! Militant gardening is an amazing idea and I remember first time I played 7dtd I was trying to figure out how to grow cacti and how disappointed I was, that it wasn't possible at all.

I haven't seen an issue with rendering though I will have a look - I was seeing the blocks at a good distance when I was playing on devbranch so maybe it could be to do with tree quality settings at least for the azaleas? Not too sure on that but I just copied the existing plant growing code and gave it new models... Hmmm.

Yes, it's possible, that my settings are the issue here. I limited a lot of the plants options to increase visibility and performance. What's striking though, the azaleas and other plants in vanilla and other mods are visible from further away for me. Other crops like goldenrod in Fennec Mod are visible a good 100+ blocks away.

https://imgur.com/a/a2oMoVb

I'm not saying we need 100 blocks of visibility radius on azaleas, but come on, this is ridiculous. (screenshot)

Haha I know wheat currently looks like coffee plants and I'm not happy about it either I can see if it's possible to tint the seedlings though as that could work if it's tintable.

Fingers crossed!

I didn't realise the wellness drain was that bad - totally not intended though the length was. Reduced stamina penalty though I can do.

I actually wanted to combine the 'pooping' with food poisoning though so that you could poop it all out of your system and it would triple the rate of which the poison goes away, same with yuccaria. So if I reduce it to 3 hours game time, sitting on a pooper for an hour would get rid of it or you could tough it out for 3 hours. I know there's a tickrate somewhere that I can look into...

The wellness loss might be a hidden feature of long duration illnesses. I know snake poison does the same in starvation, though their description doesn't mention it there either.

If you could solve it like you describe it here, that would be great. Giving the toilets another benefit now that they are already used in your mod would be a bonus as well.

A lot of interesting stuff in your mod. I hope you can implement all of your ideas without any unexpected issues and I'm very excited about updates. Will definitely keep my eyes open while I continue playing, in case there is something else I find peculiar.

edit: It looks like I encountered a genuine bug. I looted a poncho from a cowboy. Clicking on the poncho causes nullref-scroll to the extent that the game becomes unresponsive and I have to alt+f4 it. I restarted the game and dragged the poncho out of my inventory. This works, it only seems to occur when calling for the item details. I gave myself a poncho from creative menu in exchange - this one initially didn't cause an issue. Then later, I decided to swap it for a business jacket and the poncho from creative appeared in my inventory with an entirely different max and current durability and I got the nullref problem again. I picked up the cowboy poncho again and I decided to stash both of them away.

 

[mdf25]

I'm thrilled to see you're taking time to think about my feedback!
edit: It looks like I encountered a genuine bug. I looted a poncho from a cowboy. Clicking on the poncho causes nullref-scroll to the extent that the game becomes unresponsive and I have to alt+f4 it. I restarted the game and dragged the poncho out of my inventory. This works, it only seems to occur when calling for the item details. I gave myself a poncho from creative menu in exchange - this one initially didn't cause an issue. Then later, I decided to swap it for a business jacket and the poncho from creative appeared in my inventory with an entirely different max and current durability and I got the nullref problem again. I picked up the cowboy poncho again and I decided to stash both of them away.

Someone also reported this string of nullrefs yesterday too though your report confirms it is definitely the poncho - I THINK the issue comes with animalHide not being in the scrappable materials list. I've added this and it should be in the next patch hopefully tonight or tomorrow. Essentially I made it so that ponchos are made and repaired and scrapped with animal hides now, since it looks more like animal hide than leather so made a little more sense to me

Also been reworking those seed recipes and adding more stuff to the kitchen workbench - You'll be happy to know yucca is back to normal now for the juice however it's 5 to 1 until you get a juicer and kitchen workbench, when it becomes 1 to 1 again Turpentine is in as well, the leather tanning now uses either that or vegetable oil. Once I got these other bits in, I'll add the medicinal part for the turpentine in as well

Then comes the squeezer... Not sure what block shape I should use for that, honestly. I'd love to import something and make new assets for these benches but... ehh, SDX... Lots of work

 

[Katlima]

Someone also reported this string of nullrefs yesterday too though your report confirms it is definitely the poncho - I THINK the issue comes with animalHide not being in the scrappable materials list. I've added this and it should be in the next patch hopefully tonight or tomorrow. Essentially I made it so that ponchos are made and repaired and scrapped with animal hides now, since it looks more like animal hide than leather so made a little more sense to me
Also been reworking those seed recipes and adding more stuff to the kitchen workbench - You'll be happy to know yucca is back to normal now for the juice however it's 5 to 1 until you get a juicer and kitchen workbench, when it becomes 1 to 1 again Turpentine is in as well, the leather tanning now uses either that or vegetable oil. Once I got these other bits in, I'll add the medicinal part for the turpentine in as well

Wow, that's good news. You seem to be a quick fox! I'll try the poncho again after the update then and I'm excited about experimenting with the new version of the recipes.

Then comes the squeezer... Not sure what block shape I should use for that, honestly. I'd love to import something and make new assets for these benches but... ehh, SDX... Lots of work

Yeah, you decided against SDX for the moment and that's fine. There are still tons of blocks that can be used though. For example the trash cans or the pole-shaped tombstone or the placed cooking pot could work for smaller appliances. It's not even that far-fetched that you'd make a housing from a trashcan in the apocalypse. Or from a shopping basket and then use the shopping basket model for the finished machine. A cash register could work too, or maybe this 363 item, noone really knows what it's supposed to be in the first place. Or make washing machines give washing machine frames on wrenching and make some machines using the washing machine frame that surprisingly look like a washing machine. If everything else fails, you know you can fall back to the trusted coffee plant model.


edit:

Hey, I hope you all have a nice weekend. I collected a few more things I'd like to mention.

-First of all, workstation models again: I think the greenish consoles frequently found in industrial buildings would make for good workstations because of these reasons:

They convincingly look like some sort of machine yet not a specific one (like washing machine)

They look like they can be tinted to lose some of the greenish hue to distinguish them

You don't expect the ingame variety to be in player used buildings very often

-Turpentine: I looked up the medical uses (from my childhood I remember the stuff mostly being used for cleaning brushes or treating wood lol) and I'm starting to become a little bit scared now, because I read about lice, ringworm, athlete's foot and intestinal parasites. Yes, scared!

On the other hand, maybe you could give the player a short time frame in which turpetine could get rid off rabies. I'm having a really hard time with rabies right now. I'm in week three and haven't found a rabies cure so far, but contracted it several times already. Yeah it was suicide time again lol.

-The working sinks are supposed to be rare, right? Maybe RNG is wasting all of my luck with generating more of these and I'd say every 4th or 5th sink I find is a working variety. Sinks are common in many prefabs, maybe the chances for working sinks could be lowered a little bit? It would also be sweet, if the player could drink from them with bare hands, if that's possible to implement.

-There's a glitch with wheat that makes it impossible to grow wheat right now: the growing wheat plant turns into ripe soya when mature.

-wood logs: Right now they are my staple building material and fuel, just because they are easy to come by and are working alright. The can be abused to generate infinite wood easily though, and here's how: you place the wood log, axe it without breaking it and then repair it. Rinse and repeat. It's more efficient than running around, chopping trees, which is the problematic part.

Suggested fix:

Swap the health points of tier 1 and tier 2, so you end up with tier 1 200 and tier 2 400. This will make the logs still useful the same (upgrading is cheap), but reduce the amount of hits a tier 1 log will take

Reduce the wood so you get 8 for tier 1 on average and increase the repair cost slightly, this will make the wood generation method so inefficient, it won't be worth it anymore

The wood logs dropped from trees could be reduced a little bit as well. I don't mean to say "kill it" by taking away too much of it now, but still, there are too many logs.

That's it for now, I'll be checking back later.


edit again:

There's more!

- You removed the farm poi. This seems to work, I have not seen a farm poi yet in Fennec Mod. The town generation appears to be a little bit odd, though. The other poi usually accompanying farm plots now appear more frequent and in bigger numbers. It's not rare that towns consist for the larger part of sheds and barns and most notably there is an insane number of water towers in your towns.

Insane amount. Never seen anything like that before and it's the same in every town.

- The anvil situation. You already gated iron stuff heavily hardcoded by requiring a high skill in tool smithing (and thus, level), the bellows, the cobblestones and the additional needed skills to craft iron items and tools and prevent repairing them without the skills. Now the player goes, happy to finally have managed to acquire the items listed in your forge quests and everything, wants to try out the forge, maybe craft a few nails and THAT'S THE MOMENT he figures out, he will need an anvil to craft an anvil.

Yeah, I get it, anvils can be obtained by looting. They are just very, very rare, especially with your limited range without a minibike and many of the towns in close range consisting mainly of barns and water towers. You can buy them from traders, yes. I did. I was lucky, as soon as I realized the problem, I was able to buy one from my local trader. But these are not guaranteed and frankly, I'd have been absolutely pissed, if I had not been able to buy one because at that point... enough is enough, you see?

I find the gating of the anvil a bit too much. Of course, needing to loot a wrench to be able to build a workstation is vanilla mechanic so it's not the first time you need to find something, before you can craft it. Wrenches are not nearly as rare as anvils as a random loot though and at least you know about that in advance. Grinding the hamster wheel for the forge and then, in the forge interface, figuring out the anvil-needs-anvil problematic for the first time is an extremely frustrating moment. Please think about adding anvils to some COMMON type of loot container and have it pretty much guaranteed at the traders. Or even better, shift the restriction from random luck to expensive.

- The cobblestone recipes seem unrealistic. You have a very expensive way of crafting cobblestones in the firepit (requiring 20 stone and clay each) and as long as this is only meant for getting the cobblestones required for the forge it's fine. However, the cobblestone recipe in the forge is fifty times cheaper, requiring 2 units of stone and clay in the forge (every lump of clay or small stone will give 5 units each). Suggestion: if the player decides to grab cobblestones from the firepit for the forge, add an expensive tool to the firepit and reduce the cost of the actual cobblestones in the firepit (maybe 3/3), then also increase the cost of cobblestones in the forge slightly. I'm pretty sure the main reason for the firepit cobblestones being so expensive is gating the forge. With an expensive tool in the firepit, this will still be the case. But now producing more cobblestones once you got the tool will be more efficient: This way the player will possibly actually EVER go and use flagstones some point in between wooden logs and bricks. The forge recipe can be increased to 5 units of clay and stone (in result one lump of clay and one small stone: this is pretty much vanilla cost with a small added time and fuel cost of course and at that point in game easy enough to acquire that everything lower will feel too cheap and right now it just feels unrealistic that the firepit needs 50 times the amount of material).

- Copper ingots: Crafting time is a little bit excessive, especially with how quickly you burn through the tools this early in game. Also, there's a recipe for turning scrap copper and copper arrowheads into ingots, but not copper fragments. Maybe it could be changed so you have two recipes, one turning scrap copper and one turning copper fragments into ingots and have the player scrap the arrowheads instead?

 

[mdf25]

Hey, I hope you all have a nice weekend. I collected a few more things I'd like to mention.

Awesome, I've been working on things over the weekend too

-First of all, workstation models again: I think the greenish consoles frequently found in industrial buildings would make for good workstations because of these reasons:

They convincingly look like some sort of machine yet not a specific one (like washing machine)

They look like they can be tinted to lose some of the greenish hue to distinguish them

You don't expect the ingame variety to be in player used buildings very often

I did think about this as well and I think it would work pretty well, I haven't tried tinting them but having a look at some of the blocks now to see which would work as potential machines

-Turpentine: I looked up the medical uses (from my childhood I remember the stuff mostly being used for cleaning brushes or treating wood lol) and I'm starting to become a little bit scared now, because I read about lice, ringworm, athlete's foot and intestinal parasites. Yes, scared!

All I can say is... nyahahahaha...

On the other hand, maybe you could give the player a short time frame in which turpetine could get rid off rabies. I'm having a really hard time with rabies right now. I'm in week three and haven't found a rabies cure so far, but contracted it several times already. Yeah it was suicide time again lol.

Wolves are deadly little buggers now it seems... The rabies syringe is a rare drop from nurses and in pop+pills shops (look in cases and lab equipment boxes too), your best bet is to avoid wolves unless you've got ranged weapons to take them out. Same with zombie dogs as well, horde night just got deadlier. I will see if I can add a herbal remedy using turpentine though for an early cure

-The working sinks are supposed to be rare, right? Maybe RNG is wasting all of my luck with generating more of these and I'd say every 4th or 5th sink I find is a working variety. Sinks are common in many prefabs, maybe the chances for working sinks could be lowered a little bit? It would also be sweet, if the player could drink from them with bare hands, if that's possible to implement.

They are actually 1 in 5, so seems the probability is working out right overall. I may reduce to 1 in 10 instead, seems like it could be better overall if it's lowered a little bit and make you hunt around for it.

-There's a glitch with wheat that makes it impossible to grow wheat right now: the growing wheat plant turns into ripe soya when mature.

Aha, I got it - will be fixed for next patch.

-wood logs: Right now they are my staple building material and fuel, just because they are easy to come by and are working alright. The can be abused to generate infinite wood easily though, and here's how: you place the wood log, axe it without breaking it and then repair it. Rinse and repeat. It's more efficient than running around, chopping trees, which is the problematic part.

Ahhh, an exploit ye have found! I'll see if I can sort out the repair and HP out of those, since if you're getting lots just from a log and able to repair it for less, seems that it would be good to fix this up.

The wood logs dropped from trees could be reduced a little bit as well. I don't mean to say "kill it" by taking away too much of it now, but still, there are too many logs.

The way I had it so far was that the logs dropped was based on the height of the tree. So a tree that was 6m high drops 6 logs, the 9m one drops 9 logs, etc If you feel it's too much I can look at reducing slightly

 

[mdf25]

- You removed the farm poi. This seems to work, I have not seen a farm poi yet in Fennec Mod. The town generation appears to be a little bit odd, though. The other poi usually accompanying farm plots now appear more frequent and in bigger numbers. It's not rare that towns consist for the larger part of sheds and barns and most notably there is an insane number of water towers in your towns.

Interesting - I'll add a max_count="1" to some of those water towers and hopefully that will reduce it a little. I also saw a town consisting of water towers in War of the Walkers, so maybe the removal of the farm POIs enhances that odd generation.

- The anvil situation. You already gated iron stuff heavily hardcoded by requiring a high skill in tool smithing (and thus, level), the bellows, the cobblestones and the additional needed skills to craft iron items and tools and prevent repairing them without the skills. Now the player goes, happy to finally have managed to acquire the items listed in your forge quests and everything, wants to try out the forge, maybe craft a few nails and THAT'S THE MOMENT he figures out, he will need an anvil to craft an anvil.

Yeah, I get it, anvils can be obtained by looting. They are just very, very rare, especially with your limited range without a minibike and many of the towns in close range consisting mainly of barns and water towers. You can buy them from traders, yes. I did. I was lucky, as soon as I realized the problem, I was able to buy one from my local trader. But these are not guaranteed and frankly, I'd have been absolutely pissed, if I had not been able to buy one because at that point... enough is enough, you see?

I find the gating of the anvil a bit too much. Of course, needing to loot a wrench to be able to build a workstation is vanilla mechanic so it's not the first time you need to find something, before you can craft it. Wrenches are not nearly as rare as anvils as a random loot though and at least you know about that in advance. Grinding the hamster wheel for the forge and then, in the forge interface, figuring out the anvil-needs-anvil problematic for the first time is an extremely frustrating moment. Please think about adding anvils to some COMMON type of loot container and have it pretty much guaranteed at the traders. Or even better, shift the restriction from random luck to expensive.

I can add anvils to garage storage boxes, might make sense that they are in there as well as the working stiffs boxes. Potentially in broken down forges you get a good chance at getting one as well. I think I made it so that anvils were almost guaranteed daily at the traders already but will need to test more on it. I could also make it that to craft an anvil without an anvil in the forge the cost is 10x as much, so 2000 iron and 100 clay.

- The cobblestone recipes seem unrealistic. You have a very expensive way of crafting cobblestones in the firepit (requiring 20 stone and clay each) and as long as this is only meant for getting the cobblestones required for the forge it's fine.

That's the intention - beforehand I didn't have any recipe for cobblestone rocks and people didn't like the chisel being hard to get early on so it's an added recipe in case of RNG screwing you over.

The forge recipe can be increased to 5 units of clay and stone (in result one lump of clay and one small stone: this is pretty much vanilla cost with a small added time and fuel cost of course and at that point in game easy enough to acquire that everything lower will feel too cheap and right now it just feels unrealistic that the firepit needs 50 times the amount of material).

I may adjust to 4 and 4, since there is added fuel cost as well. That would make the forge 25x more efficient.

- Copper ingots: Crafting time is a little bit excessive, especially with how quickly you burn through the tools this early in game. Also, there's a recipe for turning scrap copper and copper arrowheads into ingots, but not copper fragments. Maybe it could be changed so you have two recipes, one turning scrap copper and one turning copper fragments into ingots and have the player scrap the arrowheads instead?

Copper time can be turned down a little I think. I did add the ability to repair the copper tools now (this should be in) so hopefully with a bit of reduced time it will balance out a bit.

 

[Katlima]

Awesome, I've been working on things over the weekend too

After realizing that you are doing a lot on youtube as well, I must say I'm impressed, you're a really busy fox. I really enjoy what I saw there as well.

All I can say is... nyahahahaha...

Busy, productive and potentially slightly evil.

Wolves are deadly little buggers now it seems... The rabies syringe is a rare drop from nurses and in pop+pills shops (look in cases and lab equipment boxes too), your best bet is to avoid wolves unless you've got ranged weapons to take them out. Same with zombie dogs as well, horde night just got deadlier. I will see if I can add a herbal remedy using turpentine though for an early cure

Yes, and boars as well give you the stuff. It's difficult to completely avoid dog bites and if rabies turns into a kind of super-infection, it will at the same time take away a lot of the scare potential of all common zombies and leave the player with a condition that they will have a really hard time to get rid off. That's why I'd love to see a turpentine remedy.

They are actually 1 in 5, so seems the probability is working out right overall. I may reduce to 1 in 10 instead, seems like it could be better overall if it's lowered a little bit and make you hunt around for it.

Exactly!

Aha, I got it - will be fixed for next patch.

The biology of wheat, very complex.

Ahhh, an exploit ye have found! I'll see if I can sort out the repair and HP out of those, since if you're getting lots just from a log and able to repair it for less, seems that it would be good to fix this up.

The way I had it so far was that the logs dropped was based on the height of the tree. So a tree that was 6m high drops 6 logs, the 9m one drops 9 logs, etc If you feel it's too much I can look at reducing slightly

The logs are good early game building blocks (your mod really needs them too) and valuable fuel. In my opinion it would be more important to balance their drop chance around that. Also, I'm growing my own trees and pretty much all of them drop 17 each right now.

It looks like we've been overlapping a bit today. Your posting and my second edit. And I have a feeling you might have missed the second edit to my previous posting because of that:


edit: if only synchronized forum posting was olympic! Lol, whatever, here's some fresh feedback I'd like to add:

- The copper tools CAN be repaired, no matter what the description says

- The vendor still sells generic boiled, charred and grilled meat. I meant to report this as a glitch, but thinking about it, you're a genius! You never know if that crook would not slip you some filet de possum, right? The wellness of course has to go, it's too good in comparision to the other Fennec Mod food.

So seeing your second posting now.

Interesting - I'll add a max_count="1" to some of those water towers and hopefully that will reduce it a little. I also saw a town consisting of water towers in War of the Walkers, so maybe the removal of the farm POIs enhances that odd generation.

WotW! Literally the one mod I can't get into myself. I think the overall size of the farming themed part of the towns might be too big and the missing farms adding to the issue by making the game try to close the gaps with water towers. All of the gaps. I hope your strategy will work out, it sounds like a clever way to solve this.

I can add anvils to garage storage boxes, might make sense that they are in there as well as the working stiffs boxes. Potentially in broken down forges you get a good chance at getting one as well. I think I made it so that anvils were almost guaranteed daily at the traders already but will need to test more on it. I could also make it that to craft an anvil without an anvil in the forge the cost is 10x as much, so 2000 iron and 100 clay.

I got one from the trader, as I said. Won't say they don't show up there. It's just that at the end of the forge chain you really feel like the moment where you get your reward spoiled by discovering the anvil recipe needs an anvil - it will not show in the recipe list before you got the forge. And if you're used to vanilla or other mod probabilities of trader anvils, you're likely fuming on your way there. So adding a really expensive recipe like you suggested, (maybe to the firepit instead, to keep it separate?) sounds like a HUGE improvement, because then you instantly know alright even if I have to grind a little bit now, it will all be good in the end.

That's the intention - beforehand I didn't have any recipe for cobblestone rocks and people didn't like the chisel being hard to get early on so it's an added recipe in case of RNG screwing you over.

Hey, every feedback I'm giving is only meant as a suggestion! Something that looks weird or imbalanced to me or some problem you maybe didn't notice or the opinion of a player. Your mod, your vision!

Copper time can be turned down a little I think. I did add the ability to repair the copper tools now (this should be in) so hopefully with a bit of reduced time it will balance out a bit.

Ah, so it is intentionally! I thought that was maybe a bug with the description implying they can't be repaired.

 

[mdf25]

After realizing that you are doing a lot on youtube as well, I must say I'm impressed, you're a really busy fox. I really enjoy what I saw there as well. Busy, productive and potentially slightly evil.

Haha yup lots of videos and things coming out as well Glad you are liking things over on the YouTube side of things too

Yes, and boars as well give you the stuff. It's difficult to completely avoid dog bites and if rabies turns into a kind of super-infection, it will at the same time take away a lot of the scare potential of all common zombies and leave the player with a condition that they will have a really hard time to get rid off. That's why I'd love to see a turpentine remedy.

The way Rabies used to work would be

First 24 hours: Rabies stage 1, you can cure with a syringe

Next 72 hours: Rabies stage 2, you can still cure with a syringe

Next 72 hours: Rabies stage 3, using a syringe won't completely cure it but will put you into a better state for a while

Lastly: Rabies stage 4, death. 7 Days to Cure Rabies.

If you use one syringe you will be able to cure the rabies, but if on stage 3, it will move you to a stage where applying a second syringe would cure it unless you had another 24 hours. So you can postpone it for a day if it goes long enough.

I've added 'turpentine extract' now which is made with turpentine oil on a campfire with a beaker, or on a chemistry station. This has the same effects as aloe cream though it dehydrates you a very small amount and will only cure the first stage of rabies. Additionally, stage 1 now only lasts 6 ingame hours (18 less than current), and stage 2 now lasts 90 ingame hours (18 hours more than current). I will also be adding some cream into pill cases and on nurse zombies rarely as well. So, if you're quick enough, you will be able to cure it without needing to find a syringe.

The logs are good early game building blocks (your mod really needs them too) and valuable fuel. In my opinion it would be more important to balance their drop chance around that. Also, I'm growing my own trees and pretty much all of them drop 17 each right now.

I have made it so logs give half the amount of wood now so hopefully the exploit won't be so much with repairing. You still get same amount of logs. I will probably reduce stage 1 to 300HP so making it slightly less sturdy, but still viable to use. I'm glad you feel logs are a necessity though in FennecMod That was my intention

- The copper tools CAN be repaired, no matter what the description says

Fixing...

- The vendor still sells generic boiled, charred and grilled meat. I meant to report this as a glitch, but thinking about it, you're a genius! You never know if that crook would not slip you some filet de possum, right? The wellness of course has to go, it's too good in comparision to the other Fennec Mod food.

I didn't realise they were still in there, so not really me being a genius but I like the idea that you don't know what type of meat it is. Still gotta work out the wellness - maybe give a random chance of a negative effect since it could be any old meat

 

[Proteus12]

Thank you very much I liked the mod

Perfect would be with ...

Simple_UI_Plus-v0.9-120

Could you put it in please?

 

[JakeSkully]

I was excited to see the Farmer specialty but then when I looked into it there are no new farmer tools to fight with. Since you have the perk "Torch & Pitchforks" does that mean there are plans to add a pitchfork or other farm tools to expanded the fighting capabilities? Since the farmer had the highest de-buff I noticed at 40% it seems early game would be awful so a stone and scrap version of a farm tool seems needed.

I was thinking on playing Farmer+Trader+Plunderer but early game is not very fun.

Since I plan on playing solo I suppose that Farmer might just be a bad choice and it is intended more for a multi player game where you need to feed a group of people?

 

[mdf25]

Thank you very much I liked the modPerfect would be with ...

Simple_UI_Plus-v0.9-120

Could you put it in please?

I will probably be making more UI options available once I've rounded out the main features of the mod. Same with bigger backpack too.

 

[mdf25]

I was excited to see the Farmer specialty but then when I looked into it there are no new farmer tools to fight with. Since you have the perk "Torch & Pitchforks" does that mean there are plans to add a pitchfork or other farm tools to expanded the fighting capabilities? Since the farmer had the highest de-buff I noticed at 40% it seems early game would be awful so a stone and scrap version of a farm tool seems needed.
I was thinking on playing Farmer+Trader+Plunderer but early game is not very fun.

Since I plan on playing solo I suppose that Farmer might just be a bad choice and it is intended more for a multi player game where you need to feed a group of people?

The current farming tools are the iron garden hoe and the garden trowel (in next patch). I will probably be adding a stone variant of the hoe as well for early game farming but it will be extremely slow. So you can still use it, but it won't be good as a farming tool for larger plots until you've got yourself the iron one.

I think I did turn down some of the penalties on the farmer in the most recent version as it's quite a lot of things that are affected. Maybe I could make it so that a bucket is also a farming tool and you can attack with it, as well as something else. But currently hoe and trowel are the only 2 farming tools. Adding a pitchfork would be awesome but would also require a new model, which I'd love to do but that's an SDX thing which I'm not hitting right now

Wait - I got it!

ELECTRIC CATTLE PROD!

 

[LilMissNorti]

Hi - um...came to ask a question, but the Discord link is broken on the first post.

Basically my inventory is overlapping with any other large storage container in game. Works completely fine in all other mods/vanilla. Any assistance would be appreciated.

Example Here:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/389771050419748877/442933481287188481/JPEG_20180507_162045.jpg

 

[Katlima]

Basically my inventory is overlapping with any other large storage container in game. Works completely fine in all other mods/vanilla. Any assistance would be appreciated.

Oh, that looks obstructive! I haven't seen this before and I don't know what causes the issue, but I can tell you what I'd do, if my game did this: I'd go to options, video and fiddle with the screen resolution settings to see if that would help. I guess you could try that til someone comes with a better solution.

... Rabies...

I love the changes a lot!

I was excited to see the Farmer specialty but then when I looked into it there are no new farmer tools to fight with. Since you have the perk "Torch & Pitchforks" does that mean there are plans to add a pitchfork or other farm tools to expanded the fighting capabilities? Since the farmer had the highest de-buff I noticed at 40% it seems early game would be awful so a stone and scrap version of a farm tool seems needed.

I'm surprised to read this, because when I read the description, this was exactly what I thought farmer would do: give you early access to a tilling tool and possibly some farmer-themed exclusive weapon choice/boost of farm tool entity damage.

ELECTRIC CATTLE PROD!

Mouthwatering.

I don't have much to say about the class-balance yet, because I'm still on my first savegame and I think it would be wiser to wait for the update to drop, before I start a new one. There's one thing though, that's standing out pretty obviously: athlete seems to have an issue quite opposite to the farmer class. It's very good with little drawbacks. I'm worried, that it's so good right now and combines so well with whatever other classes you pick, that it will change from choice to mandatory with more competitive players.

You get early help with stamina, which is strong, but it's kind of expected and fine. The bigger problem in my opinion are the later game perks. You'll continue having a stamina bonus all the way through the game, effectively saving you skillpoints for the higher level stamina conserving skills and worst of all: steroids and vitamins. While the steroids come with a debuff to partially negate the benefit, they will also be a really good way to make room for more food and enable you to stuff your face and get the food type buffs going after a death. So the debuff isn't really all negative at all. The vitamin recipe does not have a single limiting ingredient, just pop them by the dozens. So one class to completely cancel out stamina issues, wellness issues and food buff issues after death? That appears a little bit strong to me.

As a solution I'd suggest to either give the athlete a more speedy metabolism, increasing both hunger and thirst and an increased amount of food for the food type buffs OR take away the pill recipes and give them to some other class instead. The vitamin recipe could be changed to include a resource that's hard to get in quantities and is useful for other good recipes. Eggs seem to be a good candidate here: in Fennec Mod, eggs are quite rare and used in many of the good food recipes. This is awesome, because this way they turn into a very good balancing tool.

There's something else I noticed: I tried a few different options (traders, land claim blocks) but have not yet been able to drag a working oven into my womancave. I'm starting to wonder if that's intentional and the player is supposed to travel to that workstation in later game stages still? It starts getting a bit tedious here with the wide variety of food ingredients in game. If that mechanic is intended, how about changing it from ovens to sinks+toilets instead: the sinks mostly because it would make sense to have the same limitation as toilets explaining it with the water pipe access, the toilets because I think they would make it more fair, challenging not only in early game stages, by requiring the player to travel no matter how many resources they collected, while the ovens challenges would become less and less later in game, depending on how many resources a player collected and how many meals they can queue up in one run.

Oh, on the topic of sinks: we have a slight stacking problem here caused by the number empty glass jars and jars of clean water stack to, since you can fill a 500 stack on a working filtered sink. Suggested fix: make all the jars, empty and all three types of water stack to 250.

 

[LilMissNorti]

Oh, that looks obstructive! I haven't seen this before and I don't know what causes the issue, but I can tell you what I'd do, if my game did this: I'd go to options, video and fiddle with the screen resolution settings to see if that would help. I guess you could try that til someone comes with a better solution.

Yep, tried that but no dice sadly.

 

[Blazer777]

i agree with u kat on the last part but u cant nerf everything leave something with good stuff

 

[KhaineGB]

There's something else I noticed: I tried a few different options (traders, land claim blocks) but have not yet been able to drag a working oven into my womancave. I'm starting to wonder if that's intentional and the player is supposed to travel to that workstation in later game stages still? It starts getting a bit tedious here with the wide variety of food ingredients in game. If that mechanic is intended, how about changing it from ovens to sinks+toilets instead: the sinks mostly because it would make sense to have the same limitation as toilets explaining it with the water pipe access, the toilets because I think they would make it more fair, challenging not only in early game stages, by requiring the player to travel no matter how many resources they collected, while the ovens challenges would become less and less later in game, depending on how many resources a player collected and how many meals they can queue up in one run.

Had a snoop at Max's code for this, and I can only find 3 "oven" blocks, none of which have CanPickUp=True set.

Which is why you can't pick them up and take them. If I have the correct blocks, then my assumption is you would have to buy them from the trader because he DOES stock decorative blocks like that in vanilla (small chance)

 

[mdf25]

Hi - um...came to ask a question, but the Discord link is broken on the first post.
Basically my inventory is overlapping with any other large storage container in game. Works completely fine in all other mods/vanilla. Any assistance would be appreciated.

Example Here:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/389771050419748877/442933481287188481/JPEG_20180507_162045.jpg

That is really weird - are you playing 1.0 or on the dev branch version? Which type of storage box were you using? Just a secure chest or some other type of storage box? I can have a look but have not experienced this issue myself at all.