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Deverezieaux's POIs now as a modlet!

Deverezieaux said:
Hi gang, here's the rural cidery: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1PHuCiMNZ5eAl-eNG0dhQxyY_1KaYa0GO/view?usp=sharing

I've tested both in editor and in maps and it seems good. Zombie counts may need some balancing. I've made the zombie counts higher because it's mostly large rooms to justify it being T3. That said I've tested it using stealth and run & gun styles and it seemed okay. Input welcome.
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Nice POI. :)

P.S. I have one question - when i manually place this POI on map and move it, final chest group dissapears. Does it mean that the only right way to place this POI is to place it once and for all (no moving)?

 
There are a few vanilla POI Parts used in this POI, and Parts may behave a little differently when placed in map as opposed to letting them generate with the map. Parts are still relatively new, so I'm not sure how moving once they're placed would be affected. I presume that when you place the POI the parts are given coordinates relative to the POI, and when you move it those part coordinates aren't changing with the POI and thus "disappearing." I'm unsure if there's a way to workaround this, but @stallionsden may know a workaround so I've mentioned him here.

The parts included are part_driveway_rural_02, part_roadside_fruit_stand_02, and I also used the part_loot_t3. I'm curious to know if all the parts disappear when you move it or just the loot pile?

 
Took some time to create two more duplex variants for my neighborhood, and also did some tests on spawning the entire tile block of duplexes. Looking good. Still have 8 more variants to build. That said, I don't want to work only on my duplex variants, it gets a little repetitive. Looking for ideas again!

dupblasted_ext1.jpgdupblock_1.jpg

 
Deverezieaux said:
There are a few vanilla POI Parts used in this POI, and Parts may behave a little differently when placed in map as opposed to letting them generate with the map. Parts are still relatively new, so I'm not sure how moving once they're placed would be affected. I presume that when you place the POI the parts are given coordinates relative to the POI, and when you move it those part coordinates aren't changing with the POI and thus "disappearing." I'm unsure if there's a way to workaround this, but @stallionsden may know a workaround so I've mentioned him here.

The parts included are part_driveway_rural_02, part_roadside_fruit_stand_02, and I also used the part_loot_t3. I'm curious to know if all the parts disappear when you move it or just the loot pile?
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I've made some experiments for diagnostic purposes. The conclusion is parts in POI are not selected when you move POI. And out of POI they just disappear. More over they are not respowned when you start quest. 

So the only way to use POI with parts is rwg :(

 
v1712 said:
I've made some experiments for diagnostic purposes. The conclusion is parts in POI are not selected when you move POI. And out of POI they just disappear. More over they are not respowned when you start quest. 

So the only way to use POI with parts is rwg :(
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Thanks for looking into this, it'll be helpful for others to know. If you playtest in the editor parts don't show up, so the proper way to test is in a generated map. I've never tried placing a POI with parts in a map and then moving it. I imagine that you could manually place the parts, but what a chore that would be.

Many of the custom prefabbers are also starting to use parts more frequently. They're very helpful for both speeding up prefabbing, and also allow you to "randomize" certain elements of POIs to make the experience of certain POIs unique every time. Even though it's technically the same POI, you could have different rooms, change parts of the dungeon path, or include interesting features like random loot. I haven't done a ton of it, but as time moves on and more parts are added they'll be incorporated more and more. Being unable to move them in-map is a disadvantage, but the benefits far outweigh that in my humble opinion. It's also entirely possible that in the future they will be selected when you move a POI.

 
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Deverezieaux said:
Being unable to move them in-map is a disadvantage
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You can sort of move them. You would place more than one of them and give them the same Tag (I think that's the field). RWG will then only pick a maximum of one of them. If you're into probability math you can kind-of make sure at least one of them will be selected, but there will always be a chance that none of them is selected unless you make one of them 100%. I assume if it is the last on the list that it would get selected if none other did.

Still, it would be nice if RWG would guarantee it would pick at least one, it would be nice. I think I made a "Pimp Dream" along those lines.

 
v1712 said:
I don't like random generated maps - they look unnatural. Always play Navezgane.
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Interesting, I always felt that Navezgane looked unnatural, primarily in the ways the cities and towns are laid out. They always felt too unbalanced, and frankly "square." In Diersville for example it was just the hospital and a bunch of houses. I get that random gen can feel weird too, particularly in earlier versions where the terrain could be all over the place.

A few alphas ago, maybe 16, they started to make improvements to random gen that made the cities/towns feel a lot more realistic, and have generally improved the terrain generation to eliminate weird quirks like vertical roads and random sinkholes. Alpha 20 is definitely the most realistic so far, though I understand how you could feel it's still off. It is fairly odd that a tile with farms might spawn next to a a downtown tile. That said I think it just keeps improving, and will be even more realistic with each iteration.

 
Deverezieaux said:
Interesting, I always felt that Navezgane looked unnatural, primarily in the ways the cities and towns are laid out. They always felt too unbalanced, and frankly "square." In Diersville for example it was just the hospital and a bunch of houses. I get that random gen can feel weird too, particularly in earlier versions where the terrain could be all over the place.
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That is the thing improved by placing POIs in Navezgane :)  

P.S. Never the less. It seems that starting the quest does not reset parts in POI.  And that is a problem for rwg too...

 
v1712 said:
It seems that starting the quest does not reset parts in POI.  And that is a problem for rwg too.
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I have not had that issue, and that sounds like a bug to me. You may actually want to consider asking about that in one of the reporting topics. I have vanilla and custom POIs with parts in my RWG world and they reset with the quests. Keep in mind that I don't know how "placing" a POI affects parts in a map, and that some parts have a probability of setting of 1 (which means 100%), meaning it's the same part that spawns, so if you're expecting a different part that may not always be the case.

 
I'm going forward with my custom bomb crater city tile, but I'm not satisfied with my progress. I'm trying to make a convincing crater. Using the selection tool makes it too blocky, using the terrain -/+ tools are just too sloppy, and using the dev tools like the digger would just take forever. I've tried combining tools but the results are not convincing.

I've tried finding a crater in several maps in the wasteland biome to copy/paste, which I haven't really been able to do. I can find plenty of mountains of rubble I can copy/paste parts of but then there's a problem with terrain at different depths. Meaning the depth at which stone starts doesn't match up where it should.

Looking for a method I may not have thought of to generate a convincing crater. Looking for something about 90x90 blocks and a depth of roughly 20 I could copy and paste to use as a base for my tile. Not sure if any of the current terrain generation tools might be useful.

Looking for ideas from other fabbers.

 
I would use Kingen with a crater heighmap that has been sized to fit your tile and the contrast adjusted to get the desired height/depth you want (when doing this, I generally make different versions of my height map with different levels of contrast so I can bring them all into a single  map and find the one I like)  .  Place this on a full sized greyscale image and use that in Kingen to generate a map.  Then go into the world editor, find the crater then export it out as a prefab.    

https://www.google.com/search?q=crater+height+map&rlz=1C1GEWG_enUS964US964&sxsrf=ALiCzsZ_SzHCYZZgry7DqBnOSkqkLA9NWA:1652726978417&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiv7dXj1-T3AhVLg4kEHVSZAPQQ_AUoAXoECAEQAw&biw=1259&bih=846&dpr=2.25

I started a tutorial on how I do this a while back but never finished it.  But hopefully this should get you started....    






 
Okay gang, the bomb crater tile is coming along really well, I have a quandary however. I want to set POI spawns, buuuuut, I only want to use the filler POIs that have severe damage, like the filler below or the "rubble" fillers, so they make sense with the tile. Unfortunately none of the current damaged filler POIs are tagged as anything other than "downtown," so there's no way to set a spawn to a specific POI that I know of unless I tag the damaged vanilla POIs. I don't want to do that, as it would just be inconvenient to anyone using the tiles. I could just copy and paste the POIs into the tile permanently, but that's lame. I'm wondering if anyone knows of a way to call a POI by name instead of tag? Like using "rubble_downtown_filler_01" in the tag field?

cratertile.jpg

damagedfiller.jpg

 
I've not tried to use XSLT to add to the Tags in a Vanilla POI's XML file, as is commonly done with other configuration files. I've just assumed that whatever code runs the XSLT wouldn't be turned loose on a POI's XML. But maybe that works...?

You could copy the TFP's rubble POIs that you want to be in your pool of possible POIs, then tag them as you wish. I assume you'd rename them if you did. I could see also making them a slightly different size so that your copies don't end up in places where the originals land. I've not found that option to be desirable for me, but maybe you'd find that okay.

I've been frustrated by a similar issue in reverse. The vanilla Gateway Tile has a place where a couple of different bits of content spawn across the street from the Trader. I can make a POI for that spot, tag it appropriately, but there's no way to add my Part to the Gateway Tile's list of Parts, unless perhaps editing the Tile's XML file via XSLT is an option. I've not wanted it so badly as to be motivated to try it. I'd rather wait for the ability to make custom Gateway Tiles.

 
zztong said:
I've not tried to use XSLT to add to the Tags in a Vanilla POI's XML file, as is commonly done with other configuration files. I've just assumed that whatever code runs the XSLT wouldn't be turned loose on a POI's XML. But maybe that works...?

You could copy the TFP's rubble POIs that you want to be in your pool of possible POIs, then tag them as you wish. I assume you'd rename them if you did. I could see also making them a slightly different size so that your copies don't end up in places where the originals land. I've not found that option to be desirable for me, but maybe you'd find that okay.

I've been frustrated by a similar issue in reverse. The vanilla Gateway Tile has a place where a couple of different bits of content spawn across the street from the Trader. I can make a POI for that spot, tag it appropriately, but there's no way to add my Part to the Gateway Tile's list of Parts, unless perhaps editing the Tile's XML file via XSLT is an option. I've not wanted it so badly as to be motivated to try it. I'd rather wait for the ability to make custom Gateway Tiles.
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Well I'll be dipped in s**t, apparently you can just set a PartSpawn with a POIMarkerPartToSpawn with the value of any POI. Using this XML:

  <property name="POIMarkerType" value="PartSpawn" />
  <property name="POIMarkerPartToSpawn" value="rubble_downtown_filler_01" />

I got the result below. I have yet to generate a world with this tile, but this looks promising.

poispawnaspart.jpg

 
zztong said:
The vanilla Gateway Tile has a place where a couple of different bits of content spawn across the street from the Trader. I can make a POI for that spot, tag it appropriately
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It occurred to me that I do have another option. When you use XSLT to add another Gateway to the mix, it replaces the TFP one. I could copy TFP one, add any custom Parts to it, and in that way extend it. The trouble would be if all modlets did that, only one would "win."

Deverezieaux said:
Well I'll be dipped in s**t, apparently you can just
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Glad you found an option for your Tile; sorry that figuring that out cost you a trip to the showers.

 
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