PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17
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PurgatoryWolf
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lol you're the one whining about zombies.
PurgatoryWolf
New member
turn on cheat mode,
debuff yourplayerid brokenLeg
debuff yourplayerid sprainedLeg
to find your player id use the list entities command
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until a17 when the zombies dig!Avoiding zombies
All I have to do is dig a hole in the ground.
Jump into it and cover it up.
I could stay down there for as long as my supply's last and not worry about zombies.
Anybody who says differently is just fooling themselves IMAO.
JaxTeller718
New member
Hopefully not. Don't let the shouting masses fool you. They may be loud but their numbers aren't as strong as you hope. I'll take BOTH diggers and lava, but if it is only diggers I'm fine with it. Balance will indeed be the key.HOPEFULLY SOMEONE FROM TFP WILL READ YOUR POST AND DO SOMETHING. OH NO! CAPS LOCK IS STUCK! ... fixed it.
On my side of the street my community seems pretty excited for diggers, in spades of course. Not sure where this whole "no one ever wanted diggers" mentality is coming from. Every mechanic has its critics, but there are also a lot of people who miss how they used to be able to dig. Me thinks some people live inside a nice cozy bubble.
And so you know it is the arrogant attitude being displayed claiming to having beaten the digger system BEFORE anyone has seen it in action that makes the pro digger crowd excited to see it in action to begin with. Which is kind of hilarious. It has to be either denial or a speck of nervousness over this new mechanic that's got everyone so sure it will be easy peasy to beat.
Im sure the fresh salty tear jars are being prepared as we speak.
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Cazmyr
New member
I always like a game where there is not 1 way to do things. In fact I have quit games that force you to do things a certain way.
When I came back to 7 Days after a long break I would turn zombies off for the first few days to get a foot hold. Then I thought about leaving them off and just building, as it is a fantastic building game.
When I did this I found something. I need the zombies on, from day 1. I need the threat, the rush of fighting, the demand placed on you to make a great base.
I also discovered that in my base design. I need to participate in the defense. It is really important for my enjoyment of the game.
That is not to say that the other ways are wrong or should not be allowed. To each their own and more power to you if you can make it work.
When I came back to 7 Days after a long break I would turn zombies off for the first few days to get a foot hold. Then I thought about leaving them off and just building, as it is a fantastic building game.
When I did this I found something. I need the zombies on, from day 1. I need the threat, the rush of fighting, the demand placed on you to make a great base.
I also discovered that in my base design. I need to participate in the defense. It is really important for my enjoyment of the game.
That is not to say that the other ways are wrong or should not be allowed. To each their own and more power to you if you can make it work.
konrax
New member
There has already been a lot of discussion on how to make bunkering a fuller more realistic experience. The conclusion from most people is that it is too easy to live underground, and that it needs to be made more challenging. How exactly has been discussed a lot as well, and I really think after a17 the pimps will have lots of ideas to work with on how to address living underground without making it too tedious. Zombie behaviour is just one aspect of how this can be addressed, and how zombies behave can vary quite a bit depending on the genre of zombies you want to mimic, that being said everyone needs to take a bit of salt on how things are right now.
Aldranon
New member
Zombie diggers will simply be not effective against a person who thinks a bit about their situation.
1) Start by building a tunnel away from your base.
2) On hoard night you just start walking down the tunnel in one direction.
3) After each hoard night, you examine the damage done to the surface (and see if any ores have been reveled).
4) You will know how much mining you can do and when to dig 30 more meters.
Its more than A16 anyway, you didn't even care what day it was and just kept the forges going 24/7. So... improvement.
khzmusik
Well-known member
Modding questions
Hi, my name is Karl. I've been a lurker her for quite some time, but created an account so I could ask about this.
As background: I also play State of Decay, and I love the whole "community building" aspect of the game, but I dislike everything else. I would love it if I could make a mod that brought some of those NPC mechanics into 7D2D. Obviously that is not what TFP are after, and I do not expect them to implement this stuff themselves. But it would be nice if they would allow modders to do so, so kindred souls would have a game that satisfied both itches.
So, these questions are "asks" about what will be possible in A17 through modding the XML files. Most of this is inspired by Kinyajuu's posts about the new modding system (which looks awesome), so my guess is that he's the one to answer them. If they are not possible now, or on the A17 roadmap, then I'm happy to make these feature requests and move this to the "Pimp Dreams" section of the forum.
On to the asks:
Ability for CVars, skills, perks or buffs to hook into NPC AI
This is the most fundamental ask, and it would make most of the other asks possible. Examples of how this could be used:
Variable alignment to factions
I would love it if it were possible to have some "degrees" of faction alignment. If faction alignment could be represented by a CVar instead, that would be OK with me.
Here are some examples of what modders could do with that:
NPC vehicles (or NPCs riding in vehicles)
Mad Max here we come!
The ability for NPCs to be containers
So, friendly NPCs can carry stuff for you when your backpack has no more room.
The ability to mod in "permadeath," probably through onOtherKilledSelf, onBlockKilledSelf, onSelfKilledSelf
Examples of things I'd like to be able to do:
Custom traders, with custom quests and rewards
For example, a "cooking" trader gives you a quest to gather eggs, and the reward is some kind of egg-related recipe.
These next asks deal with control over random-generated worlds (mainly through biomes.xml and rwgmixer.xml).
More control over city generation
Some examples of what I'd like to be able to do:
[*]Specify that cities should be generated next to large bodies of water (like they usually are in the real world)
[*]Cities over a certain size can spawn a "Chinatown" district, next to downtown, with the Asian-inspired custom POIs from compopack
[*]Cities can be "Las Vegas" or "tourist trap" types which include the "unusual" POIs from compopack, like the Sphinx
Specify which biomes can spawn next to other biomes
So, for example, deserts can't spawn next to snow biomes.
Lastly: Can anyone go into specifics about the POI editor? "POI Editor accessible in main menu" is in feature list, but I can't find any post where it is talked about.
Thanks very much, and apologies for the long post.
Hi, my name is Karl. I've been a lurker her for quite some time, but created an account so I could ask about this.
As background: I also play State of Decay, and I love the whole "community building" aspect of the game, but I dislike everything else. I would love it if I could make a mod that brought some of those NPC mechanics into 7D2D. Obviously that is not what TFP are after, and I do not expect them to implement this stuff themselves. But it would be nice if they would allow modders to do so, so kindred souls would have a game that satisfied both itches.
So, these questions are "asks" about what will be possible in A17 through modding the XML files. Most of this is inspired by Kinyajuu's posts about the new modding system (which looks awesome), so my guess is that he's the one to answer them. If they are not possible now, or on the A17 roadmap, then I'm happy to make these feature requests and move this to the "Pimp Dreams" section of the forum.
On to the asks:
Ability for CVars, skills, perks or buffs to hook into NPC AI
This is the most fundamental ask, and it would make most of the other asks possible. Examples of how this could be used:
- Rotten meat suit: wearing it grants a buff that makes players less likely to be sensed by zombies (think of that scene in TWD where they smother themselves in zombie guts)
- Killing White River NPCs makes bandits less likely to attack you, and White River NPCs more likely (and vice versa)
- At higher game levels, NPCs are more likely to run away from you than fight
- Weapons (e.g. blow darts) that "drug" animals (or other humans), so they temporarily ragdoll and/or don't attack
Variable alignment to factions
I would love it if it were possible to have some "degrees" of faction alignment. If faction alignment could be represented by a CVar instead, that would be OK with me.
Here are some examples of what modders could do with that:
- Bandit and White River NPCs become less likely to attack you if you have a higher alignment to their faction
- Custom trader NPCs grant "hidden stash" items to different factions, based on alignment level
- Traders only grant certain quests if you have a sufficient alignment level (e.g. "Go kill some bandits" won't activate if your alignment to "bandits" is high)
NPC vehicles (or NPCs riding in vehicles)
Mad Max here we come!
The ability for NPCs to be containers
So, friendly NPCs can carry stuff for you when your backpack has no more room.
The ability to mod in "permadeath," probably through onOtherKilledSelf, onBlockKilledSelf, onSelfKilledSelf
Examples of things I'd like to be able to do:
- Dying makes you lose all skills (but not XP/skill points), so you have to re-spec your character
- On death, you have to go through "character customization" screen again (this one is probably a lot to ask)
- Custom variables (faction alignment...?) are reset on death. This already seems possible with CVar Actions (if I understand it right).
Custom traders, with custom quests and rewards
For example, a "cooking" trader gives you a quest to gather eggs, and the reward is some kind of egg-related recipe.
These next asks deal with control over random-generated worlds (mainly through biomes.xml and rwgmixer.xml).
More control over city generation
Some examples of what I'd like to be able to do:
[*]Specify that cities should be generated next to large bodies of water (like they usually are in the real world)
[*]Cities over a certain size can spawn a "Chinatown" district, next to downtown, with the Asian-inspired custom POIs from compopack
[*]Cities can be "Las Vegas" or "tourist trap" types which include the "unusual" POIs from compopack, like the Sphinx
Specify which biomes can spawn next to other biomes
So, for example, deserts can't spawn next to snow biomes.
Lastly: Can anyone go into specifics about the POI editor? "POI Editor accessible in main menu" is in feature list, but I can't find any post where it is talked about.
Thanks very much, and apologies for the long post.
Guppycur
Well-known member
Problem is, if the ONLY threat we have is zombies and their ability to find you and reach you anywhere in the game, then that makes what was once a multi dimensional game into a one dimensional game, and that's a detriment to all, even if a select few can't understand that.
Pimps can always code zombies that always find and reach you, teleport to you, dig, fly, whatever, OR, they could include other threats that would add more depth and require varying styles of challenging gameplay, and I personally choose the latter (that's the 2nd one, to the reading challenged).
Digging zombies are the path of least resistance and are certainly the obvious solution to a particularly narrow minded way of thinking about zombie games, but I (and others) had high hopes THIS game would live up to its potential and be a true survival game, not JUST a zombie survival game.
Luckily, they're including the modability to do that, and for that, I am grateful.
Pimps can always code zombies that always find and reach you, teleport to you, dig, fly, whatever, OR, they could include other threats that would add more depth and require varying styles of challenging gameplay, and I personally choose the latter (that's the 2nd one, to the reading challenged).
Digging zombies are the path of least resistance and are certainly the obvious solution to a particularly narrow minded way of thinking about zombie games, but I (and others) had high hopes THIS game would live up to its potential and be a true survival game, not JUST a zombie survival game.
Luckily, they're including the modability to do that, and for that, I am grateful.
A game shouldn’t be that real though. It’s a game. The point of ANY game for me is to turn off real life for a while. If it’s just a grind for food, then why would I bother to play it? I can just do that in real life some more (work, eat, sleep, repeat).
A game should be able to capture your imagination. It should make you feel like you want to go loot that POI, like you want to change that wall and build an extra room for storage boxes, like you want to go outside and do something other than hide behind that reinforced wall and steel door until you actually have to go out and get food, just to sit back inside again once you’ve got enough for a few more days. There’s no fun in that.
SnowDog1942
Navezgane's Perv
I am so looking forward to digging zombies rather than gimmicky crap like air quality as some suggestions said. There would be 0 challenge to maintaining oxygen/air qual just busy work or an initial setup.
Just because sonething is the "path of least resistance" doesnt mean its not the most fun.
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We could discuss improved lighting if you want
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SnowDog1942
Navezgane's Perv
I think your key words there are "he's never even played a17"
Also, even if it is possible I dont plan to game them, I like the challenge that is intended. Just like how I currently dont use stilt bases above ground.
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Armstrrong
New member
I never whined about zombies. You're the only one who whines here.
Better read before replying someone with some crap.
I was just discussion this suggestion, and unlike you, Aldranon didn't say to go and play some crap.
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