PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[meganoth]

Most of the complaints about Z behavior are due to pathfinding. Things such as Z's spinning below the player, walking exactly on the voxel grid below them and failing to climb a single block causing them to carve paths through the floor. All of these are long-running complaints that have been going for years now.
It would have been far easier to sort Z AI first, release it to the public, and fix bugs in the rudimentary behavior before trying to add the complex decision making and teamwork required by bandits.

In most games the AI is probably a mess of exceptions-heavy complicated code acting on multiple abstraction levels. It follows that after reaching a barely acceptable functionality everyone will stop tinkering in it, because any small one-line change will need 3 rounds of bug-fixing with extensive test-runs until a new equlibrium is reached, if at all. Most changes have to be reversed though becaause the change literally does anything but the intended. :crushed:

So the AI code becomes the personal hell of everyone on the team. And everyone walks the halls in constant fear the head developer could assign him to work on that part.

This is not gloom! I did say "in most games", there's the loophole. :cocksure:

EDIT: @The Gronk: I see you stumbled upon this explanation too

 

[The Gronk]

In most games the AI is probably a mess of exceptions-heavy complicated code acting on multiple abstraction levels. It follows that after reaching a barely acceptable functionality everyone will stop tinkering in it, because any small one-line change will need 3 rounds of bug-fixing with extensive test-runs until a new equlibrium is reached, if at all. Most changes have to be reversed though becaause the change literally does anything but the intended. :crushed:
So the AI code becomes the personal hell of everyone on the team. And everyone walks the halls in constant fear the head developer could assign him to work on that part.

This is not gloom! I did say "in most games", there's the loophole. :cocksure:

EDIT: @The Gronk: I see you stumbled upon this explanation too

Another option is to plug an intern's brain directly into the server. They tend to complain about "invasion of privacy" and "human rights violations" but who cares? It's an intern

 

[Quantum Blue]

We're much more quiet for A17 because...
/data_dump

Wow. Are you married? (And, yep, I mean that in 27 different flavors.)

(Connotation 1 phrased differently - Thanks for the info/update!)

(And the Gazz ref to your avatar has no effect. Well, ok, maybe...)

 

[Utakubeta]

Modders aren't complaining.You guys may get the pre-built and glued-together LEGO castle. They are getting the box of LEGOS it was built from.

And I see Kinyajuu is still using this fake old profile picture.

GASP!!!

You mean he's not that young or handsome?!

I am totally crushed!

 

[unholyjoe]

They would if their voice over actors had known to do it. Maybe I’ll do a mixtape of my own voice overs bitching about this and that and send it in. If there’s one thing anyone can do without professional acting lessons it’s complaining...

so true look at Guppy..... oooops

 

[Utakubeta]

Another option is to plug an intern's brain directly into the server. They tend to complain about "invasion of privacy" and "human rights violations" but who cares? It's an intern

it's not like they're people

 

[meandog1000]

it's not like they're people

Of course they're not, they're robots manufactured for our use.

 

[Maharin]

so true look at Guppy..... oooops

Apparently I posted Guppy's picture in another thread recently...

 

[Maharin]

There is a running joke around TFP that I'm a brain in a vat. The profile picture is my human vessel prior to the extraction and jarring.
Yep sure am, been married for 3 years now to my wonderful wife Erin.

So... what does your wife think about the brain jarring? I assume she has control of the brain jar, but does she keep anything else of yours in a jar?

EDIT: And do the jars stack?

 

[Maharin]

Do you at least get to carry her girls with you everywhere? Even if you had to have a purse it might be worth it?

 

[Kalex]

That sounds like it opens the way for having Z's run indoors again. I really miss that mechanic, it terrified me

I hated that mechanic, it made no sense.

 

[tankedup_]

I hated that mechanic, it made no sense.

If i remember it correctly, zombies cant run during the day due to the heat (a bit weird since they walk in snow), and run during the night.

Indoor areas would usually be cooler, so they would be able to run as if it was night time.

 

[Maharin]

I'm wondering if you could make a zombie that only moves when you look away and stops when you look at it?

Like Boo in Mario: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boo_(character)

 

[Gazz]

I hated that mechanic, it made no sense.

It makes sense the other way around.

In the dark, zombies lurk and shamble around.

It's in the light where they get agitated.

 

[unholyjoe]

If i remember it correctly, zombies cant run during the day due to the heat (a bit weird since they walk in snow), and run during the night.Indoor areas would usually be cooler, so they would be able to run as if it was night time.

it was light that governed when they run... inside buildings that were boarded up, they would run after you if you entered their dark hiding spot.

it was hilarious when a group of us went in and suddenly everyone was running and screaming to get out as they attacked very ferociously.

if your group had torches you could make them walk and someone was responsible for shooting/killing them. i miss those days.

 

[The Gronk]

It makes sense the other way around.In the dark, zombies lurk and shamble around.

It's in the light where they get agitated.

If I remember correctly the heat was supposed to scramble their brains a bit, making them sluggish in direct sunlight. Given the area the game is set in I can sympathize, anything above 20 Celsius and my brain also fries.

 

[Kalex]

If i remember it correctly, zombies cant run during the day due to the heat (a bit weird since they walk in snow), and run during the night.Indoor areas would usually be cooler, so they would be able to run as if it was night time.

I don't think that mechanic exactly makes sense either. Especially considering there is little to no temperature differential between inside and outside a house in the game nor do they suddenly start to run when the temperature started to fall outside.

- - - Updated - - -

It makes sense the other way around.In the dark, zombies lurk and shamble around.

It's in the light where they get agitated.

This I sort of agree with, but that is not how the game is set up.

 

[unholyjoe]

well i am or was just in an a1.1 game and it is the dark and light that govern their run... sunlight torches on walls or where ever placed and electric lights that were on all slowed them down to walk and in the dark such as the dark buildings and night they ran. sorry i could only go back to a1.1 never found the 1 build.

oh, and heat was not a factor as i tested it at night and day and in the different biomes but if i am not correct back them we didnt have heat/temps any ways.

 

[The Gronk]

well i am or was just in an a1.1 game and it is the dark and light that govern their run... sunlight torches on walls or where ever placed and electric lights that were on all slowed them down to walk and in the dark such as the dark buildings and night they ran. sorry i could only go back to a1.1 never found the 1 build.
oh, and heat was not a factor as i tested it at night and day and in the different biomes but if i am not correct back them we didnt have heat/temps any ways.

Heat as in radiant energy from light, not the heat map used to trigger wandering hordes or the environmental buff used to cripple players.

 

[Gamida]

It makes sense the other way around.In the dark, zombies lurk and shamble around.

It's in the light where they get agitated.

This seems about right to me too. Zombies attack you in the daylight when they see you. At night you can stealth past them because they can't. Makes sense it is because they are dependent on their (somewhat feeble) eyesight so much as we are. Which is why we have the advantage when we have night vision goggles. They are attracted to torches and mining helmets which I rather think is for the light and not how much heat it gives off. So it sort of makes sense to me that they would come after you in light but not in darkness.

Yes, I know they can smell us but if smell was a huge factor they would detect us the same in night and day..no stealth at all would work. Would almost be like having a permanent horde night.

Plus I lean towards the classic zombie that doesn't run but just overwhelms with numbers.