PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[Xeen]

Yeah zombies sneaking up on you with absolute perfect stealth is broken and they know the footsteps sounds aren't working, I'm just trying to figure out if they did it on purpose or not.

The truth is I get a good jump scare out of it every time.

I asked for a more comprehensive sound control system and I was shot down directly by the devs on it, I think it may have even been MM himself and I think it's the wrong decision but he owns the studio/game and he can do what ever he wants regardless of the consequences.

 

[DaVegaNL]

I would like to hear something about the 'stealth-meter/bar' we see above our stamina & health bars. We've been seeing it for the past ~6 months in videos, but haven't heard anything about it.

 

[sillls]

One thing that bothered me about the latest video was when Madmole was swinging his club at that downed biker zombie. It would not make contact with it. Instead he was cutting the grass. He swung at least three times and each time he hit the grass. It was very annoying to watch.

 

[The Batman]

Q: - Would the devs ever consider slowing combat down?

 




AKA eliminate running and increased attack speed while hitting for regular zombies (Most important during horde nights)

I think right now speed is the most dangerous factor on horde nights. Having 12+ or more zombies speed hitting your walls, your brains or your lovely placed potatoes. Besides sniping barfing cops, what most players do is try to slow zombies down by using barbed wire / electric fences to remove the speed out of the equation. So that we have more time to kill, hug or commit seppuku in peace.

I feel if we could take away the speed, add in more complex mechanics / different AI, it would enable much more fun gameplay (opinion).

It 'could' allow for much less base repairs needed after horde night. Or make it easier to die during one due to new mechanics.

Now if you have adequate walls (countering zombie speed factor with time of the HP of walls) and enough shotgun shells combined with a run & gun mentality you are basically god. And every horde night ends the same. With 500 less bullets, empty first aid kits, damaged walls and a repair bill that outshines Americas healthcare ones.

What we could do with slower combat is:

- Add more randomness, like with the new feral versions of zombies already in game. (When not every zombie runs but when one does you'll be suprised)

- Add random special events that would require different tactics to survive.

- New zombie AI or mechanics would force players to build smarter instead of just -trap- trap - wall - wall - wall.

- Reward team play much much more than just 2 shotguns shooting instead of 1.

- Allow different classes to really shine on different occasions.

- Put more focus on surviving in general. Taking focus away from combat being 90% of the work (during horde nights). --> Increasing importance of farming / crafting / building / teamwork / exploring.

Batman,

 

[Jost Amman]

Remove/hide the hp bar!!

I agree with those who've said it's gamey.

A perception skill should be needed or something.

I foretell that the HP bar will become for A17 what the broken stealth was for A16.

So little needed to ruin a true gem... please fix that before A17 release!!

 

[Aldranon]

To add interest to A17 POI (now to be called Player Obliteration Implements).

In darkness, zombies make zero sound, they are nocturnal hunters. That would include anytime in the new POI's, yes they look pretty scary, but imagine if it was deathly quiet with at most a shuffle sound from them.

Except for screamers. Would anyone else jump right out of their skin hearing a screamer in a POI, cuz now, you surrounded!

Yup, you gonna die.

 

[CrazyCelt]

Let's talk about grass, and it's habit of getting in the way...

I would love to see the collisions for grass further refined for A17. Specifically, if grass could only be 'hit' by swinging an appropriate tool at it. For example:

* Using bare hands (fresh start) or the stone axe would yield the expected fibers, as normal. (A scythe or equivalent specialized tool would be great for clearing overgrown areas!)

* Using any other weapon or tool would simply 'ignore' grass objects, at all times.

Some benefits of this change would include:

* Greater combat immersion; Z's no longer 'missing' your face and taking out an offending clump of shin-high grass instead, or attempting to cripple or finish off a downed foe only to find that you've merely injured some weeds, and wasted your window of opportunity.

* Harvesting much higher-priority resources with high-grade tools would no longer waste precious time and durability when a pesky bit of greenery is near enough to sacrifice itself to spite you.

* No longer accidentally filling valuable backpack space with a few bits of fiber when it's the last thing you want to be carrying around.

 

[Aldranon]

Make grass only hit-able with your hand?

 

[sillls]

Make grass only hit-able with your hand?

That or with other tools that are not primary weapons.

Fore example: Things like a hoe or a stone ax would cut crass but a spiked club would pass right through it.

 

[Xeen]

The interesting thing about the forums in an early access game is that people have a lot of really good ideas.

Unfortunately there are only so many hours in a day, so many days in a year, so many coders, so much money for development, etc.

While I would enjoy seeing a lot of the really good ideas implemented it just can't all be done for one reason or another before the first version of the game is released and while it is unfortunate it is the reality of game development.

Equally as interesting there is a reason why there are expansion packs, all those really good ideas have a chance to be implemented later.

We have to trust that they are listening and doing what they can to bring us the richest most robust game they possibly can within the current design constraints.

I really enjoy this game and they haven't let me down yet and I don't think they are about to start any time soon.

I am looking forward to A17 and what ever they have planned for the game in the future because this game isn't just a job for them it is their passion project and they will do right by us because they know we love it too.

P.S. Keep in mind that as computers advance and the average computer is more powerful they can do more and they want to do more it's just that the vast majority of people who play this game don't have super high end gaming rigs and what a lot of us want just isn't possible with today's average computer and they aren't making this game for the elite they are making it for everyone.

 

[Crater Creator]

The Z health bar is hugely 'immersion breaking', and I hate it. Can't believe nobody else has thrown those words back at Joel so far.

Not once in 1257 pages? Wow! Thank goodness you're taking the lead on this one.

That health bar is extremely immersion breaking and VERY obtrusive.

Drat! Foiled again!

 

[Crater Creator]

To add interest to A17 POI (now to be called Player Obliteration Implements).
In darkness, zombies make zero sound, they are nocturnal hunters. That would include anytime in the new POI's, yes they look pretty scary, but imagine if it was deathly quiet with at most a shuffle sound from them.

Except for screamers. Would anyone else jump right out of their skin hearing a screamer in a POI, cuz now, you surrounded!

Yup, you gonna die.

I doubt they'd do this, simply because people complain so much about silent zombies now, when they only occur rarely.

 

[Rassilon]

The Z health bar is hugely 'immersion breaking', and I hate it. Can't believe nobody else has thrown those words back at Joel so far.

Posts like this are the reason we cant have nice things or more communication from the Devs. Why do you disrespect Madmole so much? While i do await A17 as much as everyone else, i have no doubt he works very Hard every day und i also doubt the HP Bar is the Decision of one alone.

Who the Hell knows if its gonna stay? who said you wont able to toggle it ?

Criticism is good, no doubt, but please bring it in a propper Manner because this was insulting.

 

[fragtzack]

Thanks for vid Madmole !

 

[archergod]

@Madmole, thanks for video and certainly thanks for giving expected date/desire date of yours. However, when we ask for video we expect little more content to be showoff. I certainly see zombie are little better, but not a good idea of their AI in here. And really the big thing you drop is in your forum post about "digging underground"

However I still think underground remain safe if you dig to bedrock, going 60m down won't be easy for them for sure.

 

[Gnomaana]

Yeah. That. Or you could just say that you think it wasn't a good idea of MM to mention a potential release date.

I guess I could say that but since that wasn't the point of my post I said what I wrote. The problem is NOT MM releasing tentative release dates. It is morons on the forums not knowing, or at least understanding, what tentative means.

 

[toores]

I wouldn't mind it being a perk within the Perception attribute. Don't buy the perk and you don't get to see the information. For me, it would be the perk of not buying the perk...

I'd much rather it be an option than a perk.

I'm probably not going to use it if given an option but I'm against making UI parts perks. Someone has to spend their points on UI elements while I'm spending them on something useful - doesn't make sense. If there was a UI element i thought I needed (...made sense to have), I'd like an option for it not a perk.

You could also disable the ammo information on the UI and make it a purchasable perk. Someone would love counting their shots and checking their backpack for total amount but an average gamer who is used to the feature would just find it annoying.

 

[WiiTee]

There's no way they'll keep the health bars for release... they have to be just for dev use...
...you can "see" zombies in the dark with them, making any scary moments entirely useless. The pimps know this, ergo, no hp bars in release.

/guppy logicing since 1971

Excuse me, you can turn Gamma up to 200% and remove any kind of Darkness. Your point & logic - Completely invalid and quite wrong. There's already a setting for this.

And I know of no players that don't crank it up to at least 150% so that they can see in the "Dark" (which isn't dark regardless of Gamma setting).

If you can't scan an area and spot a moving figure in the "Dark" even at 100% or less Gamma with or without an HP bar.. You legit need to:

A) Get a pair of glasses.

B) Have your eyes checked because something is seriously wrong in that case.

I can spot a Zombie miles away as low as 50% Gamma. So.. Pah-lease. Less excuses. I know change is scary but.. you will probably survive as humans have ever since... the dawn of our species.

 

[Gnomaana]

I vote we ban you now.... to the inside of a Kleenex box so you dont run out of tissues crying about what everyone else says. I expect my quote to be, "It's August, where is experimental".

Not sure where you get crying out of my post but whatever.

Fact is, other people constantly whining about everything thing wrong with a video when shown a "WORK IN PROGRESS" and everyone screaming when a release date gets pushed back is why we don't get as many videos and why we usually don't get even guesses for release dates. For god's sake there were dozens of posts complaining about keyboard noise on one of the first videos of MM's I ever watched. So your all's lack of understanding of what early access actually means and how the development process works is affecting my enjoyment of the forums. Given that fact I'll cry, whine, and female dog all I want. At least my crying would be about something that is actually true instead of my own lack of understanding of the processes involved.

 

[Darkfoxx117]

And I know of no players that don't crank it up to at least 150% so that they can see in the "Dark" (which isn't dark regardless of Gamma setting).

Well now you do because i do not crank the gamma up i play the game as intended.